Star Trek: Picard

[Vee]

Spoiler pix appear to have begun leaking from the final two eps. So far it's nothing many of us have not speculated about, but I'm very excited.

Although: If I'm right about who I just saw in one of those pix I peeked at, there's one surprise I did not expect. I won't say who/what I am pretty sure it is except to say

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Edited April 12, 2023 by Vee

[janea4old]

I didn't enjoy Amanda Plumber as Vadic.  At all.  I despised the character. I just don't like "big bad evil" characters in general.  I don't like horror/paranoia stuff at all.  I could have understood it for a maximum of two episodes, but that's all.  She seemed like an extremely overdramatic distortion of Shakespeare.  A cartoon character.    I didn't like Faison on GH and this felt like that, a character who never should have dominated.

The Vadic stuff has ruined this season for me.  Just awful.

In a year or two, I might rewatch this season while fastforwarding through the Vadic stuff.

The only think I liked about the Vadic stuff was the scenes in one episode where she explained about the experimentation. That felt like classic Trek, in that the crew came to understand what really happened, and felt regret. 
But I could do without all the rest of the Vadic stuff.

I didn't expect to see R.  I didn't even think it was MF at first.  I had to go to IMDB to see who was playing R.  The character didn't have the playful sparkle I remembered.  At the end of R.'s scenes it finally felt like it was really them, and I felt them come through  - and of course the years of  service, and the weight of responsibility of knowing about Starfleet being compromised, and then it made sense - and the sacrifice was indeed a good way to give closure to the character and felt like real Trek!

Re: R.... The prior (years-ago) emotional intimate connection some of you referenced upthread, I never saw that when R. first aired years ago, so I was surprised to read your spoiler posts referencing that -  to me, the past thing was just the depth of humanoid connection but I never saw any hint of romantic feeling.

What I really enjoyed:  the scenes in episode 8 with

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That was well done and felt like Trek.

Edited April 12, 2023 by janea4old

[Vee]

Exactly like her father's character in Star Trek VI.

[janea4old]

 

I don't remember much about that movie. Had to look it up. Yeah I remember Kirk and Spock being stranded on a frozen place, but I don't remember much else.

I know Christopher Plummer only from The Sound of Music.  (I know he's famous but I thought that was the only thing I've ever seen him in).  Didn't realize he'd played a Klingon.

On a related note ...
On TNG, when Picard was talking about Moby Dick, the scenes where his Shakespearean actor training shown through but with *realness*, and not over-the-top.  The way he talked about the white whale and some Borg stuff, I don't even remember the context of what that was about.  I just remember the energy of it.  It was scenes of a man driven to chasing something and trying to let go. Or something like that.

I felt like Amanda Plummer's scenes worked when she did them like Picard/Ahab stuff, but most of the time, she was too over-the-top and annoying (to me).

[janea4old]

Earlier in the season when Riker kept saying to Picard "isn't it obvious" meaning isn't it obvious that Jack is Picard's son, due to Jack's mannerisms etc. ...
I mean it was obvious the show was setting Jack up to be Jean-Luc's son but ...

I had to laugh because at the beginning of the season Jack didn't feel like a young Jean-Luc Picard to me - at all.   Jack's energy felt much more like a young Kirk.   His bravado reminded me more of William Shatner than Patrick Stewart.  He's like young Kirk with an English accent, LOL.    Now I can see a *little* of Jean-Luc in him, but still very little.   If this was a different era, I'd totally buy him as Kirk's son.  Or young Kirk in an alternate universe.   No matter how much Riker kept insisting he was obviously Jean-Luc's son, I didn't buy it except that it was obvious the *show* was setting it up that way.

[Vee]

Young Picard was also a rash daredevil. That's how he ended up with an artificial heart at a young age, stabbed in a barfight. There's a couple TNG episodes devoted to his exploits. That's why they draw that parallel.

Edited April 13, 2023 by Vee

[janea4old]

I remember the one episode where the *other* doctor (Pulaski) performed heart surgery where this was remembered in a flashback.  I just don't think of Picard that way in general.

However, Picard had some fun bravado in scenes with Vash, which I really loved.  I think Jack has some of *that* Picard in him.    Or when Picard went undercover as a mercenary stealing archaeological things - that Picard.

Edited April 13, 2023 by janea4old

[Vee]

A wonderful penultimate episode that has me gagging for next week.

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I forgot to mention: How wonderful to hear

as the computer one last time.

Edited April 13, 2023 by Vee

[janea4old]

yes that was credited in the closing credits.

 

 

Yes he did!

 

 

Yes, indeed. I liked that they left the rank of the person being spoken to the same, instead of artificially altering that voice's words.

Edited April 13, 2023 by janea4old

[Vee]

True, though in-story I think that had to do with the computer records on that non-networked ship not being updated since the original run.

[janea4old]

yes of course but I liked that such a situation allowed the voice to be unaltered.

Edited April 13, 2023 by janea4old

[AdelaideCate007]

So this episode, like the last episode, had some incredible highs and a few real lows.

First off with the positive- the last 15 minutes were electric. From the voice, to the set, to the whole vibe. I was a mess. I thought the cameo was fantastic and the exact kind of callback this show should be doing instead of a parade of VOY/DS9 main characters like some people have been wishing for. I thought 

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I called the villain last week 

Overall, barring some horrible story collapse next episode and them all dying (I don't really see any of them dying now), I'm very satisfied with what we've got. Seeing them all together has been a gift and I like that the show seems to be setting them up to be in a hopeful place. I assume we'll see cameos here and there from them on places like Lower Decks and if they continue on with the 25th century, but I think this is it for them as a group. If so, I'm happy with what we've gotten.

Now the bad. I've been noticing this coming up more and more in places and people calling it out and I have to agree- what's up with the weirdness about them almost retconning out Riker and Deanna's daughter. If Riker hadn't mentioned her for a second those time times, I'd assume she didn't exist anymore. It's especially glaring when they've spent the previous eight episodes going on and on about their dead son. I've seen people guessing they didn't want to focus on her too much because it didn't fit with the vibe they set up this season that they've been severely depressed over the son all these years (again, hate that they ruined the season 1 episode about that but alas) and the daughter kind of ruins that. However, this is the second or third time this season they've felt like they were close to death and...crickets from either of them. It's a bad look overall. Terry Matalas giving interviews saying they cut out a line from the last episode about her joining Starfleet makes it even worse because you'd think they'd be worried about but again, nothing. Plus Riker said he left to come with Picard earlier this season so he could give her and Deanna space. If she was away in Starfleet, then she's already getting space from him. I'm not saying we needed to see her in person but more concrete mention would have been nice but instead it looks like Riker and Deanna can't be bothered.

Second, I have my doubts they can wrap up this Borg stuff in a way that doesn't feel rushed but I'll be happy to be surprised.

Also, if the stuff with Riker last week is really the highlight of Deanna's material this season, then I can't help but side with Marina on being disappointed with how it all shook out for her this season. Where was she when all of them were gathering to discuss Jack or during any of that? She's the one that realised what was up and then she's just gone till it's time to leave on the shuttle? It's very odd. Hoping though her and the rest all get a great send off next week and that they keep the momentum from the ending and stick the landing.

[Vee]

I get what you'e saying, but I think they're just juggling everyone in the runtime they have. There's only so much for the entire OG cast to all do week to week and they gave Deanna a lot in the opening act, and they had a lot to force into their 45-50 mins or whatever. I do hope she gets a little more before the end too. They've also mentioned Kestra at least 3-4 times this season. That was enough for me. I don't think they're retconning her out or ignoring it.

That said, why they can't get an extra 5-10 mins on these eps from Paramount in order to be able to do things like squeeze in a line about Kestra when the whole Borg assimilation wave happened, I don't know. Discovery regularly runs over an hour in big finales when it wants to. I really hope the finale here is at least 60 mins and I am annoyed that P+ seems to heavily enforce keeping normal episodes to 45-50 mins tops. This is a CBS mentality.

Edited April 14, 2023 by Vee

[janea4old]

In general, I don't like the idea of a "big bad" for Star Trek. 
And specifically this big bad feels tired.  Too much emphasis on lots of warships and scary stuff.
I prefer Gene Roddenberry transformational arcs. Not horror movie stuff. Not smash-em-up battles.

I want to be left with a sense of joy and wonder and hope.

Edited April 14, 2023 by janea4old

[AdelaideCate007]

@Vee Reading it back, my post came off as way harsher than I intended, cause we agree basically and I hear you! There's only so much they can do. Obviously I wish, and I think most people do, that they all get a little more but I think they've all been used about the best they can. It's a lot of people to run through and get stuff done for. I have high hopes for the finale since they all seem excited about it. I thought the scenes with her and Jack this episode were great as well. I've gotten extremely tired of Data recently, but I've thought his scenes the past two episodes where excellent as well. It's hard to complain when what they are getting in the time allowed is overall extremely good.

That kind of why I'm wary of any big VOY/DS9 cameos outside of Janeway hopefully and Tuvok again at this point. The time for that was earlier in the season and anybody like that in the finale would just by a drive by and taking away from the TNG cast. Like sure it'd be nice to see people like Kira (just to throw out a name I see a lot of people clamouring for), but I'd rather they have something good for her in another show than her showing to say "hey guys!" for five minutes in the middle of a battle. I know other wanted more big names, but I've been happy the cameos so far have been very TNG centric or related back to Seven.

As for Kestra, she was just fresh on my mind cause I've seen so much complaining about it today in other places. I wasn't expecting to see her or get a 15 minute info dump, but it was just a little odd to me that they didn't seem more concerned. It's just kind of in the same weird area like Raffi & Seven's romance, people wanting Worf to mention Dax and Alexander (lol), Laris, and whatever else. It's like you said, I don't know why were not getting five or ten minutes add somewhere where they could have added this stuff into the conversation instead of people then freaking out on twitter and them having to come up with answers in interviews. Tossing just a line or two more in some of these scenes could have solved a lot of these issues, even though they're obviously super minor in the scheme of things. People could also be jumping to conclusions ahead of time cause who knows what happens in the finale. It is super odd how short some of these have been considering the other shows go to an hour on the regular.

I do think though overall this has been a fantastic season and I applaud what they've done. Like I said, if this is it, then I'm happy with the send off and what they pulled off. Stuff like the Riker and Deanna scenes, the Picard and Crusher stuff, Data and Lore combing, Ro, and the last 15 minutes of the last episode made this all worth it to me.

Edited April 14, 2023 by AdelaideCate007