13 minutes ago, Vee said:

They thought the country would just right itself if led by example, and they were wrong.

God bless Joe Biden and the rest of the Democratic Party, but I believe they vastly underrated the effect that podcasts and social media has had on this country, and on our youths in particular.  They still don't realize that the America they believe still exists - that is, if it ever existed - died the same morning those two airplanes crashed into the World Trade Center and killed three thousand people.  Those events, on September 11, 2001, exposed us to how vulnerable we truly were to the rest of the world and sowed the seeds of tribalism, cruelty and ignorance that are smothering our government today.

Do you all believe that to rectify the current climate that we are in that we might need to possibly adapt to a more than two-parties? That's where I am at. We're too fragmented to still have two parties. 

1 hour ago, NothinButAttitude said:

Do you all believe that to rectify the current climate that we are in that we might need to possibly adapt to a more than two-parties? That's where I am at. We're too fragmented to still have two parties. 

Not happening in most of our lifetimes, If ever.

2 hours ago, NothinButAttitude said:

Do you all believe that to rectify the current climate that we are in that we might need to possibly adapt to a more than two-parties? That's where I am at. We're too fragmented to still have two parties. 

This has never really been a country which has sustained more than two parties. There's nothing which can be adapted. The media and the GOP will tell you of a "national divorce," but that will just be a buzzword for their plans to have the military take over everything. 

Most of the people who say they want to go third party will just end up supporting Republicans anyway. Most Libertarians do and so do most Greens. It's a sham and a lie.

6 hours ago, Vee said:

Not happening in most of our lifetimes, If ever.

 

5 hours ago, DRW50 said:

This has never really been a country which has sustained more than two parties. There's nothing which can be adapted. The media and the GOP will tell you of a "national divorce," but that will just be a buzzword for their plans to have the military take over everything. 

Most of the people who say they want to go third party will just end up supporting Republicans anyway. Most Libertarians do and so do most Greens. It's a sham and a lie.

I agree.

If anything, I wish that there were NO parties.  But that will never happen either, lol.

More parties wouldn't change the fundamental problem: we have a lazy, stupid, deluded electorate where rural voters have outsized power.

All of these fantasies of "the party has to change" and creating new parties requires people, especially young people, to get off their asses and do some work. That's not going to happen.

Trump's been in office a year and we haven't seen any sustained opposition or rebellion from the public. It's been a couple of feel good rallies where people bring their kids and pets. (We won't see anymore rallies for a while now that the weather is getting colder.) Real resistance requires making your enemy uncomfortable. I'll believe people are serious when we start seeing people burn some MAGA flags. Instead they are screaming at Schumer, Jeffries and Harris because they are too weak and scared to take the fight to the real enemy and because of what I've started calling Overseer Syndrome. Too many believe the Democratic Party is a reality show where they all get a vote on who gets to stay or go. ("Primary everybody! So and so needs to go!")

Look at where we are right now: government is reopened, Federal workers are getting paid and back pay, people are getting their SNAP benefits, and the Epstein emails have been released. Maybe it's time to admit that the Dems knew what they were doing and had a strategy.

9 minutes ago, marceline said:

Look at where we are right now: government is reopened, Federal workers are getting paid and back pay, people are getting their SNAP benefits, and the Epstein emails have been released. Maybe it's time to admit that the Dems knew what they were doing and had a strategy.

Unfortunately, no apparatus is in place to remind people of that fact loudly and often.  Instead, we have a media that will literally Tootsie Roll themselves into the GOP's laps at every opportunity, forcing Democrats to do damage control or play catch-up even when they aren't the ones who need to do it.

Edited November 13Nov 13 by Khan

15 minutes ago, marceline said:

Trump's been in office a year and we haven't seen any sustained opposition or rebellion from the public. It's been a couple of feel good rallies where people bring their kids and pets. (We won't see anymore rallies for a while now that the weather is getting colder.) Real resistance requires making your enemy uncomfortable.

Here's my thinking: there hasn't been as much resistance this time around, either because 1) people are just plain burned out by it all, or 2) they've reasoned that resisting just doesn't work with Trump or the GOP, or 3) a combination thereof.

I would agree that it all has to play itself out before we get it through our thick-ass skulls, but the truth is, even as I was standing in line for two hours earlier this week for a free pizza (on account of being a SNAP recipient), I knew in my heart that most of the folks standing in line with me would still vote for Trump again if given the chance.

Edited November 13Nov 13 by Khan

24 minutes ago, marceline said:

Instead they are screaming at Schumer, Jeffries and Harris because they are too weak and scared to take the fight to the real enemy and because of what I've started calling Overseer Syndrome. Too many believe the Democratic Party is a reality show where they all get a vote on who gets to stay or go. ("Primary everybody! So and so needs to go!")

All I can say to those folks is, "Maybe next time, when we tell you that our democracy is on the line, and the GOP say what they mean and mean what they say, y'all should just shut the [!@#$%^&*] up about Bernie and AOC and vote."

Edited November 13Nov 13 by Khan

6 hours ago, marceline said:

More parties wouldn't change the fundamental problem: we have a lazy, stupid, deluded electorate where rural voters have outsized power.

All of these fantasies of "the party has to change" and creating new parties requires people, especially young people, to get off their asses and do some work. That's not going to happen.

Trump's been in office a year and we haven't seen any sustained opposition or rebellion from the public. It's been a couple of feel good rallies where people bring their kids and pets. (We won't see anymore rallies for a while now that the weather is getting colder.) Real resistance requires making your enemy uncomfortable. I'll believe people are serious when we start seeing people burn some MAGA flags. Instead they are screaming at Schumer, Jeffries and Harris because they are too weak and scared to take the fight to the real enemy and because of what I've started calling Overseer Syndrome. Too many believe the Democratic Party is a reality show where they all get a vote on who gets to stay or go. ("Primary everybody! So and so needs to go!")

Look at where we are right now: government is reopened, Federal workers are getting paid and back pay, people are getting their SNAP benefits, and the Epstein emails have been released. Maybe it's time to admit that the Dems knew what they were doing and had a strategy.

And now millions of people are able to be kicked off their health insurance because the ACA subsidies are about to expire next month. How long before the ACA completely dies off and insurance companies end up kicking off millions more people all because they have pre-existing conditions? Hell, I might end up losing my health insurance at this rate because I have numerous pre-existing conditions and so do my parents. Not to mention that now the Republicans want to push a national abortion ban in their next upcoming bill as well as a ban on hemp THC products. So yeah, screw the Republicans and Democrats. 

 

1 hour ago, MissPhoenixGirl92 said:

So yeah, screw the Republicans and Democrats. 

This is an example of toxic privilege. I can't take anyone seriously still out here with "both sides are the same" after everything we've seen. One side wants to kill us all and the other doesn't.

 

Let's be honest: the GOP was going to kill the ACA, government shutdown or no government shutdown.  I don't blame the Democrats for doing what they could to save it, but as I've said before, they're being naive if they think they can.  The GOP is out to delegitimize Barack Obama's presidency and erase him from history; and it's our ignorant asses who gave them the tools to do it.  Period.

All of this became inevitable when Trump won and voters gave Republicans the Senate and the House.

This is what a majority of the public wanted. They were warned, again and again. This is the end result. 

They can't blame anyone but themselves. It's not both sides bad. It's Republicans and the cult who loves them. They have sent us all to hell and they don't deserve a free pass. No more centrist equivocation. 

1 minute ago, DRW50 said:

They can't blame anyone but themselves. It's not both sides bad. It's Republicans and the cult who loves them. 

THIS.

I remind myself this every single day. People chose this. THEY KNEW THIS would happen and chose this. They chose to TRY to destroy us. That's why I have cut contact with anyone that supports this kind of agenda in any kind of way. I mean - I see 1 single "like" on social media where you support people like this - I don't care if you are my uncle or cousin - I BLOCK YOU. The moment you hit that like button you supported regime that wants to rob me of my rights and freedoms... I am done with you forever. No going back. No giving second chances. We don't have time for this anymore. Sh-t has hit the fan. They are on their own now. They can cry-wolf that they made a mistake all the want. I'm not going back.