3 hours ago, DRW50 said:

@Maxim Great to see your mini-reviews again. There are a number of clips on Youtube of Janice's slow mental breakdown, especially as we go into January 1980. Christine Jones is just superb. She played the hell out of that role.

Something which isn't referenced as much later on is how Mitch pushed Janice's doubts and mental instability for his own ends...until suddenly he didn't want to anymore (I guess he caught on with the audience and the show became wary).

I don't want to post a bunch of clips, but this one has a very good confrontation between Rachel and Janice.

This has a good scene around 7 minutes in where you can see Janice struggling internally with her need to identify herself so much by the men around her, all of which helps lead to her crackup.

 

Thank you. You guys come to the rescue again. I'll take a look later.

 

18 hours ago, Contessa Donatella said:

Janice Frame is Evan's mother. Janice & Mac were together. Janice was up to no good. Mitch was helping her. She was slowly, little by little, every day, POISONING Mac. She was almost successful. In St. Croix, Rachel & Janice began what was literally a physical fight. They fell into the resort swimming pool, continuing to fight each other. Somehow, I guess Janice had it on her, there was a knife in play but Rachel kept Janice from stabbing her & got it away from her & they continued to struggle until Rachel stabbed Janice, which was a death blow. Mitch did a 180 & helped Rachel get Mac to the hospital. He was so weakened by the poison he could not even stand unassisted. It took both of them together to walk him to the hospital but it did save his life. 

The St. Croix remote was SO beautiful, but so dangerous & scary. Also action-packed.

Hooray! Maxim's backSo, I just got home & this is what I found waiting for me. I wrote this several hours ago. I guess I neglected to hit send.

Thank you for the info!!! Now I find myself less confused. You and @DRW50 are amazing.

Edited May 6May 6 by Maxim

4 hours ago, DRW50 said:

@Maxim Great to see your mini-reviews again. There are a number of clips on Youtube of Janice's slow mental breakdown, especially as we go into January 1980. Christine Jones is just superb. She played the hell out of that role.

Something which isn't referenced as much later on is how Mitch pushed Janice's doubts and mental instability for his own ends...until suddenly he didn't want to anymore (I guess he caught on with the audience and the show became wary).

I don't want to post a bunch of clips, but this one has a very good confrontation between Rachel and Janice.

This has a good scene around 7 minutes in where you can see Janice struggling internally with her need to identify herself so much by the men around her, all of which helps lead to her crackup.

 

Thanks for these. I can't recall -- did Evan's vendetta have any position on Mitch, or was it all about Rachel? @Maxim have you seen any Frames intreracting with Mitch in any way?

3 minutes ago, Xanthe said:

Thanks for these. I can't recall -- did Evan's vendetta have any position on Mitch, or was it all about Rachel? @Maxim have you seen any Frames intreracting with Mitch in any way?

I've seen Jason interact with Mitch and annoy him. That's as far as I recall. I didn't even have a slight idea that Evan had a vendetta against Rachel... That came as a surprise to me. I thought Evan was Iris's dog and that's it. Now he's definitely more interesting.

13 minutes ago, Maxim said:

I didn't even have a slight idea that Evan had a vendetta against Rachel... That came as a surprise to me. I thought Evan was Iris's dog and that's it. Now he's definitely more interesting.

I think it was definitely a surprising reveal in the storyline.

I had a hard time appreciating Evan because I couldn't get behind his interest in Amanda. But that's because I never thought Sandra Ferguson made her a compelling character (although to give her credit she occasionally had decent emotional scenes with Mac or Rachel).

1 hour ago, Maxim said:

Thank you for the info!!! Now I find myself less confused. You and @DRW50 are amazing.

So very glad to hear this. Yesterday I suddenly thought; OMG, what about spoilers, have I just  ruined things for Maxim in getting carried away with interest in Evan, who was so well-written & well-acted.

BTW, your fan review of this episode was a sight for eyes that had not seen one of these for a little bit too long, LOL!!! 

Mitch is also fascinating to me but in his case it's because he was all in with Janice & her nefarious plan & then he did this turnabout we've mentioned & he basically got off scot-free.

Edited May 6May 6 by Contessa Donatella

27 minutes ago, Xanthe said:

I think it was definitely a surprising reveal in the storyline.

I had a hard time appreciating Evan because I couldn't get behind his interest in Amanda. But that's because I never thought Sandra Ferguson made her a compelling character (although to give her credit she occasionally had decent emotional scenes with Mac or Rachel).

So far the only interest I've seen from Evan to Amanda has been listening to Iris's orders to go and seduce her.  So far he hasn't been successful... but who knows. Amanda is unbearable at times. Entitled, spoiled... idiotic. Iris... so blatantly manipulating her and Amanda takes the bait. But I guess... when she gets in trouble... she'll have a chance to learn. That's what makes these shows so interesting. 

13 minutes ago, Contessa Donatella said:

So very glad to hear this. Yesterday I suddenly thought; OMG, what about spoilers, have I just  ruined things for Maxim in getting carried away with interest in Evan, who was so well-written & well-acted.

BTW, your fan review of this episode was a sight for eyes that had not seen one of these for a little bit too long, LOL!!! 

Mitch is also fascinating to me but in his case it's because he was all in with Janice & her nefarious plan & then he did this turnabout we've mentioned & he basically got off scot-free.

 

Oh, no, don't worry. You haven't ruined a thing. Evan has not been on my radar that much... he was not one of the characters I was caring particularly... so nothing much has been changed for me. I don't think he has the stuff to ruin Rachel's life. He's just a pretty guy that can follow orders. Iris on the other hand... is dangerous. 💀

 

P.S Maybe Evan will surprise me. Who knows. 

Edited May 6May 6 by Maxim

5 minutes ago, Maxim said:

Oh, no, don't worry. You haven't ruined a thing. Evan has not been on my radar that much... he was not one of the characters I was caring particularly... so nothing much has been changed for me. I don't think he has the stuff to ruin Rachel's life. He's just a pretty guy that can follow orders. Iris on the other hand... is dangerous. 💀

I think of Evan as a smarmy bast*rd. Maybe you'll like that description. You certainly have him pegged correctly since he is just a soldier following "Admiral" Iris's marching orders.

 

Edited May 6May 6 by Contessa Donatella

My view of Evan is that he's smart but not as smart as he thinks he is, not a good guy but not an entirely bad guy - he's a lot of things, the show never quite knowing what to do with them. I never saw him as Iris' follower because Iris always seemed a bit in over her head from the start. 

22 minutes ago, DRW50 said:

My view of Evan is that he's smart but not as smart as he thinks he is, not a good guy but not an entirely bad guy - he's a lot of things, the show never quite knowing what to do with them. I never saw him as Iris' follower because Iris always seemed a bit in over her head from the start. 

His original motives were unclear and all we knew was that he was working for Iris. But when it was revealed that Evan was Janice's son we found out that he had fallen in with Iris not because he wanted to follow Iris specifically but because he had his own anti-Rachel agenda.

Charles Grant had more charisma than the later recast Eric Scott Woods who seemed younger to me. 

6 minutes ago, Xanthe said:

His original motives were unclear and all we knew was that he was working for Iris. But when it was revealed that Evan was Janice's son we found out that he had fallen in with Iris not because he wanted to follow Iris specifically but because he had his own anti-Rachel agenda.

Yes, that's the way it went, the dramatic beats, the increased info dropped. Actually, his being Janice's son was such clever writing, at least IMO. 

6 minutes ago, Xanthe said:

Charles Grant had more charisma than the later recast Eric Scott Woods who seemed younger to me. 

Yes, I was of this same impression. Both were charming but the first ... more layered maybe? More complex? The second maybe less sophisticated. 

3 hours ago, Contessa Donatella said:

Yes, that's the way it went, the dramatic beats, the increased info dropped. Actually, his being Janice's son was such clever writing, at least IMO. 

Yes, I was of this same impression. Both were charming but the first ... more layered maybe? More complex? The second maybe less sophisticated. 

Absolutely great piece of writing revealing Evan being Janice's son. I think a better actress playing Amanda ( not a fan of Sandra Ferguson) may have provided for a great triangle of Evan, Sam, and Amanda.  Each character with a connection to Janice, Mitch and Rachel. 

1 minute ago, jmgaw said:

Absolutely great piece of writing revealing Evan being Janice's son. I think a better actress playing Amanda ( not a fan of Sandra Ferguson) may have provided for a great triangle of Evan, Sam, and Amanda.  Each character with a connection to Janice, Mitch and Rachel. 

I remain fascinated - and confused - by Mitch at this point. WHY did he do the 180?!!!! I felt like Sandi was good but not great & my favorite Amanda was Christine Tucci. Sandy seemed to do her best work when she was pretending to be "Mandy" and that was a relatively short period of time. I agree that the triangle could have been much stronger with a stronger Amanda. And, I think it was a mistake of the writing to saddle her with a child so soon, so young, so inexperienced in living life. Obviously it is a very popular soap mistake!!! 

Amanda getting pregnant didn't help character development and long term harmed the Sam and Amanda relationship. If this story came to be in 1984,  thoughts on Mary Page Keller playing Amanda instead of Sally and her husband Thomas Ian Griffith playing Sam instead of Catlin. And Jack Wagner as Evan. 

23 minutes ago, jmgaw said:

Absolutely great piece of writing revealing Evan being Janice's son. I think a better actress playing Amanda ( not a fan of Sandra Ferguson) may have provided for a great triangle of Evan, Sam, and Amanda.  Each character with a connection to Janice, Mitch and Rachel. 

I don't think Sandra Ferguson was fantastic but I thought she did well enough with the story she was given. She had chemistry with RKK and with Charles Grant and made it understandable why Amanda was torn between the two men. RKK leaving hurt the story but beyond that they didn't try hard enough to make Evan a viable character. After he was written out we just got the triangle with Olivia, which also wasn't viable because they wanted us to root for Sam/Amanda long after viewers had stopped caring.

I thought Sandra Ferguson was charming and quite good as Amanda. I really liked the Sam/Amanda storyline. I think what harmed the storyline is something I mentioned a few pages back. The pacing of the Sam/Amanda/Evan triangle was quite bad and like most of Swajeski's stories, there was no real end game. Poor Olivia. So much potential and then nothing came of it.