Vee

I think it may have been Benard, Guza, Frons or some combination. Either way they iced him. I think Lorenzo started out very strong and then they turned him deliberately into the goat for emasculating story, like Jax or Nikolas. I always thought LW and TK had very hot chemistry on Loving/TC. I think the Sarah of today could play off of him well (and still bring the true, raw Carly into the mix, and fuse both sides together organically). Back then, no.

I honestly think someone made it clear Ted King/Lorenzo could not and would not be given frontburner story again, and that's why LW ended up with Jax. I think they were that threatened by what went down with him and TB's Carly in 2003-2004. Putting Wright and King back together seemed so obvious with her a major, popular daytime star and yet they didn't dare, even though the characters were still married when she joined the show. They're lucky Laura and Ingo had real chemistry and fans went for it. It was the first and only time Ingo had a real role on the canvas again, as the man who put her and her children first, and as I've said before I don't think it would've ever worked with any other Carly; the others were too raw for him IMO. I'll always feel Carly made a huge mistake losing Jax, who gave her a real home, and that's ironic for me because the idea of pairing Sarah or Tamara with Jax back in the day always grossed me out. But we've had this conversation.

Print ads have always been huge for soaps, though. The key is doing print ads for couples and stories that already work and already have the audience, or for introducing a new story or lead (as was often done in the '80s). Not oversaturating it for prefabricated couples no one wants. It was so blatant I couldn't believe it, and then I spent the next decade-plus having Sam stans insist to me she was never a Brenda stand-in. Please.

Guza had no investment in Jax when he returned. Ingo returning was a network move that happened while Guza was away and something they clearly had no idea what to do with, especially once Guza was back in the big chair. IIRC that was the period when they randomly told the magazines the oft-single Jax was casually frequenting hookers for leisure post-Brenda's exit in '03. He had nothing to do for a long while, and they only foisted him off on Courtney because Guza also hated Courtney, forced on him by Brian Frons, and had finally found the opening to downgrade her character with the arrival of Kelly Monaco. Same thing happened with Nikolas later on; Guza had tired of TC/Nikolas quickly, and made him the heavy and heel in multiple stories. Nik and Courtney was a pairing of heels designed to wreck and marginalize them both, nothing more (whether or not TC and ALW were involved IRL as rumored didn't matter, because it still served Guza's ends and disinterest in both of them). Guza tired of former faves (Nikolas, Alexis, etc) often and could be really vindictive. Jax had had his moment in the sun for BG in the late '90s, but it was past. As for Sam, I don't think Jax/Sam was ever something the show took seriously. The network maybe, looking for an available hunk to pair KM with, but GH hadn't been invested in Jax at all for several years up til that point. He was always going to be a stopover one way or another. I do think they actually could've worked well together if they'd kept to the original concept of Sam the treasure hunting adventurer, in lighter fare - harkening back to GH's '80s roots - but they didn't.

IIRC, Guza was into V.; Riche was not. There were a lot of conflicts around that time.

The only thing I remember about Titans is crushing on Kevin Zegers.

It's there. That's right about the arms dealer. So when they did bring on Alcazar in '02, I remember being very impressed with the show bc I had remembered the details of that cameo very clearly re: an arms dealer/powerful man Brenda was with. Many shows tend to shrug that kind of detail off when exiting stars either leave, are hinted to return, etc. (I'm not sure if GL ever explained how Josh saw Reva on a tourist video, for example)

The idea of NBC/Sony hiring Eileen and pushing for Drake with a younger woman wouldn't surprise me at all. But I do think they did work well together at the time, even if I felt the Tony story was so stupid (and a waste of Thaao Penghlis, who would continue to be squandered for years to come until they finally brought back the real, more benevolent Tony). I wonder how much was plotted out with Isabella still in the mix - all the way to the boardroom scenes? I wonder basically a) when they decided to do the affair vs. leaving John with Isabella and Marlena with Roman (assuming that was originally the intent when Dee and Wayne returned) and b) when they decided John and Marlena was the endgame. I don't know if Dee, Drake, etc. have ever spoken on how the storyline and BTS machinations evolved. I always assumed it was a done deal as soon as they fucked at Titan, and I'd forgotten that was around when Eileen first came in. Knowing JER he may have just been lying in wait on the long game for the couple even then.

I never heard that but lately it wouldn't surprise me. I remember that well. I could swear "Mr. Alcazar" was even mentioned at the time but I may be way off.

I've said it before, but I always liked Chloe despite everyone (myself included) wanting Jax and Alexis at that time. Tava Smiley had a lot of grace and warmth. I even liked the abortive Stefan pairing. Chloe deserved better. I thought the mixed marrieds story was a reasonable success at the time. People were talking. The problem was they didn't follow through on the major value, which was Jax and Alexis, which Guza wanted and Riche didn't. So that was part of the era Guza was invested in Jax. By the time he returned I don't think he cared at all.

Probably, yes. If they did it now I wouldn't blink tbh.

I remember finding the whole Tony plotline tedious and strange, yeah. I don't think JER was wrong either. I do think they could've done right by Roman though, and didn't. Even if he was a mandate (from Deidre, I believe) he was an asset to the show. I wouldn't be surprised at all.

I wonder. I always assumed they'd committed to Dee and Drake as endgame as early as the Titan boardroom because they realized the chemistry was too much to deny, and that's why they threw over poor Northrop. I remember liking Kristen even before she was nuts and liking them together, but she may well have been unpopular as a heroine - I was too young to take stock.

I haven't watched the story since it first aired but I remember thinking they were very committed to John and Kristen for awhile (and I felt they worked). I do wonder how Kristen was first conceived when she was a heroine for a long stretch, and when they decided to take the turn, or if she was always intended as a spoiler for an eventual John/Marlena reunion. I don't know when they decided John and Marlena were endgame, I'm sure others know.

Agreed on that one, which is a surprise given those kind of iconic characters get diminishing returns on a second or third recast, especially back then. I remember an ancient, apocryphal story that Karen Lynn Gorney (Tara, AMC) tried to audition for the Nicole recast of all characters and was laughed out of the room.

That one I don't know about, lol

I'd be very careful with sharing the link to randos around here. There's been a lot of troll kabuki theater going on with one or two deeply bored, deeply troubled people and multiple identities in the last few years.

I didn't realize Farley Granger did this arc. It's interesting seeing him acquit himself very well here and on ATWT years after Erika Slezak and co. said he quit OLTL because he couldn't handle the daytime grind. (There was another scandalous rumor about Granger and OLTL years ago but I have no reason to doubt Slezak) I remembered the dramatic recitation Nola did at the party for the film, but not Granger being a part of it. (I think Nola does a few more staged performances in this story, but I honestly can't remember? I may be conflating this) I definitely didn't remember NuNicole's very creepy vision? sighting? of a red-garbed howling figure in the night on the balcony. That's spooky as hell.

Finally digging into Mansion of the Damned in time for Halloween. I've made attempts before, going all the way back to the days of WOST, but gotten sidetracked each time. Ann Williams is as great as I remember her being in material from SFT and Loving; somehow I'd forgotten she played Margo Dorn though I've seen many eps from this period in the distant past. I love her as an actress and I was stupidly going to say I think it's a shame she never got a permanent perch at another soap in the late '80s and '90s and forward, but then I remembered she died soon after Loving. What a huge loss to the genre, and rarely remembered today. I really can't be bothered with either Draper or April atm, and I remember I used to like April more than this. Frances Fisher is still so good. Kim Hunter, of course, is Kim Hunter. It is weird seeing Joel Crothers as Miles in a mature role for the younger couple with what should be the equally mature Nicole, but instead it's the NuNicole - as others have mentioned, the age shift was so severe. I've never seen Maeve McGuire with Crothers but I imagine they would be great together. It's so tragic about Joel, who I grew up watching on Dark Shadows in syndication on the Sci-Fi Channel long before I realized he grew into such a sexy daddy. Ann Flood remains luminous. I always liked her.

There's an old, extremely apocryphal anecdote where RC allegedly told one of the Black performers at OLTL he didn't know how to write for Black people. I doubted that story was true, but he never gave them much at either ABC show. I have to believe the current initiative with the Black cast is in part due to his infatuation with Jackee as '80s TV royalty.

Don't feed the troll. Block and ignore.

I wonder if we'll finally get resolution on Sarah Jane - and gay Luke Smith onscreen, something RTD made a point to canonize last year in the little farewell special. RTD was absolutely ahead of his time with franchising out Who. I couldn't fault Moffat from moving away from it and making the Doctor darker and more mysterious again, and I prefer his regime artistically overall, but in the post-Marvel, post-streaming era there is no doubt RTD's expansive vision for the franchise is the future. The rumor mill is already predictably chugging suggesting Tennant, Piper, Tate, Smith and Jenna Coleman will all return for the 60th, but that's typical rumor stuff. Capaldi has recently said he likely wouldn't return as he feels multi-Doctor stories are poor quality, but he's also a huge fan of the show so who knows.

I've liked Rob Wilson since AMC 2.0 but Ben is a literal serial killer. There's no getting around that or shrugging it off, any more than we can casually shrug off soap rapists in 2021. That's done too. But Ben killed multiple people. They have had a million chances to blame Ben's killings on literally anyone else, and this is a show where Marlena was brainwashed to think she'd murdered half the town. But they don't do it because Ron Carlivati is arrogant and believes the audience will accept anything just like he tried to force them to accept Franco the rapist serial killer on GH, just like he tried to force them to accept a rapist bedding his amnesiac victim on OLTL. They could redeem and retcon Ben at any moment but they don't, and until they do no one is going to forget.

I think they knew they couldn't control or intimidate Joan Collins, and that's why they pushed her out/let her walk. To me Joan looked at ease in the role and like she was having a ball. Yes, she was definitely doing "Joan Collins," but she'd made that image and character an industry unto itself for decades. And frankly, virtually every soap opera grande dame in the modern era has some piece of the Alexis/Joan Collins DNA, Alexandra Spaulding included (and while Beverlee McKinsey's soap fame pre-dates Joan's resurgence in the business on Dynasty, the two women did rise again in the '80s around the same time). So Joan doing "Joan" as Alex wasn't terribly far removed from Alex to begin with. The recast worked. No one could ever outdo Beverlee McKinsey, so the only thing that could match her in stature, however different the energy, was someone like Joan Collins. Marj Dusay, bless her, never could.

Which is why the spinoff world RTD created was, IMO, more productive and viable. It was only after he left they went tits-up (and then there's Miracle Day, oof).