15 minutes ago, Khan said:

Probably, lol.  Unfortunately, I think the same might be true today for "The Cosby Show" and "Roseanne."  As a matter of fact, I really can't think of any Carsey/Werner-produced show that's still maintaining a presence in syndication or streaming today.  Not just HI, "Cosby" and "Roseanne,"* but others like "Cybill," "Grace Under Fire" and even "3rd Rock from the Sun" seem to have "disappeared," for lack of a better word. 

Of course, "That '70's Show" might be the one exception, since they've got that "sequel series" still happening over at Netflix.  (Is it still happening, lol?)

(*ETA: I take that back: AFAIK, Cozi-TV still runs "Roseanne" every night, but that's pretty much it, lol.)

Haha well summed up!

Not that I ever found Home Improvement a great show like I did with early Cosby and early Roseanne, but at least early Home Improvement was fun. The later seasons were I recall usually all about Jill being a raging psychopath with Patricia Richardson chewing the scenery while the BTS drama was more interesting than what we saw on screen…or at least that’s how I remember it LOL.

But you’re right about Casey/Werner shows falling out with the passage of time. Grace Under Fire imploded infamously while it was still on the air as did Cybill. I’m not sure what happened to 3rd Rock From the Sun. I mean funny little show at the time that ran for years but never gained an audience or a cult following. 
 

I did see “That 90’s Show” has been renewed for a 3rd season, but since Seasons 1&2 took place in 1995 and 1996 it’s safe to assume there’s nothing beyond a season 5.

 

For now I think Seinfeld, Friends, and the X-Files stood the test of time. 

Also re E/R as I stated it never moved timeslots.

NBC were never tempted to use it to boost another night and place a new show Thurs @ 10.

A rare moment of restraint.

15 hours ago, soapfan770 said:

The later seasons were I recall usually all about Jill being a raging psychopath with Patricia Richardson chewing the scenery while the BTS drama was more interesting than what we saw on screen…or at least that’s how I remember it LOL.

That's how I remember it, too, lol.  But I tend not to blame Patricia Richardson, because I don't believe she (or her character) was treated fairly at all by the producers or the network.  (To me, it says alot that she admits that she and Tim Allen have not kept in touch over the years, despite her guest-starring role on "Last Man Standing").

Edited September 6, 20241 yr by Khan

Did the 1990s have a definitive family sitcom? The big ones I'd say were Roseanne, Home Improvement, and maybe Everybody Loves Raymond.

Roseanne peak 1990-1993 but that era was 1980s hangover plus the remaining big 1980s family sitcoms (The Cosby Show, Who's the Boss?, Growing Pains) were winding down.

Home Improvement peak was 1993-1997 and this overlaps with Roseanne winding down.

Everybody Loves Raymond showed growth 1998-2000 and this overlaps with Home Improvement winding down. Everybody Loves Raymond didn't crack the Top 10 until 2000/01 and it was a Top 10 show for the rest of its run so maybe its more associated with the early 2000s.

I think most of us consider Seinfeld and Friends as the definitive friendship sitcoms of the 1990s.

What would we define "Frasier" as, besides a show we loved before we knew more about Kelsey Grammer than we should've?

3 hours ago, Khan said:

What would we define "Frasier" as, besides a show we loved before we knew more about Kelsey Grammer than we should've?

Fraiser is a unique blend of both a family and workplace sitcom to me. 

Would The Simpsons count as the definitive 90’s sitcom lol? 
 

6 hours ago, Khan said:

That's how I remember it, too, lol.  But I tend not to blame Patricia Richardson, because I don't believe she (or her character) was treated fairly at all by the producers or the network.  (To me, it says alot that she admits that she and Tim Allen have not kept in touch over the years, despite her guest-starring role on "Last Man Standing").

Oh I can totally see that and definitely feel bad for her. I remember seeing  Richardson give a bad performance on an early SVU episode but by the time she was doing Strong Medicine and was on The West Wing she finally shook off that ranting and raving Jill Taylor persona and did well. 

6 minutes ago, soapfan770 said:

Would The Simpsons count as the definitive 90’s sitcom lol? 

Yeah, I never thought of The Simpsons. Mainly because it's animated and on Fox.

I can't believe The Simpsons 35th anniversary is in December. I don't think I've watched a live episode of The Simpsons in something like 25 years.

24 minutes ago, kalbir said:

I can't believe The Simpsons 35th anniversary is in December. I don't think I've watched a live episode of The Simpsons in something like 25 years.

I pretty much stopped watching "The Simpsons" when Mike Scully became showrunner.  "The Simpsons" might've been an animated series, but Scully's the one who turned it into a cartoon.   

38 minutes ago, soapfan770 said:

I remember seeing  Richardson give a bad performance on an early SVU episode but by the time she was doing Strong Medicine and was on The West Wing she finally shook off that ranting and raving Jill Taylor persona and did well. 

To be fair, I think most performances on SVU tend to be awful, especially in the earlier seasons, before Warren Leight came aboard and improved the writing.

31 minutes ago, Khan said:

I pretty much stopped watching "The Simpsons" when Mike Scully became showrunner.  "The Simpsons" might've been an animated series, but Scully's the one who turned it into a cartoon.   

Oh for sure I remember it was around 99/00 when I just kind of stopped watching The Simpsons as it got dumbed down especially with the rise of South Park and Family Guy that same year or so.

A few months back caught a good chunk of  the 1992-95 episodes being aired on FXX I hadn’t seen in ages and found myself laughing out loud. While the show sometimes had wacky plots like Homer suing an all you can eat buffet after they ran out of food and their counter suit for him overeating lol, I forgot there was a lot of heart, charm and intelligence to the show and yet it also seemed so innocent in retrospective.

Whether you were a fan or not, I do think Seinfeld and ER earned their right as definitive 90's shows in their respective categories. Not only were they commercially successful pop cultural juggernauts that people/families build their Thursday's around, they were also critically successful and are still held in great regard even today. 

Speaking of ER, even with the grit and relative medical realness, it could also be a very character-driven/focused and touching show. Mark Greene had one of the best character arcs on all of television, IMO. I can almost tear up right now just thinking about his ultimate death in season 8, and that amazing sequence at the end with his daughter, Rachel, letting go of the balloon (as Mark said she always did when she was younger before he died) as a tribute to her late father and to let him know that she was going to be OK. When it was great, ER had some amazing writing, acting, and directing.  

 

Edited September 7, 20241 yr by BetterForgotten

Looking at the big three network's line up of dramas that premiered in the 1990s which ran 5 or more seasons, a good number of them seem to be forgotten.

CBS: Walker, Texas Ranger (9); Touched by an Angel (9), JAG (9), Diagnosis: Murder (8), Northern Exposure (6); Dr. Quinn, Medicine Woman (6); Chicago Hope (6), Nash Bridges (6), Judging Amy (6). Touched by an Angel was a rare bright spot in the primetime mess era. JAG spun off NCIS, which is now CBS's longest-running primetime drama and there's also the NCIS franchise.

ABC: NYPD Blue (12), The Practice (8), The Commish (5). NYPD Blue I would say is the second definitive drama of the 1990s. The Practice didn't really take off until it became the lead out of Millionaire (yes, I consider The Practice a time slot hit).

NBC: Law & Order: Special Victims Unit (season 26 about to start), original Law & Order (20), ER (15), Homicide: Life on the Street (7), The West Wing (7), Sisters (6), Third Watch (6), Providence (5). We all consider ER the definitive drama of the 1990s. Original Law & Order and The West Wing were Top 10 shows in the 2000s.

45 minutes ago, kalbir said:

 NYPD Blue I would say is the second definitive drama of the 1990s. 

And my favorite Blake, Sherry Stringfield, was on both! I never got over her leaving GL, but as a young kid, I was so happy when she landed on ER (I never really watched NYPD Blue). It doesn’t take a whole lot to make us soap fans proud and happy sometimes, lol. 

Edited September 7, 20241 yr by BetterForgotten

On 9/6/2024 at 10:45 PM, BetterForgotten said:

And my favorite Blake, Sherry Stringfield, was on both! I never got over her leaving GL, but as a young kid, I was so happy when she landed on ER (I never really watched NYPD Blue). It doesn’t take a whole lot to make us soap fans proud and happy sometimes, lol. 

Sherry was so amazing on ER in those early years and Susan was a favorite character of mine for sure.

The only downside of course was Sherry leaving both NYPD Blue and ER so soon and that lead to a bit of reputation of “quitter” if I recall. Not as bad as David Caruso’s career between NYPD Blue and CSI Miami though. Stringfield’s decisions were for personal reasons (for better or for worse). She had prioritized what she wanted to do and not what others wanted her to do. That had consequences for both the TV show and her.

It was devastating when Susan left the 1st time. I remember being  upset. It was “The Show to Watch” at the time. When she came back I just don’t think the writers knew what to do with her. Five years had passed, the lightning in a bottle was gone and the other characters had moved on or new characters had been added, not mention ER had become the Abby hour by that point. 

They just never figured out what to do with her and Stringfield left again four seasons later. I’ve read Sherry had secondary reasons for leaving for a pilot in 2006 she was guaranteed over at CBS or something but the pilot wasn’t picked up last minute and after that her acting career became way scaled back again to the point she hasn’t been onscreen for several years now. 

Several press articles/op-ed pieces have been written this week to celebrate the 30th Anniversary of ER's premiere (today is the actual 30th anniversary).

ER’s 30th Anniversary: How George Clooney and Julianna Margulies Honor Doug and Carol Three Decades Later

How ‘ER’ helped me confront death: A reflection on the medical drama’s 30th anniversary