8 hours ago, Mitch64 said:

So true...as we discussed, why were Shayne and Maura so bland and boring..you would have thought they were raised by Mike and Carol Brady instead of Reva (who was presuemed dead during their early childhood and erratic during the rest of their time) and Josh(who, when not obsessed with Reva was marrying psychos or vixens.) Annie would have made a big mark on them...(Especially since McTavish spent so much time with those toothsome child actors going on and on about "MommyAnnie" and LOWHAD.

I suppose a general reluctance by writers/suits to risk alienating a segment of the audience who watched legacy children grow up. And the inability to create well rounded characters.  

Specifically in Reva's case, I suppose dealing with the affect of her tumultuous life on her kids was too "small" a story for her. Reva was certainly never going take any of her kids blaming her for their less-than-stellar decisions. Or let her fail at connecting with her kids.

SOW interview with Ellen Wheeler

Guiding Light's new regime — i.e., executive producer Ellen Wheeler and head writer David Kreizman — held a press conference July 1 to share their plans to put the spring back in Springfield's step. Here are the highlights:

 

QUESTION: Ellen, why did you hire David?

WHEELER: Well, look how cute he is (laughs). No, I had been here before [as a director and a producer] and Dave had been a breakdown writer. When you got one of Dave's breakdowns you were always so excited. Just the fact that it said his name, you would say, "Oh, my goodness, this is going to be a great breakdown." What made it a great breakdown was that he understood the show so well and could write from such a place of character, history and story. I always gravitated to his breakdowns. So I felt we had some of the same sensibility of how we saw soap opera, storytelling in general, but certainly how we saw this show. So when it became a discussion, Dave was the first person...really the only person on my list.

KREIZMAN: I've been around for a long time, so everybody knew me. It wasn't like they were dragging me from the streets. I started as an intern here when I was in college. I fell in love with the medium, how fast it moves, and how you may have one show and you don't love it but you have another one coming the next day. Also, how long you have to tell stories and develop characters.

QUESTION: What are some of the biggest changes you guys are going to be making in Springfield?

KREIZMAN: We want to focus on the core families. We wanted the show to be like what GUIDING LIGHT was in its heyday. A lot of people say GUIDING LIGHT was at its best when it was telling story with heart, based on the character and the families.

WHEELER: The families...it really comes back to that. I was looking at the headshots of the cast up in my office this morning and realized each row is a family unit. As I was looking at it I was going, "Wow, that's great. I can look up at that board and the top row has this story and the next row down has this story. We have a story in place for each family."

QUESTION: When did you realize you had to make a change? Did the ratings hit a certain low point?

WHEELER: No, no it wasn't anything that made me say, "Oh, I have to make the change." It was a feeling that I had that I wanted someone who had a very similar feeling, similar approach to doing soap operas, and I knew I had that in Dave. I think all of us thought that that was going to be the best thing for the show — [having] two people who were looking at a show from the same position and wanting to achieve the same things. It makes everyone below you feel that symbiotic thing, and they want to work together too.

QUESTION: Ellen, how is this different from AS THE WORLD TURNS, where you directed?

WHEELER: I'm the boss.

QUESTION: David, would you ever write Ellen into the show, and Ellen, would you let him?

WHEELER (cutting David off and smiling): No!

 

 

 

 

14 hours ago, P.J. said:

I suppose a general reluctance by writers/suits to risk alienating a segment of the audience who watched legacy children grow up. And the inability to create well rounded characters.  

Specifically in Reva's case, I suppose dealing with the affect of her tumultuous life on her kids was too "small" a story for her. Reva was certainly never going take any of her kids blaming her for their less-than-stellar decisions. Or let her fail at connecting with her kids.

It would have made Reva that much more interesting and "rootable" if she struggled with connecting with her kids..always a shadow over her but she couldnt stop doing her crap all the time (like Blake,,,.trying to be a good person but always screwing up..)and when she finally does make a connection, its with her bad seed Jonathon.  But I totally agree, Rauch wanted her to be a sexed up Vicki from OLTL but it just made the character intolerable.

3 hours ago, Mitch64 said:

It would have made Reva that much more interesting and "rootable" if she struggled with connecting with her kids..always a shadow over her but she couldnt stop doing her crap all the time (like Blake,,,.trying to be a good person but always screwing up..)and when she finally does make a connection, its with her bad seed Jonathon.  But I totally agree, Rauch wanted her to be a sexed up Vicki from OLTL but it just made the character intolerable.

I guess they tried with both of Reva's "surprise" children. But she only had a year with Dylan (Billy shouldered most of the burden on that one). By the time they tried to sell her bonding with Jonathan, I was so over Reva I didn't give a fig.

12 hours ago, Paul Raven said:

 

KREIZMAN: We wanted the show to be like what GUIDING LIGHT was in its heyday. 

 

LOL. At least he had a sense of humor. 

1 hour ago, Reverend Ruthledge said:

LOL. At least he had a sense of humor. 

Ha...I also love that she says "Dave was the only choice" well..yes, because the other writers offered turned it down (they knew GL was on a speeding train to cancel town, that their was too much interference, and that the pay was crap) so Davey WAS the only choice!

On 11/14/2024 at 11:50 AM, Mitch64 said:

That is why it was weird when the placed him with Mel, the actress was beautiful (maybe too much so to realistically be interested in Rick at that uh, stage in his life) but she was bland as hell. Mo and Ed worked as Ed had his problems and Mo was the comforting Mom, but still had a backbone...Rick and Abby just blanded the hell out and Mel was even worse.  It would have been interesting to give Rick a partner of color, who actually had fire and really disliked what the Santos and to a lesser extent the Spauldings did the community and that would cause problems with Danny and of course, with Rick's true love Phillip.

The Boudreaus were another case (as happened repeatedly on GL in its last decade or more) where a plan to bring in black characters seemed sabotaged before it even began and the best you were going to get was tokenism. IIRC Richard Biggs and Shari Headley left in no time at all, rightfully so. 

The main problem with the Mel and Rick relationship was how blatantly plot-driven the material was. They got together very quickly. I didn't believe it. I tried to like them, but I had no real investment. 

There was something deeply cynical about Rick's heart transplant story, which is the reason I think it had little impact on viewers. You knew he was not going to die. And dumping a new wife and a new child (a year or so after he had already had a child with Harley) on Rick did not change the lack of stakes. 

The only time Mel was allowed to have more of a personality was when she got sick of Rick's obsession with Beth, but none of that was about her and that whole story was garbage.

I did enjoy her flirty final relationship with Cyrus, but that was clearly another case of the show knowing time was almost up and just pairing off characters who were at dead ends.

I just didn't like Mel. It seems that at some point (after a couple of years of hapless romances) TPTB would remember that Rick was a Bauer, and would try to meld him into the tentpole he should've been all along. This usually resulted in a boring romance with some "suitable" boring woman. 

There was a lot wrong about his co-dependent relationship with Beth (in the last decade of the show), the least of which was it always felt like he was doing it more out of some weird need to fill Phillip's place.

Were weddings not really "events" until Quint and Nola's in 1983? I've seen a couple from the early '80s and they seem like tepid affairs. Kelly and Morgan's is picturesque, but devoid of drama. The only drama at Ross and Carrie's is Vanessa's choice of couture, and Ed and Mo's is in the Bauer living room (from what I can make out). Even Quint and Nola's (while grand in scope) is a little lite on subplots.  

Related question---did the country club set not exist before Quint and Nola's engagement party? If characters need to cross, it's mainly at the hospital, Spaulding, The HideOut or Wired for Sound. 

19 hours ago, DRW50 said:

The only time Mel was allowed to have more of a personality was when she got sick of Rick's obsession with Beth, but none of that was about her and that whole story was garbage.

I did enjoy her flirty final relationship with Cyrus, but that was clearly another case of the show knowing time was almost up and just pairing off characters who were at dead ends.

I did like that they had Beth and Rick together after Phillip's "death" but it was so incoherently written.  They should have gotten slowly closer during Harley's trial. But the show did it after Beth married Alan (uggh) and Beth by that time was just a weird plot point written differently everyday..and we could never invest in that either. Would have been nice if Rick helped Beth center herself again, while we would know she was just using him as a safe haven they would believe they were in love and for the first time in years Beth would feel "safe" and then, Phillip comes back. But then, I would have had Beth be the one who shot Phillip, and it was one of her alters  to protect Harley (she sees him grab Harley and immediately goes back to Bradley..which would explain how she killed Blackburn and went into a fugue..) and she blocked it out.

Edited November 17, 20241 yr by Mitch64

4 hours ago, P.J. said:

Were weddings not really "events" until Quint and Nola's in 1983? I've seen a couple from the early '80s and they seem like tepid affairs. Kelly and Morgan's is picturesque, but devoid of drama. The only drama at Ross and Carrie's is Vanessa's choice of couture, and Ed and Mo's is in the Bauer living room (from what I can make out). Even Quint and Nola's (while grand in scope) is a little lite on subplots.  

Related question---did the country club set not exist before Quint and Nola's engagement party? If characters need to cross, it's mainly at the hospital, Spaulding, The HideOut or Wired for Sound. 

There are a few other hints of drama with Carrie around her wedding day, like Jackie fearing her and some other hints of her toxic past, but I agree it's mostly low-key.

I think Kelly and Morgan may be the first "big" GL wedding I have ever seen. You can tell they put a lot of care into it with the location. Even if it doesn't compare to later glories of budget busting like the Mindy and Kurt wedding.

I wonder how Leslie and Mike's wedding was.

58 minutes ago, DRW50 said:

There are a few other hints of drama with Carrie around her wedding day, like Jackie fearing her and some other hints of her toxic past, but I agree it's mostly low-key.

I think Kelly and Morgan may be the first "big" GL wedding I have ever seen. You can tell they put a lot of care into it with the location. Even if it doesn't compare to later glories of budget busting like the Mindy and Kurt wedding.

I wonder how Leslie and Mike's wedding was.

This is a completely ignorant question, but are Leslie/Mike GL's equivalent of ATWT's Penny/Jeff? I'm much more aware of early ATWT history than GL's.

Morgan and Kelly's wedding is beautiful, and I remember thinking that when I saw it as a kid. All I can think now is that it must have been a logistical nightmare. Winding through the woods and everything. lol.

2 minutes ago, P.J. said:

This is a completely ignorant question, but are Leslie/Mike GL's equivalent of ATWT's Penny/Jeff? I'm much more aware of early ATWT history than GL's.

Morgan and Kelly's wedding is beautiful, and I remember thinking that when I saw it as a kid. All I can think now is that it must have been a logistical nightmare. Winding through the woods and everything. lol.

Yes. Looking back there are a few culty vibes in the relationship and the wedding, but it's still beautiful.

I am also not that aware, compared to people who watched at the time. I wonder if Leslie/Mike are similar to Kim/Dan (I might be going that way as Kathryn played Leslie for a brief time).

8 minutes ago, P.J. said:

This is a completely ignorant question, but are Leslie/Mike GL's equivalent of ATWT's Penny/Jeff? I'm much more aware of early ATWT history than GL's.

I would say overall - no.

Penny/Jeff were the 'young love' couple who went through various traumas- a murder trial, parental interference, a quickie first marriage before finally getting together.

Mike/Leslie were older, each having been through other marriages. Leslie had been married to Ed's brother. Mike had a child etc

Both marriages were ended by the death of one of them.

So yes, there were destined to be together, but the history was different.

28 minutes ago, DRW50 said:

Yes. Looking back there are a few culty vibes in the relationship and the wedding, but it's still beautiful.

I am also not that aware, compared to people who watched at the time. I wonder if Leslie/Mike are similar to Kim/Dan (I might be going that way as Kathryn played Leslie for a brief time).

I was on the verge of typing "hippie". Which rhymes with "drippy"--given the emo "You Needed Me" theme song.

Per Paul, it does seem more Kim/Dan like.

@Paul Raven  did GL have a young signature couple? I can't believe Irna wouldn't have tried replicating Penny/Jeff.