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Everything posted by EricMontreal22

  1. That confused me. Wasn't Cyndi brought on to AMC as HIV poz? Agnes Nixon wasn't a big fan of terminal illness storylines but in her 1988 Museum of Broadcast seminars she mentions how she thought AIDS was just too important an issue and their goal was to tell a terminal illness storyline in a still somewhat hopeful way by focusing on acceptance, etc. But I swear even in the early 80s soaps were getting lauded for their brief nods to ecology related storylines which always makes me laugh... I mean the ecology of course is important, but I remain unconvinced that it makes for compelling soap opera storytelling.
  2. I guess Taggert really (with different other writers) has the most accumulated years writing for Loving--four or so? I find her late 80s stuff with King has good individual scenes but kinda dull stories--a lot of corporate world based stories which never seemed to be what Loving should be about. I agree that Babbin helped them create their strongest work. In a soap rag interview I found with her when she came on, she has a clear vision for the show--unfortunately she also says she has only agreed to join on as a "favour" (I assume to Nixon after their time at AMC?) and will ONLY be there for a year, which in soap terms isn't really all that long as you know... (Ironically though Fran Sears stayed on as EP after her for even less time, and I doubt the year commitment was one of her conditions) I forgot that Ceara interacted with them--well I mean I know she stayed at the Rescott's in that first AMC crossover in '91, but... That sounds fair--I probably hold Walsh's Loving to too high a standard because it's when I started to watch the show as a kid (I was an AMC nut and only became aware and started watching Loving with the 91 AMC crossover, and only started watching daily the following summer with the full on Carter Jones AMC/LOV crossover). It was 1986 wasn't it that the snake happened? I adore the fact that Agnes Nixon always maintained that was one of her all time favourite storylines I mean I've tracked down very little of it, but just due to the rep it has, etc, it kinda makes me happy that Agnes stands by it. I would love to know more details about why Granger and Walsh disagreed so strongly that Walsh broke her contract leaving the show without a headwriter for four or so months (and that woulda been just when the AMC Carter crossover was revving up *I think* if I have my dates right--I always wondered who wrote what for that--Agnes Nixon had just passed the official AMC headwriting reigns over to McTavish but she was still involved obviously in both soaps... I assume you're not at those episodes yet (and I may have the dates wrong...) Agreed about the parent/child stuff... Agnes Nixon probably had no interest in trying another gay storyline--while researching my MA essay about gays on her soaps I found a brief interview where she mentions how little story they were allowed to tell with the 1983 Lynn Carter lesbian storyline on AMC (and of course Agnes originally wanted it to be a gay male storyline but ABC said they already had a gay male on TV--Stephen on Dynasty) and finally realized it was just "too soon" to tell that story, so diving into a gay story on her new soap right around the same time probably felt useless. But it's not a bad idea. Early Loving certainly wanted to push the boundaries (and they could have tied it into the AIDS research story which really went nowhere even if it was even just groundbreaking to mention AIDS on a soap in 1983). I'm not saying Doug would have AIDS but... (And I see you just had the same thought lower down in your post LOL sorry I'm replying as I read...) Agreed there. I wonder if that was partly Marland's fault. The Donovans seem to want to fit into his Snyder prototype sorta boring lower middle class family slot that he's so attached to but I find kinda dull...
  3. I'm sure there is much more "embarrassing" footage from his career out there... Sigh. It is crazy how quickly most of the Donovans were written out...
  4. What was great to read though was all the transcribed conversation between Gordon, Sam and Gordon's secretary Joan--which gave you a sense of listening in on them. While you can tell there might be already some mixed feelings between Sam and Gordon, it also seems like grumpy Sam exaggerated his feelings for the lack of work and talent Gordon showed in his interviews much later for Llanview in the Afternoon--that's just a guess, but (or maybe he grew tired of Gordon later on). They also imply that Gordon hired Sam... And of course it's interesting to hear Agnes' role--that she will consult if they need her and she's *required* to consult if ratings are in trouble--one such rating slip seemingly leading to her suggesting that they kill Victor off. Also this seems to prove that Wiki is (what's new?) wrong and Doris Quinlan was EP at the show at the time (I know she also worked in that capacity at AMC with some overlap there--I think with Agnes and Bud Kloss playing much of that role at AMC).
  5. I mean I assume Ron would have had access to the ABC archives which go back to 1978? (77?) with a few earlier episodes and MAYBE they made him copies but even so, I bet it's more just key episodes from his time at the show. Isn't it bizarre?! This was for a PHD it seems, not just a MA paper. He goes from very jargon filled pages and pages about methodology, etc, and then weird stream of conscious narration about his experience. Still, it's pretty amazing that apparently he traveled to New York and was granted access to the writers for an entire week. It does list the readers and it was signed off and stored at the school so I assume he did complete his studies, though... But yeah, you're not kidding about padding--I mean is there any reason he has to say that attendance in the last class was low, or he was also going to spend some time visiting his family, what the lighting was like, how "fine" his stereo back at home is, etc? (Funny as I've been writing my MA paper on soaps--and grant you it is much much shorter with a requirement of under 10,000 words which came to about 35 pages, the emphasis with each submission has all been about editing as much as possible).
  6. While writing my MA essay on Agnes Nixon and gay storylines in soaps, I came across this--has this been discussed and I missed it? A VERY analytical dissertation on OLTL from the mid 1970s but it has fascinating stuff--script excerpts, a hint that Sam Hall and Gordon Russell did not get along (*shock* ), confirmation that Agnes Nixon basically suggested the death of Victor Lord story, etc... https://etd.ohiolink.edu/pg_10?105547168403::NO:10:P10_ETD_SUBID:132868#abstract-files (scroll down to the download links)
  7. Are these episodes on YT? I only vaguely started watching then. Man it still amazes me all the turnaround Loving had despite staying under (to some degree) Agnes Nixon's control.
  8. In soap trivia books (which often get details wrong) AMC's honeymoon in St Croix is listed as the first international location shoot (apparently the show was so popular there that they aired in prime time). (Although technically St Croix is a constituent district of the US...) It seems like it was a particularly popular tourist place for Americans around that time--you don't hear about it nearly as much now...
  9. I completely agree--I think McT (during that era anyway) and Broderick would have balanced each other out well. And yeah--it got very one note and bleak.
  10. It started to fall apart near the end of McTavish's run at that time--so many doubles, got very dark and violent, etc--which was why FMBehr fired her, but I still strongly agree.
  11. Thanks--having a great time reading this especially the critical reviews!
  12. I actually think the first half of the 90s were very strong--especially since the end of the 80s were largely a mess due to the long 1988 writer's strike. ABC for example was very strong from 91-97 or so for all their soaps creatively.
  13. Interesting. I'd take exception to Passions merely because it was always bottom rated--in theory anyway I'd think the greatest soap would have to at least get decent numbers....
  14. I attended a conversation with Maupin a bit back where he hinted at some of this casting (well he told us one bit outright and then said we better not repeat it since it wasn't official yet...) but I'm really pleased with everything I've heard about the miniseries so far. And I'm thrilled that Paul Gross is back as Brian--one of several recasts for the later season where I didn't much like the new actor (I know Gross was busy with his TV work at the time) Story wise it sounds like it picks up with the 8th book, Mary Ann in Autumn which age wise makes complete sense and casting a young Anna makes me think it'll also use elements from the 9th, final book, The Days of Anna Madrigal which is largely a flashback to her childhood, but I know we're meant to get new stories, etc, along with these. Maupin isn't writing any of the scripts (which is fine by me--Richard Kramer did the first series script which was great--Maupin did the not as successful later adaptations) but he is mapping out the new storylines and is fully on board. It's too bad this means we'll miss some of the bits I liked best in the 4-6 books (I assume some of the Michael Tolliver stuff will be incorporated from the 6th book which is, unlike the soap structure of the others, all his story), but they would have had to have recast all the roles realistically (Maupin did write a script for the fourth book, Babycakes, which was briefly in development at Showtime 15 years back).
  15. Yeah, Malone didn't seem to fight for it too much to be honest--or at least he was resigned to the issues at the time. In interviews I found from the time he admits how pleasantly surprised they were at how much audiences like Billy--saying originally the focus was gonna be on Andrew. He's quoted in a Michael Logan article on Daytime Taboos from Sep 1993 saying that "it's one thing to do a story abou t homophobia but it's quite another to explore the life of a gay character or couple a life that includes sex and such problems such as gay adoption. I doubt that day will ever come. :
  16. Titan, I think you're spot on. An example being ABC dumping Broderick, Corley and her team from AMC who had solid but stagnant ratings (numbers that given all the variables you gave, they should have been happy with) only to see the ratings drop even more when replaced McTavish's pointedly much more sensationalist (JER inspired) writing. Nixon, Bell and the other greats have always said that the shows are in danger when start trying to do what another show is doing. The drop with soaps happened first of course--I think one big reason simply that fewer and fewer people (ie housewives ) were home in the day) but it's true that it's been something that's been steadily seen across the board with network tv. And certainly, I follow quite a few TV shows--prob 6 primetime shows a week at a time (it helps now with shorter seasons and the fact that cable and streaming services stagger their releases throughout the year). At any given time that usually means maybe 2 are US network shows (unless you count PBS and I'm following something on Masterpiece or whatever, but I digress...)
  17. SOunds right. Interestingly the same article said that even if they were brave enough (their words) to keep Billy on, it would have to be recast because Ryan had just booked the NBC primetime "soap miniseries" The Secrets of Lake Success which they hoped would be successful enough to be a series (I'd never heard of it--though I see it's on DVD so I guess it wasn't.) Variety's review starts off: When the Atkins family patriarch dies, the town of Lake Success is inundated with more gold diggers than a Dean Martin roast. Resultant fast-paced soaper may be -- however inadvertently -- the funniest series on primetime TV, with florid acting and script on a campy level that makes "Dallas" look like "King Lear." Pity it's only scheduled for three two-hour installments, concluding Oct. 15.
  18. I'm not sure and though I was watching, I don't remember and YT is little help. When would the bachelor party have been? I found the mention of his one off appearance for AIDS day (when all the soaps in 1993 agreed to do something for that day--June 21) in an essay on the storyline.
  19. WHich was basically the end of the story (I think they had a bit more with Billy and Ricky his bf, etc but then it faded away--his dad never even "came around"--I found one interview that said Malone had a story with them going on a double date with Joey and a girl but for whatever reason it never happened) Thanks!
  20. A question as to dates that I need for my grad paper and can't nail down--does anyone have the dates, even months, that the homophobia storyline played out on OLTL? Even just down to appearances by Billy Douglas. I know it was over several months during the Summer of 1992 (and that Billy showed up once more the following year for AIDS day *rolls eyes*)
  21. I wonder why that was? Disney bought ABC in 96 I think, but it may have taken them a few years to restructure it, which could play a part there. The OJ trial was... 94, right?
  22. I'd love a thread like that. WHile depressing, it's the kind of soap stuff I could discuss all day lol I know at ABC the end of an era seems rather dramatically to have been 1997 for me. OLTL became a *mess* around then, AMC rehired McTavish basically at the start of 98 for her messy return, The City (hey I thought the last half of it was good) was canceled and ABC gave up on trying new things for soaps and replaced it with the safer and cheaper PC, GH started to really become mob heavy...
  23. Lucci was recognizable before all the Emmy stuff though--things like her ridiculous 1970s wine commercials, etc--she was sought out in the way not that many soap stars were already. I think I agree with you that Frons did the most damage to AMC (as many have pointed out what happened to OLTL during his run seemed mostly not to be his doing--though who truly knows--since the soap never seemed to interest him. He saw GH as a daytime Sopranos, AMC as a daytime Sex and the City--among other things--but...) I actually liked some of McTavish's last tenure, at least at first--it certainly was better than the brief Rayfield stuff when AMC seemed like a Disney channel show or *something* and had no sense of identity or anything. But... One reason you don't mention too is I think AMC up to that point (2002 or so) had maintained a stronger sense of a consistent identity than GH or OLTL which went through many more distinct "phases" of what the show seemed to be about. And that's even admitting the rough patches we got before Frons. Part of that was of course due to Nixon (I recently read an interesting article by her son-in-law who spoke about his time writing dialogue for AMC and he stated that when she left her final stint as co-HW in 2001 and basically retired, ABC quickly fired the writers, including him, who she had hired... although she did still go to monthly or bi monthly story meetings to offer her input--at least until it was Pratt who officially had her barred from them...)
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