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[JackPeyton]

The last time we saw him he opened gunfire in a room full of his family and former friends, i fail to see how having his absentee mother maybe be around for a few years after again returning from the dead would make him any less of what he is.

and just because its often done doesnt mean it should be done.

[jfung79]

You can have your opinion, and I can disagree. I think the 5-year gap lends itself very well to any number of things. Even amnesia and reversion to a younger mental self would be believable and realistic after a coma. Jason Quartermaine went from social activist to mobster after his episode of brain damage.

The more I think about it, the more I am hoping the reason the show has JR in a coma is because they *want* to do a personality reset. JR as he was wasn't just unrootable, he was out of story. Suicidal or homicidal character, what more story is there in that?

[JackPeyton]

That just sounds like lazy writing.

They wanna make a light JR? Sure, fine then take us on the journey. Dont say it happened during a 5 year gap.

And please, no amnesia, reverting to former selfs, etc soap opera weak writing bullshit. Thats the reason they are rightfully mocked. Its just dont as cheap plot points by bad writers.

[jfung79]

Right, so they should have kept as much of their old cast as they could and brought back Asher and Madison, I totally agree.

Show us the journey, don't just bring in your older Petey.

But I think they *can* show the journey with Van Hansis, or anyone else, in the role, to a more hopeful, idealistic JR, if that's what they choose to do. A mother's love can never be underestimated. I am glad you now seem to agree they can take JR on a journey over time, and that he doesn't have to remain stuck in the later Jacob Young era interpretation.

[Vee]

Oh, Jesus. Asher and Madison were watchable, but essential? No.

[jfung79]

My point was the 5-year gap shouldn't be only allowed and conveniently used for some things, and ignored in its implications for others.

[Eric83]

They were irrelevant in the grand scheme of things, it's not impossible to believe that those characters left town within those 5 years

[jfung79]

I agree.

My point is, if you're jumping forward 5 years to explain characters leaving, why can't JR be different after having gone into a coma for 5 years (the coma is rumored)? Why is it fine in one instance and sloppy soap writing in another?

Or if JR has not been in a coma, why can't Dixie being there for him solidly for 5 years have changed him to be more idealistic and optimistic again -- character traits he once had? It makes less sense that JR would be exactly the same after 5 years with his mother back, than that there would be changes.

[JackPeyton]

No, not at all.

It is 100% and totally believable that people like Asher and Madison who were in pinevalley for all of eight minutes would move away in five minutes. Those characters are far from importance and their not being in town is not the same as regressing a character to something that they havent been in years just because, esp when their going so dark was done over time and believable. An absentee, always returning from the dead mothers sudden love and devotion is arguably more likely to send him into an even darker place, imho. but even if not, thats fine, but use that as the story. dont say it happened and we dont need to see it and just accept it. that is shitty plot point writing.

[jfung79]

Once you accept that 5 years has passed, it becomes unrealistic to act as if the characters have all not changed. It becomes shitty writing to treat JR as exactly the same rather than to try extrapolating changes.

The 5 years are a plot point but once you accept it, you have to follow through, not pick and choose.

It may be okay to rationalize that Asher and Madison could have left in 5 minutes so really 5 minutes have passed, not 5 years -- but then, where did the radcially aged and different AJ, Miranda, and Petey come from? Why is SORAS okay, but JR tapping into something that is core to his character -- the conflict between the "Adam" side and the "Dixie" side, with the "Dixie" side showing more now that Dixie is back -- sloppy writing?

Anyway I'm pretty sure the show isn't going to reset JR as much I would be okay with them doing. The audition piece had JR talking about Adam in the same cynical manner. If they make JR less weighted down by the world, they will show much ofthe journey you want.

The only point I was trying to make was just that differences that another actor (such as Van Hansis, not that I think they will cast him) and new writers might bring to JR, including tapping into more compassion or optimism, would be justifiable, not "bullshit."

[JackPeyton]

its not picking and choosing, madison and asher are irrelevant, who jr became for many, many years after a lifetime of going through some deep and dark [!@#$%^&*] isnt.

by your logic, you could just accept kendell as a hooker, dixie married to joe, erica as a lesbian, and angie slutting all around town because, hey why not, its been 5 years. No need to bother keeping up with who any of these characters are.

[jfung79]

Did you see my point about SORAS too? It is picking and choosing.

Kendall is actually an interesting point, because when they brought in Alicia MInshew, they reverted Kendall to being really angry at Erica. When SMG left, my understanding is she and Erica had softened somewhat. But bringing in Alicia Minshew, they reverted Kendall to a core of her character, just as reverting JR to someone conflicted between the light and the dark, with the light being a major element, would ring true with the *core* of his character as Adam *and Dixie's* son.

I think I just have a different interpretation of what is the essence of JR than you do.

[JackPeyton]

No, its not. Its knowing what is essential, important for character and what isnt.

Would you accept JR as this loving dork just because its five years?

[jfung79]

JR doesn't have to be a loving dork to have some more elements of compassion or optimism than he did at the end.

Van Hansis is certainly capable of playing a dark side (not that I think he will be cast). That's how his character is in his new webseries Eastsiders.

[JackPeyton]

But why not?

Its been five years, anything can happen, right?