They aren't just giving stories as an afterthought, they're giving stupid, borderline offensive stories?

Where Rauch goes, disinterest or outright hostility towards black characters goes, and Sheffer also enjoyed putting black characters in offensive stories at ATWT, but isn't the lover of "classic" Y&R MAB supposed to understand what black characters have brought to Y&R for 20 years now?

Why is the show actively working to alienate one of their most loyal fanbases?

Well, it may be offensive... but it's been done before, and it does happen in real life. My best friend had a regular sexual relationship with his brother in law. I say she's taking a story in Y&R's past, and trying to give it a twist, or something to make it a "little" different. This Tyra/Devon thing is her "Update" of the Lorie/Mark Henderson SL, I'm tellin you... this is what she's doing!!! She's taking SL's from 20-30 years ago, and putting a slightly new slant on them, and calling it channeling Bill Bell. The only problem is his stories only worked when the pacing was right... and right now, the pacing is sh!t.

Well, it may be offensive... but it's been done before, and it does happen in real life. My best friend had a regular sexual relationship with his brother in law. I say she's taking a story in Y&R's past, and trying to give it a twist, or something to make it a "little" different. This Tyra/Devon thing is her "Update" of the Lorie/Mark Henderson SL, I'm tellin you... this is what she's doing!!! She's taking SL's from 20-30 years ago, and putting a slightly new slant on them, and calling it channeling Bill Bell. The only problem is his stories only worked when the pacing was right... and right now, the pacing is sh!t.

I know people have sexual relationships with their in-laws, or sometimes even their own relatives, but people do all types of things in real life that never make the show.

In-law sex is something soaps have all the time, but it's rare to have two people who grew up as blood relatives, felt no sexual attraction to each other, and then as soon as they find out they aren't related, they want to hump.

Lorie and Mark had no idea they were related when they fell in love. That's one of the reasons why it was probably believable they would still want each other even when they knew it was wrong.

I know what you mean. Bill Bell did some of these types of stories. I just don't think he would have done one like this. This is all Bradley Bell.

I know people have sexual relationships with their in-laws, or sometimes even their own relatives, but people do all types of things in real life that never make the show.

In-law sex is something soaps have all the time, but it's rare to have two people who grew up as blood relatives, felt no sexual attraction to each other, and then as soon as they find out they aren't related, they want to hump.

Lorie and Mark had no idea they were related when they fell in love. That's one of the reasons why it was probably believable they would still want each other even when they knew it was wrong.

I know what you mean. Bill Bell did some of these types of stories. I just don't think he would have done one like this. This is all Bradley Bell.

I know, and you are right. Bill Bell did do these types of stories, so this is why Maria is taking his stuff, turning it around backwards, and thinking it's gonna work. And it just won't. If your'e gonna copy you father in law, Maria.. just COPY HIM EXACTLY. I'd be ok with that. Do the exact same thing Bill did 20-30 years ago, only with different people. At least we know that way, it would be good, and paced right.

MAB needs to be locked in a room and made to watch her father in laws shows from the 80's and 90's to get a clue.

She can't. She's too busy watching LMN, coming up with crappy Restless Style ideas, and shopping at The Grove. She'll tell some staffer to look through the history book instead of doing her own research and understanding why Bill Bell's Y&R worked on more than just a superficial level.

Hogan has little time for black characters (he wrote for a few at ATWT, but completely destroyed their characters and gave them degrading storylines), and Rauch also doesn't. I can believe that MAB is equally uninterested in all races and sexualities but I do think it's interesting that this is the third soap Rauch has gone to where blacks become almost completely irrelevant.

Again, where is the blame for Writer/Producer SHOWRUNNER Maria? She takes full credit for this mess, as she should. She doesn't want too many cooks in the kitchen, well then tell them to find another restaurant.

Even IF Maria was interested in diversity, why the hell is she allowing such degrading stories to happen to her minorities(gay, hispanic, & black)? That's not diversity, that's borderline minstrel show.

This show is indefensible. I really want to know how MAB et al rationalize the decisions they've been making over the past few months.

I want to know how she rationalizes this too. Is this a story Bill Bell would approve of? Are any of these disgusting stories something that he would approve of?

I know, and you are right. Bill Bell did do these types of stories, so this is why Maria is taking his stuff, turning it around backwards, and thinking it's gonna work. And it just won't. If your'e gonna copy you father in law, Maria.. just COPY HIM EXACTLY. I'd be ok with that. Do the exact same thing Bill did 20-30 years ago, only with different people. At least we know that way, it would be good, and paced right.

I highly doubt Maria took this from Y&R's past. I bet this writing staff has no clue who Lorie Brooks even IS.

If you're still tuning in, then this should be a signal to tune out. WTF? Devon f*** his aunt? No build up whatsoever. Yes we know Devon's been crushing on her, but I thought she was so caught up with Neil she wouldn't give him so much as a single thought.

PLEASE, PLEASE let this be all HYPE and just him consoling her because she feels neglected by Neil......

DO NOT GO there with Devon and Tyra. PLEASE!

PLEASE, PLEASE let this be all HYPE and just him consoling her because she feels neglected by Neil......

DO NOT GO there with Devon and Tyra. PLEASE!

PLEASE, PLEASE let this be all HYPE and just him consoling her because she feels neglected by Neil......

DO NOT GO there with Devon and Tyra. PLEASE!

SOAPnet.com is even reporting this as official spoiler. This is a done deal.

SOAPnet.com is even reporting this as official spoiler. This is a done deal.

Sad part is Devon (Bryton McClure has so much potential and better than this).......This is NOT good.

Again, where is the blame for Writer/Producer SHOWRUNNER Maria? She takes full credit for this mess, as she should. She doesn't want too many cooks in the kitchen, well then tell them to find another restaurant.

I'm not trying to absolve her of blame so much as I just ignore her because I think she's irrelevant. She has her "art" stories, and she does the publicity, but otherwise I have a hard time imagining she has a major role. Everything on Y&R now reeks of Rauch and Sheffer.

These faux-incest stories are so stupid. Lorie/Mark, and later on Scott/Cricket, at least there was some dramatic value. People fall in love and then realize they are related.

Where is the dramatic value in people who are raised as blood relatives, show not an inkling of love or lust for each other, and then, a few months after they find out they aren't blood relatives, rip each other's clothes off?

Can you imagine if these people were writing the show in the 80s? John would have found out about Brent Davis and started porking Ashley on the Abbott living room couch.

If this is all Sheffer/Rauch, then Maria needs to step back and quit before what little of her good name is completely ruined. "My show, my vision" will haunt that scabbing hack for her entire tenure.

Can you imagine if these people were writing the show in the 80s? John would have found out about Brent Davis and started porking Ashley on the Abbott living room couch.

Please, don't give them any more ideas. John faked his death because he was too scared to admit his love for Ashley.

Or Ashley could have ghost sex with John while being haunted by Sabrina. Yeah, that's contemporary soap opera storytelling right there.

Whoever gets the most blame, Maria Arena Bell, Hogan Sheffer, and Scott Hamner all suck and have all reeked havoc on various shows before. In Maria's case, she's inexperienced and never really wanted to be a soap opera writer.

How all three of these hacks are in charge of the story content of this show stuns me...

Their vision is corrupt, damaging, and just bad.

I have to say I really upset by this.

I don't understand why Devon isn't portrayed as being a good guy, bet yet hanging out with some of the younger crowd with his girlfriend Roxanne?

It's not that hard is it?

Ashley could have ghost sex with John

That's November sweeps.

This show is starting to feel like a very, very bad version of B&B in an hour long format.

These writers don't learn from this mistakes, Devon having fantasies about Tyra was a FLOP from the beginning, hell Tyra as a character was a flop from the beginning. To act on these twisted fantasies, on a woman he believed was his aunt for most of his life mind you, is just vile and disgusting.

Oh, I have no doubt it will be played as a story of the week and then dropped for a month before being picked up for two days in the other month. The black characters on this show aren't worth it to the idiots in charge.

The back-burner these characters and could care less about developing them, and this is the best they could come up for them? This is shameful and disgusting.

I told you all that Maria Arena Bell, Hogan Sheffer, and Scott Hamner were only going to get worse from now on. They don't learn from their mistakes and everything they seem to do is about providing "shock" and "awe" to this show. It's damaging the show's characters and its overall reputation.

These writers, all of them, need to be fired.

There is no way to defend this crap and such bad storytelling. But I'm sure some will try.

I'm long done with the BnB, but your comments are EXACTLY what I would expect if the BnB went to an hour format. Some fans think that the show could develop storylines in greater depth... I don't see that happening. If you can't tell a well thought out set of storylines in 1/2 hour, an hour could only be twice as painful.

Lesli Kay, Winsor Harmon, and others would still lack airtime (sadly). They would become the Neil Winters, of the BnB.

Devon hot for Tyra? Pathetic. The only thing to make matters worse is having them find out they really ARE related. I've been waiting for one of the Bell soaps to pull this one.