Good to read that Marlena write-up above.  Especially notable is the observation that at the time, GL wasn't underestimating the intelligence of its audience.  It was when GL decided to insult my intelligence circa 1995/1996 that I cut my viewership down to maybe 1-2 days per week.  That plus an overload of Reva was too much.  I severed ties with the show completely in 1998.  Why should I remain loyal to something so determinedly poor?

What De LaCroix doesn't mention is the almost unbelievable degree of "adept temperance" that those at GL exhibited during the early 1990s.   The actors, writers, producers, stage hands, etc.  

As an example, speaking of the Lillian/Maureen confrontation in the Bauer kitchen...notice what's NOT in those scenes.  The speed of line delivery has been slowed.  No out of the ordinary lighting.  And, most importantly, NO MUSIC!  None.  Consequently, there's all sorts of room for the audience to feel a very palpable sense of dread.  The scene is set up so well.

Yeah, the writing is much above average, but we know that already.  People comment frequently on the "suburban joke" line that Parker delivers, but in my mind's eye, it's an earlier line in that scene that really makes my eyebrows go up - where Lillian asks, "is this a good time" to which Maureen responds, "another time might be worse".  WHAT?!!  Holy sheyit!  And other than spoken words, there is no other sound.

I've commented earlier how as a consumer of entertainment, I greatly appreciate being manipulated.  This is yet another example of it at Guiding Light, when it good.

Honestly, Ross is so reprehensible in that episode...it's a minor miracle he wasn't just written as Mike's antithesis and then written off.

Re the GL critique---Marlena's right, there's a unique alchemy about GL (and I'd say from mid-'89 to mid '93) of that time. It is as near perfect as a soap can get. A lot of shows would've stumbled badly losing heavy hitters like Reva, Josh and Phillip within six months. Later losing Bev McKinsey alone seemed to hobble the show.

A-M and Eleni were never a supercouple.  

An unexpected supercouple that never came to be was Alan-Michael and Gilly.  Their on-screen chemistry was remarkable.  It flew off the screen!  A great many viewers saw it; how could they not?

And a great deal of story could have been mined from their pairing.  Early 1994 GL was determined to ram A-M and Lucy down our throats, sadly.  Speaking for myself, I would have easily settled for a quick change of storyline direction, even if it meant derailing that part of the show for 1-2 months, to create a future for Gilly/A-M.

 

 

@Contessa Donatella I think at that time, there really wasn't a pull for Guiding Light for younger viewers once the original Four Musketeers and Lucjack storylines ended.  They tried with Bridget, etc., but those storylines still don't click for me. It wouldn't have pulled me in as a teen. Hart wasn't all that to me. I could care less about his love life. David and Kat ended up separating Hamp and Gilly, so I didn't like them either.

Bridget became annoying to me. Always pining for Hart when he flat out told her he wanted Julie, not her. 

If only Maureen stayed and there would be another tie to the Bauers and Roger, who he hated with a passion, but Maureen. 

@Speed Racer I didn't buy Alan Michael as a owner of a newspaper in the first place.  That's why I never was into Gilly and Alan Michael.  I only liked Alan Michael with Harley.

 

Edited July 20Jul 20 by MLH

In my deep dive, I found this other thing. It's from earlier. But, it's Millett. The notes say 1969 TV GUIDE

This lady has a 17 room house, four children, six dogs, seven cats and a soap opera career, too -  by Judith Jobin

“Soap opera at its worst can be black-and-white—but most of the time the characters are as a real and the conflicts are ones the average person really deals with. I’m proud of it and I'm livid because the industry ignores it. There are no Emmys for soaps!'
So says actress Millette Alexander—looking authentically angry—as she defends her membership in television’s much maligned soap-opera club. And it might smack of a case of sour suds if it came from a lesser talent. But by all accounts, Miss Alexander plays soaps with a degree of involvement and intensity usually reserved, in an image-conscious profession, for more prestigious theatrical endeavors. The case in point is her latest role, a young, attractive lady doctor. For the past six months Millette has been feeling her way around the psyche of Sara McIntyre, M.D., one of the central characters on CBS’s The Guiding Light. Says producer Peter Andrews:‘‘She’s quite an intelligent girl  and she works very hard in preparation—much more than most. She always has a point of view—she has the whole edifice of her role constructed by the time she gets in.”
On the surface, the action is uncomplicated: Millette puts in upwards of 40 hours a week alternately clucking over patients and getting into clinches with a handsome colleague. But under the clucking and clinching is“much more than the words say, insists Edge of Night actress Teri Keane, who remembers Millette’s nimble portrayal of a dual role on that series. “She's complex. There's nothing surfacey about her acting.” ”And a Guiding Light actor agrees, pointing admiringly to her ‘‘emotional quicksilver quality.”
But at this point, an inevitable question leaps out: after 15 years of landing television, Broadway and summer-theater roles with ease and regularity, why isn’t Millette Alexander more famous, a little closer to stardom?
“She could definitely have it if she tried,’ declares producer Andrews, confirming that her talent is widely acknowledged in the trade. Teri Keane agrees: ‘‘Absolutely. She's tops. But she doesn’t want it.” And Millette herself, recalling an early offer from 20th Century-Fox, confers a convincing air of distastefulness on the whole business: “They wanted me to sign a seven-year contract, move to California, become a starlet.I didn’t want to be locked in.” Her friend Ed Zimmermann explains: ‘‘l’d say she wants most to do good work.” Finally, Andrews points to her off-stage existence: ‘‘She thinks a lot about her home life.”
By any standard, it’s a life worth thinking about. At 35, she’s married to rangy Jimmy Hammerstein. He is the son of Oscar Hammerstein 2nd, is a respected director in his own right (most recently of a pair of off-Broadway Pinter plays), and was. undeniably a catch. They live in a 17-room Stanford White house in Nyack, N.Y., complete with a six-acre spread of rolling lawns, fruit-tree orchards, greenhouse, lavish swimming pool, and hilltop gazebo overlooking the Hudson River. Their four children are abundantly rosy-cheeked and well-fed. And they solved their servant problem by importing an entire family from Honduras—but the bargain included five more children and an  88-year-old grandmother, all of whom live-in.
After that the law of diminishing returns takes over and things look a bit raffish at the edges. There’s a bright red four-wheel-drive jeep in the driveway, and unwary visitors are assaulted by a friendly tangle of six dogs and seven cats. A tour of the interior turns up stray dolls and hobby horses, jars of freshly made fruit preserves in the kitchen, a pair of well-used pianos, an alarming assortment of electronic instruments and an open Dickens volume in the bathroom. Not to mention sound effects—the indecorous clatter of nine children, plus sputtering balloon sounds and Indian yells.
It all looks disarmingly like a television headache commercial featuring Millette as its miscast heroine. As keeper of the house and grounds, and Big Mama to that brood, she’s more like the earthy old lady who lived in a shoe than an other-worldly Cinderella. ‘‘I don’t even nose-count any more,” she laughs.
“She looks like quite a socialite,” says Teri Keane, ‘‘but she can get down there in the garden and weed!” And that’s not just a figure of speech. In off hours, Millette weeds with gusto, dips deeply into art and music (she’s a highly skilled pianist, also plays violin), finds time for exquisite needlepoint projects and generally has a disconcerting affinity for over-achievement. “She's got a helluva lot of energy,”’ says one friend, and another adds, “It must be pretty exhausting.”
Which raises a final question: How did an admittedly ‘“‘overly sensible’’ teenager from the Great Neck (Long Island) High School Orchestra find her way from first-chair violin to the center of such a helter-skelter life?

“I finally got sensible about myself,” she explains happily.

 

 

2 minutes ago, MLH said:

@Contessa Donatella I think at that time, there really wasn't a pull for Guiding Light for younger viewers once the original Four Musketeers and Lucjack storylines ended.  They tried with Bridget, etc., but those storylines still don't click for me. It wouldn't have pulled me in as a teen. Hart wasn't all that to me. I could care less about his love life. David and Kat ended up separating Hamp and Gilly, so I didn't like them either.

Bridget became annoying to me. Always pining for Hart when he flat out told her he wanted Julie, not her. 

If only Maureen stayed and there would be another tie to the Bauers and Roger, who he hated with a passion, but Maureen. 

So, if I read you right, you don't care about the age of the person you might find interesting.. Me either. I think this idea that teens are only wanting to watch other teens is nonsense. 

And, about Mo, Maureen you call her like a good boy with manners, I totally agree. They to me really screwed up badly with that. 

But, sorry, I always loved Bridget. Melissa Hayden had my heart. 

6 minutes ago, MLH said:

@Speed Racer I didn't buy Alan Michael as a owner of a newspaper in the first place.  That's why I never was into Gilly and Alan Michael.  I only liked Alan Michael with Harley.

 

Which Alan-M? Hearst or Evans? I'm all in for Hearst & that continues to this day.

MLH - I'm surprised by your A-M/Gilly remark....what would A-M being part owner of The Journal have to do with A-M/Gilly potential?  An aside - the crux of A-M/Gilly interaction took place well before A-M become part owner (Winter 1993/1994 versus Autumn 1994).

The Four Musketeers?  Passable, but hardly excellent.  Beth/Lujack was good at times.

What I never bought into was the horrific pairing of Morgan Richards and Kelly Nelson.  Here's a dippy, plain jane girl (Kristen Vigard, whom I detested) that somehow enamors studly Kelly, who is pursuing an MD degree and is easily 10+ years her senior?  The two don't work together on ANY level - intellect, ambition, age, experience, looks.  The whole thing was pure nonsense, and an obvious ploy to attract the attention of high school age female viewers, who at that age naturally are devoid of sophistication.

Yeah, the Bridget pursuing Hart a second time was tedious.  You would think that Bridget wouldn't return to that territory after Dylan left.  No imagination on the part of exec producers and writers of the time.  More mid-1990s garbage.  More reason to tune out.

 

21 minutes ago, Contessa Donatella said:

In my deep dive, I found this other thing. It's from earlier. But, it's Millett. The notes say 1969 TV GUIDE

Oh, my gosh. The style of these kinds of articles is so different even 10 or 15 years later. Calling a mother of 4 children a "girl?" "Servant problem?" LOL.

Anyway, Milette is amazing (still alive in her 90s!). It's sad that her character kind of petered out. But I think she left because she wanted to? She had a second career as a musician, I believe. 

26 minutes ago, Contessa Donatella said:

But, sorry, I always loved Bridget. Melissa Hayden had my heart.

I agree. I was so impressed by her during the pregnancy storyline. She played it with so much poignancy without it ever getting sappy, including when she found out about her aunt's death. 

And she totally looked like a Reardon! She absolutely looked like she could be Nola's niece.

6 minutes ago, Speed Racer said:

What I never bought into was the horrific pairing of Morgan Richards and Kelly Nelson.  Here's a dippy, plain jane girl (Kristen Vigard, whom I detested) that somehow enamors studly Kelly, who is pursuing an MD degree and is easily 10+ years her senior?

I did like Kristen, but that's as far as it went for me. HORRIBLE storyline. Honestly? Today it would be taken as a story about an older man grooming an underage girl. The same with the story he wrote on General Hospital for Scotty and Laura. (Yes, attitudes were very different back then, but even watching these at the time gave me the ick).

8 minutes ago, Speed Racer said:

The whole thing was pure nonsense, and an obvious ploy to attract the attention of high school age female viewers, who at that age naturally are devoid of sophistication.

Marland was very open about this being the reason he wrote the story. He claimed he asked his niece what kind of story she would like to see, and she said a college man falling in love with a girl her age. I would disagree with your assessment of high school age female viewers, that's a stereotype. Not every teen girl liked this kind of thing. In fact, I'm pretty sure GH hammered GL when it came to young demos, and it was OLDER women who adored John Wesley Shipp.

@Contessa Donatella I liked Harley with both versions of Alan Michael. I liked Harley and Nadine more than Reva.  

My taste has changed from when I was viewing Daytime Soaps. Neither of my Grand Mothers watched soaps. My mom did when she wasn't working and basically watched ABC soaps. I only watched bits of storylines during the summer vacation or winter break. I liked Days at the time. I was into Jack Deveraux (I didn't care one way or another about Jennifer), Eve and Izzy B.  I only recall Harley from Guiding Light.  I only remember her and Marah (and Josh). 

I didn't watch Another World, As the World Turns, Guiding Light, Edge of Night, Ryan's Hope, etc.

Now, I can't seem to get into watching old Days of Our Lives and General Hospital episodes.  I was pulled into watching Guiding Light with some post with Roger and Holly's major rape storyline. Maybe, due to not knowing where how major storylines ended. 

This is the thing that always gets me: killing off Maureen was not part of a "carefully conceived, well-executed story." If it this were true, it wouldn't have collapsed the minute Maureen died. It collapsed because the whole point was to kill off Maureen and that's the only thing they thought about. They didn't think beyond that. That storyline was held up by Tina Sloan and Ellen Parker's fantastic acting. Once it shifted to Peter Simon and Ed, it was an absolute mess with nowhere to go. And that's exactly what happened: it went nowhere.  I know there are Eve supporters on here, but no one was turning on GL to see more of Eve and a dead Maureen.  The confrontation in the cabin could have been the first part (second if you include Lillian's cancer) of the story as their marriage deteriorated, and allegiances shifted and Maureen and Ed split up. Instead, JFP does what she always does: sacrifice the woman, tell it from the man's perspective, and alienate the audience for a big dramatic moment.

She told this same story on AW with John/Felicia/Sharlene. She did it on OLTL with Nora/Bo/Sam. In those cases, no one died, but same storyline and same confrontations. On both of those shows, she alienated the audiences, and ruined characters for the sake of dramatic moments. 

1 hour ago, DeeVee said:

Marland was very open about this being the reason he wrote the story. He claimed he asked his niece what kind of story she would like to see, and she said a college man falling in love with a girl her age. I would disagree with your assessment of high school age female viewers, that's a stereotype. Not every teen girl liked this kind of thing. In fact, I'm pretty sure GH hammered GL when it came to young demos, and it was OLDER women who adored John Wesley Shipp.

And guys, don't forget the gay male audience. 

I remembered it differently. I thought his relative said the best thing would be the cutest boy liked her & only her, implied. Nothing about the guy being older. Interesting, huh? 

1 hour ago, DeeVee said:

Oh, my gosh. The style of these kinds of articles is so different even 10 or 15 years later. Calling a mother of 4 children a "girl?" "Servant problem?" LOL.

Totally true & very noticeable, also!

1 hour ago, DeeVee said:

Anyway, Milette is amazing (still alive in her 90s!). It's sad that her character kind of petered out. But I think she left because she wanted to? She had a second career as a musician, I believe. 

Concert pianist or first chair violin. 

1 hour ago, DeeVee said:

I agree. I was so impressed by her during the pregnancy storyline. She played it with so much poignancy without it ever getting sappy, including when she found out about her aunt's death. 

And she totally looked like a Reardon! She absolutely looked like she could be Nola's niece.

YES! We could form a Bridget fan club!

 

1 hour ago, chrisml said:

She told this same story on AW with John/Felicia/Sharlene. She did it on OLTL with Nora/Bo/Sam. In those cases, no one died, but same storyline and same confrontations. On both of those shows, she alienated the audiences, and ruined characters for the sake of dramatic moments. 

Well, on the one hand, that confrontation between Mo & Lillian is brilliant. And, Ellen as a ghost won awards. But, that quote bothers me. A lot. And, you're correct, same story, 2 other shows!!! And, all 3 versions Hated!! And, I think it is quite telling that 3 different groups of fans (AW, OLTL & GL) would have this shared sort of universal GREAT HATRED of that tale told 3 times with 3 different sets of actors. 

And, she also had characters act against their own histories & their own integrity. Lillian was supposed to have been a great, real friend of Maureen's. Felicia same except Sharlene. In both cases to have sex with this man they were willing to be disloyal to a supposedly meaningful woman friend. Hello to that message!

Edited July 20Jul 20 by Contessa Donatella

The optics on the Kelly/Morgan romance were probably always a little skeevy, but 40 years later, calling them problematic is a major understatement. I don't think that romance would've been nearly as memorable if not for the addition of Nola as the bad girl keeping them apart. (Good Lord, the endless crooning of "You Needed Me" alone ....)

But as a teen? Sorry, I was hooked by it. Or actually, not sorry. 

Melissa Hayden is a wonderful actress who should've been the lynchpin of the next generation. Bridget/David/Kat should have been the next "Four Musketeers", but Bridget never got that "grand romance", for reasons I suspect begin and end with not being "soap opera pretty" enough. The same might have happened with Beth Ehlers, (oy, Ian Ziering and Paige Turco were greener than grass) except for her chemistry with CTE.

The revolving door of Harts aside, other than David there was not a strong younger male actor to pair her with either. I can appreciate Morgan Englund, but he certainly wasn't either Carl T Evans or Rick Hearst. 

I vote AM/Eleni were the better couple, and had supercouple potential. I actually didn't like Mindy/Nick. I just don't like VI at all, either as Lujack or Nick.

@chrisml I 100% agree.  That death was not thought out.  Ed was not that much of an interesting character to me.  He was the reason Maureen died.  Why would I want to follow his story?

And Rick?  He was a guy that I didn't like at all. So, when I read that Harley and him got together...it boggles my mind!

@Speed Racer  I just didn't like what Alan Michael changed into.  He was a totally different person with Rick Herst. Perhaps I a just wanted Hamp and Gilly still together.  It just didn't click with me for some reason.

 

Edited July 20Jul 20 by MLH

16 minutes ago, Contessa Donatella said:

I remembered it differently. I thought his relative said the best thing would be the cutest boy liked her & only her, implied. Nothing about the guy being older. Interesting, huh?

It was 45 years ago, so yes, could be he said that. But Kelly was significantly older than Morgan, and that was deliberate.

30 minutes ago, Contessa Donatella said:

And guys, don't forget the gay male audience.

There's a whole thing going on over on X right now. Some guy posted pictures of two very buffed actors and said something like, "No one complains about the female gaze in entertainment."

There was an avalanche of responses about how that was ALSO for the male gaze. Then women posted the kind of male actors/characters that they go crazy over, some who would not be considered conventionally attractive. (I pointed out Walton Goggins, who became incredibly popular with women while playing a character who has no nose).

The same with soaps. No one on the face of the earth could have predicted Tony Geary would become one of the most popular male soap actors of all time. You would think, for instance, someone like Frank on GL would be someone the women would go for, and he rates mostly a "meh" with female viewers. (Perhaps it's different with gay male viewers. Though maybe they don't like him either, LOL).

28 minutes ago, P.J. said:

(Good Lord, the endless crooning of "You Needed Me" alone ....)

But as a teen? Sorry, I was hooked by it. Or actually, not sorry. 

I've liked lots of problematic stuff over the years. I hear ya. 😁

1 hour ago, MLH said:

@Contessa Donatella I liked Harley with both versions of Alan Michael. I liked Harley and Nadine more than Reva.  

Me, too! But, it's sorta worse. People I like more than Reva: Harley, Cassie, Olivia, Beth, Vanessa, Alex, India, Blake, Doris. 

People I like less than Reva: Sonia Satra/Lucy

1 hour ago, MLH said:

My taste has changed from when I was viewing Daytime Soaps. Neither of my Grand Mothers watched soaps. My mom did when she wasn't working and basically watched ABC soaps. I only watched bits of storylines during the summer vacation or winter break. I liked Days at the time. I was into Jack Deveraux (I didn't care one way or another about Jennifer), Eve and Izzy B.  I only recall Harley from Guiding Light.  I only remember her and Marah (and Josh). 

Loved OG Eve, loved Isabella, loved Julie, Marlena, OG Laura, Carly, young Jennifer Rose

1 hour ago, MLH said:

I didn't watch Another World, As the World Turns, Guiding Light, Edge of Night, Ryan's Hope, etc.

AW is my forever favorite show. GL 2nd runner up, Santa Barbara 3rd. Never watched EON or RH or Love of Life, or Secret Storm or Where the Heart Is. 

1 hour ago, MLH said:

Now, I can't seem to get into watching old Days of Our Lives and General Hospital episodes.  I was pulled into watching Guiding Light with some post with Roger and Holly's major rape storyline. Maybe, due to not knowing where how major storylines ended. 

And, no current soap has any interest for you? 

35 minutes ago, DeeVee said:

It was 45 years ago, so yes, could be he said that. But Kelly was significantly older than Morgan, and that was deliberate.

There's a whole thing going on over on X right now. Some guy posted pictures of two very buffed actors and said something like, "No one complains about the female gaze in entertainment."

Reminds me if the actresses on the original L Word talking about how women could objectify women. I mean it should be self-evident that lesbians can and do. 

BTW, there I am shallotpeel.