1 hour ago, chrisml said:

I'm not sure what I think about quick exits for characters who aren't working. When new regimes come in and there's a quick turnover, it does alienate me. I think execs should look at a show and try to make existing pieces work. 

I think sometimes longer exits or new combinations can be good story, but there's plenty of people on various soaps today I'd just weed out fast. It varies by the situation. GH has a ton of worthless characters; would I weep if half of them went in the next 60 days? No.

What I'd heard long ago (which may be apocryphal) is that like a lot of people, PM's conservative/religious views hardened as she got older, whereas IIRC Carlotta had been pro-gay in other situations in the past. She thought she could get away with changing the script on the day with Cristian and it didn't work. I missed her on the show as I loved her Carlotta, but I shed no tears.

1 hour ago, Vee said:

I think sometimes longer exits or new combinations can be good story, but there's plenty of people on various soaps today I'd just weed out fast. It varies by the situation. GH has a ton of worthless characters; would I weep if half of them went in the next 60 days? No.

What I'd heard long ago (which may be apocryphal) is that like a lot of people, PM's conservative/religious views hardened as she got older, whereas IIRC Carlotta had been pro-gay in other situations in the past. She thought she could get away with changing the script on the day with Cristian and it didn't work. I missed her on the show as I loved her Carlotta, but I shed no tears.

I haven't watched soaps in a while so I can't comment. The last time I remember a casting problem on GH (minus the Kelly Monaco scandal) was everyone wanting Wes Ramsay gone and Valentini refusing to fire him for the longest time.

I guess it would depend on the circumstances and how it was handled (re: worthless characters).  I would need to trust the EP and I never did. As a viewer, I just grew tired of so many regime changes and firings that I'm resistant to quick firings, but I can see where they would be useful for characters who just aren't working. Crystal Hunt would be someone I would have fired immediately.  I try to give actors and characters a chance, but sometimes I've just had enough. I even felt bad for the character of Emily during the Sloan harassment storyline. I would have found a way to redeem her. 

Mauceri is such a sad case because she was so good as Carlotta. I also don't shed a tear. I have no sympathy for that sort of person. Not one drop.

4 hours ago, Vee said:

I think sometimes longer exits or new combinations can be good story, but there's plenty of people on various soaps today I'd just weed out fast. It varies by the situation. GH has a ton of worthless characters; would I weep if half of them went in the next 60 days? No.

All the remaining soaps have a number of burned out and/or irrelevant characters who could easily be axed ASAP, but you are right: GH has a TON. It's baffling. I'd want to quickly discard a huge swath of them and refocus the show on true (present and past) legacy characters with roots in the show's DNA.

8 hours ago, DRW50 said:

Thanks for the mini-reviews and clips @Maxim 

The Clint and Viki clip is lovely, and atypical of much of this period in that it breathes and is subtle. Very good work from Clint and Erika. I also like that the script just doesn't bother to hide how obscenely rich Viki and Clint are.

I think this was the first time in a long period where we are seeing them interact like this with each-other. Like a normal married couple. I'm used to only seeing them have communication about someone else, be it Kevin, Joey, Tina... in the past Megan. Victoria has been lacking her own storyline for as long as I started watching. It has always been about someone else. Always. And I think that's why they have touched and underlined that line of her needing something "just for herself".

Last night a new batch of episodes (that I'm going to be writing later about) revealed a very deep crack in their relationship. Something I'm sure the writers are going to use going forward. The show has toned down the stupidity and comedy again and a lot of the old spirits and ghosts are back. Asa, Blair, Dorian... we are all back. I am very very happy to see them. 

 

Up to August 11th, 1992.

 

"All the VIPs are BACK."

I can't even compare what I was seeing couple of days ago to the show right now. It's pretty much back on it's feet. It almost feels like whoever was in charge... is back from a vacation or something and the quality SUDDENLY improved immensely. That's just how it feels. And I'm grateful for it.

🔷

Let's get  started with the Big stuff. Billy finally confessed that he's gay... and a sigh of relief could be felt, at least for me. But not everyone took it well. His father reacted like so many of the parents of gay people react (including mine) - he started denying the truth and attempting to gaslight Billy into thinking he just hasn't met the right girl. Ugh. In the end Billy ran away distraught. This situation triggered something very unexpected that I did not see coming - Clint Buchanan is showing a new side of himself. Do I even say... a conceited homophobic side? He completely forbid Joey to interact with "THIS" person. He couldn't even say his name and Joey needed to remind him that his name is Billy and that he is a human being. Joey is definitely his mother's son.

🔷

Leanne, Leanne... Leanne. She reminds me of a close relative that used to "raise" her children the same way. We all saw it coming, when she left her baby on the bar counter (disgusting) and then proceeded to take orders from a table. Then a little accident occurred - she spilled boiling hot coffee on little Duke's feet while he was napping on the counter. My heart sank and my eyes filled with tears. First it was the local bar and putting the baby in an environment where people drink alcohol and smoke, now it's gone one step further. I have no words, except that this woman can't even take care of herself, let alone raise a child. I can't watch situations where babies or children are put in such conditions where accidents like this can occur. I blame the grown-up that placed them in such conditions. There is no excuse. 

🔷

It seems like Victoria and Clint's relationship is up for a huge test. Victoria finds Clint's attitude towards Joey's decision to continue being friends with a gay person... very wrong and in direct conflict with everything they have raised their son to be. All the principles and qualities she has taught him. It appears to me the writers are attempting to give Victoria some sort of pass... when it comes to Sloan. It's all in the initial stages, of course. They may surprise me and write that she does NOT cheat on her husband. 

🔷

Tina and Cain have been surprisingly toned down and the cartoon-network storyline seems to be finished for now. In short - they managed to sneak the stolen jewels into Alex's apartment and got her arrested. Speaking of Mrs. Hesser, Alex has been toned down too. She is back in jail and back to looking like a mentally unstable sociopath and not Cruella Devil comedian. It's almost like the writers pressed RESET on these characters after realizing how idiotic the whole thing has turned to. THANK YOU, writers! I prefer seeing Alex be more nuanced and troubled and not popping the eyes and laughing all the time.

🔷

I wanted to save the best for last - all of my favorites are back. All of them. Asa and Blair are back from their "trip". Dorian seems to be crawling back into the front too. Now Kevin is attending Asa's masterclass in how to buy judges and corrupt the system. Blair was witnessing all of it and making grumpy faces and remarks. She also heard disturbing things that felt like a prophecy of what's to come if she does anything to anger or betray Asa! While talking about women in general... Asa told Kevin that he could destroy any wife he has if she does anything behind his back. He would make her feel like a dirty homeless dog. Blair realized the mess she has gotten herself into. This is a no-way out situation. The scene got even more cynical when Asa started hinting in front of Kevin how he was about to sleep with Blair tonight so that she gets pregnant by a son. Blair felt humiliated and like a piece of meat. It was bizarre seeing such an old man talk like this to his grandson about his wife IN FRONT OF HER. Almost perverse and porn-like. We saw Blair running to the bedroom to take her birth control pills (that she hides from Asa) while he is hornily stalking her and yelling at her to prepare. EW. Just EW. 

Overall - 10/10 - when they want they can just deliver perfection.

⭐⭐⭐⭐⭐ 

Clip of the day

Victoria vs Clint - FIRE!

Edited October 31Oct 31 by Maxim

Thanks @Maxim

I've probably said enough about that story, and my issue with the trope of "bad homophobia" vs "noble homophobia," but I don't think the idea of Clint being reactionary or bigoted when he feels his son is "endangered" is that much of a leap. I just don't think the execution was good, as shown in the writing for him in that clip.

Wasn't Clint's part in the homophobia/gay storyline a bit influenced by the fact that Gottleb was tired of his alcoholism and his on-set behaviour? I know in the oral history book that one of the conditions for his employment was his sobriety. I wonder if this storyline was being used as an escape hatch so to speak if he didn't succeed.

 

52 minutes ago, chrisml said:

Wasn't Clint's part in the homophobia/gay storyline a bit influenced by the fact that Gottleb was tired of his alcoholism and his on-set behaviour? I know in the oral history book that one of the conditions for his employment was his sobriety. I wonder if this storyline was being used as an escape hatch so to speak if he didn't succeed.

No, I don't think so. As the writers and actors tell it (including Roy Thinnes IIRC), the initial plan for the Sloan/Viki/Clint triangle was allegedly always for Sloan to die much sooner and Viki and Clint to reconcile. This apparently got delayed by CR's major accident on his ranch in summer '93. You can see them, early in the rape trial saga, moving Clint back towards Viki as support for her and Kevin while Sloan is the odd man out. That 180s as soon as Ritchie got hurt and Clint Buchanan did too, offscreen. That kept him out for months and things changed, and I think Thinnes has said suddenly he was around an extra year.

I've seen bits and pieces of Clint during the Billy Douglas story over the years, though I am not there yet in my regular viewing. I agree some of it went too far (and tbh I wonder if the IRL issues there may have run deeper and sadder, based on some gossip I've heard in the past). But I also think that team was capable of writing beautiful stuff for Clint, both in '91 with his father and son and then after the Llanfair fire, and much later still in '93, '95 with the DID saga, etc. It was a complicated and flawed writing treatment compounded by a complicated and troubled actor, but they still kept Clint a very decent man.

Edited September 9Sep 9 by Vee

Thanks @Vee for the explanation. I wondered about Clint's role in the Billy/homophobia storyline because Slezak did not usually badmouth her costars (save for Marcia Cross). She called out Ritchie's behaviour around this time (think it was him throwing a chair as I don't have the oral history book with me) and that's why I thought maybe they were going too far (as you point out) as a way to give audiences a reason to dislike him if they had to write him off. He certainly thought so but I think some of that was Gottlieb making him stop drinking. It's really s shame because he's so talented,, but I can imagine he'd be hell to work with based on the bts reports.

Erika had a complicated relationship with Clint. She's very complimentary of him in the book despite their issues but also says drinking destroyed him. I think his demons ran much deeper, given what she, Linda Dano and others have hinted at.

15 hours ago, DRW50 said:

Thanks @Maxim

I've probably said enough about that story, and my issue with the trope of "bad homophobia" vs "noble homophobia," but I don't think the idea of Clint being reactionary or bigoted when he feels his son is "endangered" is that much of a leap. I just don't think the execution was good, as shown in the writing for him in that clip.

What doesn't surprise me is timing. It seems to me the writers are trying to find a way to free Victoria up for Sloan. But... at the same time I don't think (in that regard) Sloan is much different. He has been hiding his son's "condition" and feels incredibly ashamed that he was gay. I don't know if they will go there with Viki and Sloan, but it seems they needed something to put a real wedge between her and Clint. 

 

14 hours ago, chrisml said:

Wasn't Clint's part in the homophobia/gay storyline a bit influenced by the fact that Gottleb was tired of his alcoholism and his on-set behaviour? I know in the oral history book that one of the conditions for his employment was his sobriety. I wonder if this storyline was being used as an escape hatch so to speak if he didn't succeed.

 

Oh, sounds like a bad situation. I never knew this. 

Edited September 10Sep 10 by Maxim

Up to August 13th, 1992.

"You can't escape karma."

Wow, the show is firing on all cylinders! Let's dive back into the drama.

🔷

I'll start once again with the big stuff. After a very heated court battle, where all of Leanne's past mistakes and character flaws were aired out... she lost her cool and went into full-blown meltdown in front of the entire court... She did what she does best - she bit herself in the leg and showed the judge complete lack of self control. We are left in the final moments where the judge is announcing his decision. I don't want to tell you what I want to happen, because I don't want to sound cold. But being raised by an incompetent mother myself... I would hate to see Demerest suffer more. 

🔷

Cain is back to the old Thomas Ripley manipulator-instigator mode. The cartoon stuff is gone for now and he is continuing his old game - trying to win Asa's graces and in the process - destroy Blair's position. The battle of the foxes resumes. After a somewhat threatening conversation with Blair, he masterfully put the seed of doubt in Asa's mind about who leaked information to Max (that Asa was about to buy his land). Asa instantly blamed Blair who had to lie through her teeth and be as convincing as possible. Just like she does in their bedroom, she had not trouble faking it this time either. God I love Blair.

🔷

In one of the most powerful scenes so far in the show, Victoria tried to connect with Marty and make her confess to her part in spreading the lie about Andrew. This, ladies and gentlemen... is a masterclass of how an empathetic person can still manipulate someone in order to achieve their goals. Victoria was handling Marty with velvet gloves, dosing every single word, diving into her mind and her soul. For now... however... her effort seems fruitless. Modern social media users would call Victoria a "dark empath" in this moment - the only real adversary to the narcissist. 

🔷

Dorian Lord visited her old lover Jason in the Buchanan Palace restaurant. She was like a predator sniffing for emotional carrion. She wanted to know how he and his young fiancé are doing... and then she sinisterly remarked that happiness is not possible without money and power. Something she can give him. And something he will soon find out if he goes to the court hearing for Demerest. Three Bloody Marys later and Dorian was making a spectacle of Cassie and Reverend Andrew's relationship. Love a drunk Dorian.

🔷

Victoria and Sloan had their first "fight" if you could even describe it like that. The topic was once again his son Andrew. Sloan was irritated that Victoria wrote an article about the protest and the right to privacy, and she called him a "fool" for the way he was acting and treating his son. It was a veeeery good touch to have this scene, so that their relationship doesn't appear one-note. That way the potential love affair will have even more blood and power to it.

Overall - 10/10 - these 2 episodes took my breath away.

⭐⭐⭐⭐⭐ 

Clip of the day

 Victoria and Marty talk.

 

 

Edited September 10Sep 10 by Maxim

Leanne and Jason took Demerest and they are trying to run off! I'm shook. Just finished a huge OLTL binge. The show is so addicting at this moment that I don't know if I shall not continue well into the night. I have a feeling this will end in disaster. I hope nothing bad happens to the baby. 

 

Clint Ritchie was furious on how they turned his character into a homophobe and was actually seeking legal advice to terminate his contract. But then he got into that accident, and was off-screen for months. Which allowed Viki & Sloane to continue their romance. But threw a wrench into the storyline of Sloane dying, and Viki returning to Clint. So they convinced Roy Thinnes to sign a new contract and keep the Sloane/Viki pairing until Clint Ritchie could return to the show

Thanks @Maxim that was a lovely clip. A very modulated performance from Erika, and all the vulnerability and pain Susan Haskell wore so well early in her run as Marty.

It always amuses me to hear of "Kiki." I never can remember if we actually see her on the show. Clearly soap savior Ron was a big fan too.