Well, you can't change your drinking habits based on your partners. Alcholics have to deal with the fact that others dont have the same problem. I do think that Jack's drinking beer is realistic...he is a "guy," and guys like their beer he IS Joe Sixpack (without the beer belly of course!)

I think you on to something about Televest and their research. During Wheeler's time GL got really "trashy," The Coopers took precedence over the Bauers, like the Snyders do the Hughes, (not that economics makes a family trashy) and Reva, who always had one toe in the trash pool, but who was embarrased about it, totally embraced her white trash mama thing..not to mention the introduction of Jonathon, the trashiest character to grace the GL screen EVER...(even going so far as screwing his cousin.) Then we switched to Peapack, which is a beautiful, very wealthy horse country town, and all we saw of it was the ugliest trashiest parts of it, from run down farm houses to portapotties and garbage dumpsters. I remember Harley's house, which had two young kids in it,but the inside was a perpectual construction zone and the backyard had rusty ass junk in it. I was convinced that this was all Wheeler's idea to make it more "real," (as if we all lived with rusty junk in out backyards, while scewing an international jewel thief who looked like a chippendale's dancer.) Its funny, but both GL and ATWT were always the "Country Club," soaps, even when Marland wrote for "poor," characters they spoke like they came from Harvard. You may have a point there.

I've noted this trend with the PGP soaps for a while but always felt funny, snobby, saying anything. I'm not sure if they think 'low-rent' viewers buy more PG products or if they were going after talk show viewers. Jack used to go for girls like Julia: now, we see him with trailer park Janet. Carly was a fashion designer but now seems more like a Wal Mart Queen. Granted, P&G does sell a lot of stuff via discount stores. I sort of feel like this trend began under Marland. The Snyders were a clan of hillbillies. World Turns was glam under the Doubsons. Marland did keep things 'Country Club' and it was not till the into of Carly that things really changed. Low Rent does not mix with the rest of the ratings strong CBS line up and has been a huge mistake.

I like my soaps sort of Glam and this may be why I like the Ryan family. They are slick and have style.

What do you mean PSA? If a character was sitting there surrounded by both parents and his best friend screaming "He's dead!" while he lay with no pulse after drinking too much, I think that's a major enough event to change someone's life. I don't need a drunk driving PSA, but I need consistency. As a writer, you should understand that. Especially when you consider how reckless everything else in his life is, him taking up drinking again should be a red flag. It should worry people. At the very least use it to it's highest dramatic potential and create some interesting family dynamics with the Chancellor's and Abbott's.

Also, hell no I won't turn the channel. This isn't Maria Arena Bell's show just like Chuck Pratt doesn't own AMC and Guza doesn't own GH. If you're coming into an existing show you do have a responsibility to stay true to the vision of the show. You can reinvent it, update it, introduce new characters, add more comedy or drama. Whatever you'd like, but a viewer should be able to tune in 5-10 years later and recognize characters. Every story shouldn't be retconned thus confusing returning viewers. And after investing so many years in Y&R, hell no I'm not going to stop watching because some hack is decimating it right now.

I feel that the no pulse thing was totally a PSA about the dangers of teenage drinking. It cool be looked at very much in the same manner as Lilly getting the STD from Kevin Fisher--that was clearly a message about teenage sex and condom use.

As for Billy, many characters have had little sit downs with him regarding the direction of his vile life: Jack, Kay, Jill, Mac, Victoria, Cloe. No one has gotten into it about specificly the drinking; however, it is clear that people are worried about the general direction of his life. It would have been nice for Kay to have a sit down with him about the dangers of booze but this was accomplished by dead dad John on New Year's Eve. I mean, the showed Billy dead in a DWA. I can just see this board in five years when everyone is upset about Noah being like a different character. Any boy under 20, unless he is pure evil, plays the same innocent, generic character on soaps.

I've noted this trend with the PGP soaps for a while but always felt funny, snobby, saying anything. I'm not sure if they think 'low-rent' viewers buy more PG products or if they were going after talk show viewers. Jack used to go for girls like Julia: now, we see him with trailer park Janet. Carly was a fashion designer but now seems more like a Wal Mart Queen. Granted, P&G does sell a lot of stuff via discount stores. I sort of feel like this trend began under Marland. The Snyders were a clan of hillbillies. World Turns was glam under the Doubsons. Marland did keep things 'Country Club' and it was not till the into of Carly that things really changed. Low Rent does not mix with the rest of the ratings strong CBS line up and has been a huge mistake.

I like my soaps sort of Glam and this may be why I like the Ryan family. They are slick and have style.

I never thought of the Snyders as hillbillys,(boring yes, but hb no.) I used to laugh that these rural farm "earthy," (as Marland wanted us to see them) spent so much time not in the field or worrying about the crops or weather, but discussing "feelings," and "honesty," in a relationship. They all acted like they jumped off a tractor and ran over to Lyn Michael's therapy class "Feeling 101."

GL in its last two years became unbearably trashy..Zimmer went full out trash mamo mode, loud, boobs dropping in bad tee shirts, Jonathon looking like he hadnt taken a bath in six years...Buzz with snot in his nose (who also looks like he hasnt had a bath in a few years) A shot of Harley about to go down on Gus. The whole Cooper vs. Spaulding thing with the ultimatley "perfect," Coopers taking on the ridiculously "evil," Spauldings (when we know that the Lewis were a better opponent and the classic Bauers vs. Spauldings made more sense..) and of course, everyone having to act like a stooge so Jonathon could be made to come out on top, maybe that had something to do with their market research on who was watching. But I would have to say, most likely thier continued dumbing down of the shows since around 1994 got them that audience.

I never thought of the Snyders as hillbillys,(boring yes, but hb no.) I used to laugh that these rural farm "earthy," (as Marland wanted us to see them) spent so much time not in the field or worrying about the crops or weather, but discussing "feelings," and "honesty," in a relationship. They all acted like they jumped off a tractor and ran over to Lyn Michael's therapy class "Feeling 101."

GL in its last two years became unbearably trashy..Zimmer went full out trash mamo mode, loud, boobs dropping in bad tee shirts, Jonathon looking like he hadnt taken a bath in six years...Buzz with snot in his nose (who also looks like he hasnt had a bath in a few years) A shot of Harley about to go down on Gus. The whole Cooper vs. Spaulding thing with the ultimatley "perfect," Coopers taking on the ridiculously "evil," Spauldings (when we know that the Lewis were a better opponent and the classic Bauers vs. Spauldings made more sense..) and of course, everyone having to act like a stooge so Jonathon could be made to come out on top, maybe that had something to do with their market research on who was watching. But I would have to say, most likely thier continued dumbing down of the shows since around 1994 got them that audience.

Dr. Lynn Michaels--flash from the past. I found the fact of her being the Oakdale shrink a bit corny. I really hated the Iva forgives her rapist followed by the chicks dig Josh storyline. I get that Josh was 'abused' but found everyone trusting him to be a bit insane. I did like the actor, though. For me, that was the a bad time for ATWT.

I never knew GL was so trashy. I only watched the show once in a while. The name Buzz is beyond trashy. Harley went to blow her man? GL was often aired at 10am in some markets--that is just wrong!

I never thought of the Snyders as hillbillys,(boring yes, but hb no.) I used to laugh that these rural farm "earthy," (as Marland wanted us to see them) spent so much time not in the field or worrying about the crops or weather, but discussing "feelings," and "honesty," in a relationship. They all acted like they jumped off a tractor and ran over to Lyn Michael's therapy class "Feeling 101."

That's true, but he also made sure they were never too closely tied to the farm setting. They weren't all that rural. Seth, who was the most into talking about his feelings, had been away from the farm for years, working in the big city. Caleb had also gone to school and spent some time working for Henry Lange, I think, before he returned to Oakdale. The main Snyder kids who were more rural were Holden and Meg. I think it was a mistake to transition Holden to the corporate suit life (it never fit him well), but he did seem believable as the farm boy who didn't want to talk about his feelings. Meg was a bit fake but I thought she was believable as a girl who grew up somewhat bitter and with big dreams and then crashed into reality.

I think ATWT and Y&R probably have the most veteran characters and multigenerational families still around. I don't think any soap is ever truly "destroyed" or "unfixable" though. Some would just take more work to fix than others.

I don't agree with the "trashy" comment, at least the way I'm interpreting it to mean. If anything to me, everyone is still too rich on ATWT. There's not really much worry about keeping a job, not having money, etc. There are little moments when those are issues but not sustained stories around that. Pretty much I think there is the right balance though.

Edited January 17, 201015 yr by jfung79

I think ATWT and Y&R probably have the most veteran characters and multigenerational families still around. I don't think any soap is ever truly "destroyed" or "unfixable" though. Some would just take more work to fix than others.

I don't agree with the "trashy" comment, at least the way I'm interpreting it to mean. If anything to me, everyone is still too rich on ATWT. There's not really much worry about keeping a job, not having money, etc. There are little moments when those are issues but not sustained stories around that. Pretty much I think there is the right balance though.

I never meant trash based on income. I was speaking to how certain characters act/conduct themselves. I was also talking about some characters and stories that might appeal to the 'trash' demo used to sell certain products. Actually, I hate the word trash and wish I'd chosen a different way of expressing myself.

Killing Brad was a budget thing, they had to ax a vet and ax fell on him. It sucks though, 'cause he was one of the few Jewish characters on daytime. Actually, he was the only Jew and I wonder what viewers thought about that. I liked the Holocaust art story but realize no one else did. I wonder if his focus group score fell when his mama made the matzo balls? Plus, Brad was just hot. As for Collen, that was some serious damage because of Tracy.

Nora from OLTL, is Jewish...although they never talk about it anymore.

Nora from OLTL, is Jewish...although they never talk about it anymore.

Nora's focus group numbers must have dropped, too ;-)

Too bad, I really wanted to spin Brad's dradle!