(Not diminishing your enthusiasm one bit...because I think Bergman DESERVES each of his Emmys...but the only problem I have with that moist-eyed Jack is that it is not the Jack I first loved [Terry Lester's]. So, when Bergman is knocking it out of the park I am still...two decades later...still wondering where his sensitivity came from.)

I miss TL's Jack as well, but I think what Jack said today makes sense. How many times has he failed at marriage because he gave up too quickly. In his own words he's "thrown people away". I think throwing people away is kind of a young man's game. *looks at Billy* I can completely believe that a 50 year old Jack has changed into someone who is a lot more willing to accept people faults and all. Now that Sharon has screwed him over, maybe he'll turn into a more bitter Jack again.

See, I look at it from another angle. If Mary Jane ends up being who we think it is, then what we're seeing is the evolution of Jack into a man who is much more similar to John Abbott, finally letting go of the man he was before, a man completely driven by his own desires no matter who he hurt, and stepping into his father's shoes - just as he's faced with a living breathing symbol of what a deplorable human being he was. Also, we haven't seen Jack have any need for revenge against Victor since the diary. Sure, there are snide comments, but Jack appears to be moving on, focusing on love and family in a way he never could before. Unlike Victor, whose whole purpose with Mary Jane was to help bring about Jack's ruin somehow.

And just as Jack embraces the future his father wanted for him, he's confronted by his own horrible past and who he used to be. So I'm okay with the "kinder, gentler" Jack for now, because I'm curious what it will mean three months or six months or a year from now when all of this blows up in his face and he wants vengeance. Which Abbott man will he choose to emulate - his father, or the Jack Abbott he was in his youth?

Whew! Deep! Wow! Yes, if your theory is right, and Jack has "evolved", then it will be interesting to see if he can maintain that in the face of Adam's evil deeds against Ashley, Victor's single-minded purpose for revenge, Mary Jane's machinations, Nick continuing in Sharon's orbit, troublesome younger brother Billy. It would be very difficult for someone to remain a 'better man' in the presence of all those temptations to backslide into bitterness.

I liked your line about "living breathing symbol of what a deplorable human being he was". (By the way...when John finally said what I was thinking -- Jack, you SLEPT WITH YOUR FATHER'S WIFE--the writers earned a point or two with me! But using John in this new more effective way -- a voice for his whole family -- is what I always wanted when they decided to go the ghost-route). It's not just Billy who is a reminder. It is also, we think, soon, Mary Jane. He will be confronted with the lifetime of scars he created.

I miss TL's Jack as well, but I think what Jack said today makes sense. How many times has he failed at marriage because he gave up too quickly. In his own words he's "thrown people away". I think throwing people away is kind of a young man's game. *looks at Billy* I can completely believe that a 50 year old Jack has changed into someone who is a lot more willing to accept people faults and all. Now that Sharon has screwed him over, maybe he'll turn into a more bitter Jack again.

But I am confused...whom has Jack ever "thrown away"? There was Patty, sure. And maybe Phyllis (when he chose revenge on Victor rather than Phyllis)--but in the end it was Phyllis who did the decisive throwing. I guess he threw away Diane...but she threw him away first. Nikki definitely was the discarder, not the discarded.

I guess my point is that Jack was a louse...but his use of women as disposable items really ended with Terry Lester. With regard to women, Jack's been the committed doggy since PB took over and married Nikki.

I wish I could get on this Shack train . But because Sharon has never, for an instant, given her heart to him...it is hard for me. I wonder if Sharon Case will EVER play love (not gratitude) with Bergman?

Bring back Phack!

Bring back Phack!

No thanks. It may happen, but I'm not interested in seeing that at all. I'm ready for all of the people in the quad to take a bit f a rest. The cast is big enough that it would be doable at least short term.

Bring back Phack!

Jack and Phyllis' scenes this week were golden and reminded me and I think reminded most people how brilliant these two were together. I definitely think once all the Patty Jane stuff is resolved, Jack and Phyllis will definitely be back together romantically. Michelle Stafford has got to be the comeback story of the year in daytime. Her acting has risen to another level here after years of showing no enthusiasm or growth as an actress. I am back to loving my girl Phyllis! Everyone involved in this quad (except Josh Morrow) is giving us emmy worthy stuff. It really has elevated Sharon Case too. She has never had a story like this. Its fantastic to watch.

No thanks. It may happen, but I'm not interested in seeing that at all. I'm ready for all of the people in the quad to take a bit f a rest. The cast is big enough that it would be doable at least short term.

I don't mean immediately, I meant over time.

The last thing I want is another bore like Phick.

I don't mean immediately, I meant over time.

The last thing I want is another bore like Phick.

At this point, it would feel like Phyllis is settling for Jack. She said right to his face two days ago that she loved Nick more. Maybe I could buy them in a few years, but right now it would just feel like a default pairing.

I wish I could get on this Shack train . But because Sharon has never, for an instant, given her heart to him...it is hard for me. I wonder if Sharon Case will EVER play love (not gratitude) with Bergman?

Nope. She was very clear with fans last fall that, to her, Shack was just together for a couple of years to make it look good. Now, that was the actress speaking and not TPTB. The show had other ideas because even after she spoke out to fans, they still had them "together" in some way.

Perhaps she has changed her mind but I see no evidence of it. I'm also biased.

At this point, it would feel like Phyllis is settling for Jack. She said right to his face two days ago that she loved Nick more. Maybe I could buy them in a few years, but right now it would just feel like a default pairing.

That comment was absurd, Nick hasn't done half of what Jack's done for her. Maybe seeing her marriage crumble propelled Phyllis to say that, but I still don't perceive Phick to have half the depth that Phack did and STILL have.

I guess Phyllis probably thought that after years of failed relationships and her being the source of most of the dysfunction, she was going to finally have a happy family. But this time, it wasn't her screwing things up, it was Nick. But she should know once a cheater, always a cheater. They began a marriage out of an affair, did she really expect Nick to always be faithful to her and not have any trust issues?

I definitely agree on eventually having Phack back... but I never want to see Shack/Phick again...

No thanks. It may happen, but I'm not interested in seeing that at all. I'm ready for all of the people in the quad to take a bit f a rest. The cast is big enough that it would be doable at least short term.

Agreed. I think that Sharon needs to get single, figure herself out, and then merge with someone who will FINALLY INJECT FUN INTO HER LIFE. Yes, Billy.

Jack needs to be ALONE. Embittered, lonely Jack works best for me.

Phyllis needs to be pursued by a wonderful man who loves her for whom she is...and he needs to (through his love) build her confidence and self-esteem.

Nick..well...needs a plane crash.

Best of all in the above scenario: Chloe is a free agent! Poor P3!

Jack F. Smith loved Nick and Sharon and Jack and Phyllis separately, so he couldn't resist bringing these two couples together in some way. The only bad thing is, they've been stuck together ever since.

Edited May 29, 200916 yr by Y&RWorldTurner

That comment was absurd, Nick hasn't done half of what Jack's done for her. Maybe seeing her marriage crumble propelled Phyllis to say that, but I still don't perceive Phick to have half the depth that Phack did and STILL have.

I guess Phyllis probably thought that after years of failed relationships and her being the source of most of the dysfunction, she was going to finally have a happy family. But this time, it wasn't her screwing things up, it was Nick. But she should know once a cheater, always a cheater. They began a marriage out of an affair, did she really expect Nick to always be faithful to her and not have any trust issues?

In which case, Phyllis better stay clear of Jack because he's been a cheater too. Actually, so is Phyllis. Anyway, being in love with someone isn't about what they can do for you. If it were, Sharon should be in love with Jack. I don't see any depth with Phack at this point. Phyllis never would have dissed him like she did if she had any consideration for him at all. I'd much rather see Jack and Phyllis both find new people.

That comment was absurd, Nick hasn't done half of what Jack's done for her. Maybe seeing her marriage crumble propelled Phyllis to say that, but I still don't perceive Phick to have half the depth that Phack did and STILL have.

I guess Phyllis probably thought that after years of failed relationships and her being the source of most of the dysfunction, she was going to finally have a happy family. But this time, it wasn't her screwing things up, it was Nick. But she should know once a cheater, always a cheater. They began a marriage out of an affair, did she really expect Nick to always be faithful to her and not have any trust issues?

Well, I'm not sure it was absurd, but I respect your opinion.

I thought Phyllis was speaking her heart. Alas, Nick is going to stomp all over it.

Jack F. Smith loved Nick and Sharon and Jack and Phyllis separately, so he couldn't resist bringing these two couples together in some way. The only bad thing is, they've been stuck together ever since.

In which case, Phyllis better stay clear of Jack because he's been a cheater too. Actually, so is Phyllis. Anyway, being in love with someone isn't about what they can do for you. If it were, Sharon should be in love with Jack. I don't see any depth with Phack at this point. Phyllis never would have dissed him like she did if she had any consideration for him at all. I'd much rather see Jack and Phyllis both find new people.

Pretty much.