LMAO! I bet!!! I hear it's all the rage in Greece.

Oh! So that's what it was about! I thought you didn't like EA because she didn't end VSD satisfactorily! It's so cute that you can't let go of your show! (And I know that cute sounds like something right out Christel Khalil's mouth. )

Vera was a fine show, I LOVED the beginning of the third season, but the last few months were not what I expected. The Asklipios storyline didn't belong to Vera, but to Lampsi and Aggelos turned into a cartoon villain. But I have loved EA since Kyriakatika

QUOTE (Ann_SS @ May 24 2009, 08:33 AM) *

If Adam seduces Rafe, it is the end of Adam, period. The character will never be able to survive it. Yes, yes, it could be a wonderful story, yada, yada... The fact is that most of Y&R's audience is in the south and older viewers still hold negative attitudes towards homosexuality. I strongly suspect that Chris Engen knew this instantly. It is only matter of time before Adam is killed off. It will eventually be a "who killed Adam" mystery, maybe November sweeps. It was the same thing when Sheffer had Marshall Travers rape Jessica on ATWT. A black male character on a soap cannot survive being a rapist. There are too many societal stereotypes still in place which it make it impossible.

Interesting.

So how would you try to break down those negative attitudes?

MarkH, Ann has a really good point about conservative viewers -- and Y&R apparently has the most conservative soap viewers if you look at ratings breakdowns by cities. I don't have the data in front of me but someone else here might. I've seen city rating breakdowns before on this site.

I don't think it's that conservative viewers would reject a gay character. If Kyle were brought on as gay, it would be accepted. I do think that conservative viewers will not understand how a previously straight Adam can "fake" being gay and it will reinforce their negative stereotype that being gay is a choice and not an inherent part of who you are. The only way this story really works is if Rafe/Adam went the Otalia route were Adam came to realize that he is indeed gay and his feelings for Rafe are real. But can that storyline work in the context of Adam being a blind terrorist?

Ann, I think it's more complicated than the south having conservative viewers. Atlanta is a very liberal gay-friendly city. And anyone who's been to California knows that it's actually a deeply red state with 2 bright blue dots on the map. Even San Diego is more conservative than not.

Edited May 24, 200916 yr by cara mia

This is interesting to me. Can you tell us more about the Greek example?

Sorry for the delay. Well, we obviously don't have a plethora of examples, but I have to disagree that gay characters have been only used as comic relief; I'm sure they have, but I fail to come up with an example of it right now, which might say something (except maybe in Oi Aparadektoi, which was done in... 1990? 1991? Elsa, maybe you can help me?). However, in 504 Xiliometra Voreia Tis Athenas, the show and the main story revolved around a gay person, and it was a sensitively written, touching series. In Kleise Ta Matia, one of the uber soaps, one of the main characters was also gay, out of a total of 2 or 3 gay chars I think (all of them in one show!!!) and the first gay kiss in Greek TV happened there (which, nevertheless, they were fined for). They also had Papakaliatis, which adds one more. Also, Yperoxa Plasmata. Shows like I Polukatoikia, on the other hand, have shown their gay couple live together and kiss, but that's more of a mixed result. What is funny is that, none of the actors playing those gay characters was typecast as a "gay" actor... as a matter of fact, no matter how horrible Oi Aparadektoi's treatment of its gay character seemed to me during the short clips I've seen, his portrayer has never stopped working for the last two decades and is one of the biggest TV actors around here (and, you have to realize, that's saying something, because cinema is close to non-existent. TV is it.)

Anyways, sorry to go off on a tangent. It's just that I don't get why a country were gay people don't really go out being all obvious can have all that, yet the US is so horribly back.

Y&R may have a lot of older,conservative viewers,but so do ATWT and GL.and their ratings declines have not been attributed to the gay storylines.

Adam is doing some drastic things,so coming on to Rafe isn't out of character at this point.

I hope Rafe does get a bit more airtime before this occurs.A scene with Billy,for example.Does Billy know Rafe is gay?does Estella?

Perhaps she should voice some disapproval,which could fit in with this character.She could be a voice for more conservative characters,by saying that she loves him,but not his'lifestyle'

I hope Rafe does get a bit more airtime before this occurs.A scene with Billy,for example.Does Billy know Rafe is gay?does Estella?

Perhaps she should voice some disapproval,which could fit in with this character.She could be a voice for more conservative characters,by saying that she loves him,but not his'lifestyle'

Yes, they need to build on all of that if they want to make this story work.

Anyways, sorry to go off on a tangent. It's just that I don't get why a country were gay people don't really go out being all obvious can have all that, yet the US is so horribly back.

Thank you! I have often wished we could get better international distribution of one another's shows. Maybe with the internet that day is coming.

Y&R may have a lot of older,conservative viewers,but so do ATWT and GL.and their ratings declines have not been attributed to the gay storylines.

Adam is doing some drastic things,so coming on to Rafe isn't out of character at this point.

I hope Rafe does get a bit more airtime before this occurs.A scene with Billy,for example.Does Billy know Rafe is gay?does Estella?

Perhaps she should voice some disapproval,which could fit in with this character.She could be a voice for more conservative characters,by saying that she loves him,but not his'lifestyle'

I agree, Paul Raven. I wonder if the recast is going to slow Rafe's story down a bit...?

Sorry for the delay. Well, we obviously don't have a plethora of examples, but I have to disagree that gay characters have been only used as comic relief; I'm sure they have, but I fail to come up with an example of it right now, which might say something (except maybe in Oi Aparadektoi, which was done in... 1990? 1991? Elsa, maybe you can help me?). However, in 504 Xiliometra Voreia Tis Athenas, the show and the main story revolved around a gay person, and it was a sensitively written, touching series. In Kleise Ta Matia, one of the uber soaps, one of the main characters was also gay, out of a total of 2 or 3 gay chars I think (all of them in one show!!!) and the first gay kiss in Greek TV happened there (which, nevertheless, they were fined for). They also had Papakaliatis, which adds one more. Also, Yperoxa Plasmata. Shows like I Polukatoikia, on the other hand, have shown their gay couple live together and kiss, but that's more of a mixed result. What is funny is that, none of the actors playing those gay characters was typecast as a "gay" actor... as a matter of fact, no matter how horrible Oi Aparadektoi's treatment of its gay character seemed to me during the short clips I've seen, his portrayer has never stopped working for the last two decades and is one of the biggest TV actors around here (and, you have to realize, that's saying something, because cinema is close to non-existent. TV is it.)

Anyways, sorry to go off on a tangent. It's just that I don't get why a country were gay people don't really go out being all obvious can have all that, yet the US is so horribly back.

You are right about all your examples.

Kleise Ta Matia and all Christoforos Papakaliatis's primetime tv series had GREAT representation of gay characters. He is one person whom I want to see write a daily soap opera.

I agree about Polykatoikia being a mixed result and what you said about Aparadektoi. I wasn't watching 504 though. I was talking mostly about all these lousy comedy series where the heroine has a gay best friend, who is usually a disaster.

But the CP shows were indeed great primetime soaps with VERY interesting gay and lesbian characters.

The guy on the right is that primetime writer?

Who? Hamner?

Who? Hamner?

No. Greek guy.

The guy on the right is that primetime writer?

Yes, that's him