Gray Bunny

I was just referring to Jo & Billy interaction in the FIRST season. @Huntress I *think* they establish Sydney is 21 years old when she first appears, visiting Jane in the first season. I was always under the impression, based on the first season, that Jane and Michael were slightly older than the rest, and by slightly older, I mean like 25-26. It's funny how in the first season, they showcased every day problems and focused on all the little nuances (well, in Alison and Billy's lives anyhow), yet so many fine details of every day life are completely glossed over once the plot goes into turbo-drive. For instance, we never saw Alison do any kind of adjusting to moving to Hong Kong. We never even saw where she lived, much less figure out how to get around in a country completely foreign to her. Instead, all we saw was her in her office and some occasional street shots in LA with her male co-worker. Also, in season 4, remember when Alison and Billy were flying in a private plane that crashed and went down? Oh that's right. It all happened offscreen. Instead, Brooke and Hayley get word the plane is missing, and the next scene is Billy and Alison enjoying a cozy fire in the wilderness as they casually await being rescued. Season 1 Alison would've been losing her mind with worry and wonder.

:::shrug::: Pack a swimsuit. I hear Hell is hot.

I agree with a lot of what you said. I didn't mind Andrew Shue's limited acting in the first 3 seasons. Yeah, there were a couple clunkers, but it kind of went with Billy's then-naive nature. I see what you mean how his being new to the Melrose building allowed us to be introduced to the whole gang. [Side Note: I TOTALLY noticed the repeat storylines re: Dylan vs. Jake and Brandon vs. Billy] I haven't gone back through the beginnings of this Melrose thread (and Lordy knows I contributed A LOT to this thread!) but I found it funny how the first season established many characters as being just out of college. You are correct about Billy. Moving in with Alison was his first step into adulthood, moving out of his parents' house. Meanwhile, the pilot episode has Alison saying she's a 23-year-old young professional. Hard to imagine that 2.5 years later, with multiple missteps in her career plus a recent rehab stint along the way, she's suddenly President of D&D. But by the time they hit the third season, they leapfrogged everyone into middle & upper management. With that change, people like Billy were no longer naive and optimistic. Instead, he became one with the bitter and sardonic. For as much as Billy enjoyed a very brief return to being carefree when he proposed to Brooke on the pier, almost immediately after they got married he seemed like the most miserable person in the world. It's like the character had instant buyer's remorse after he said, "I Do." The one bad acting moment I recently saw that definitely took me out of the scene was when Billy accused Brooke of cheating on him with Antonio Sabato Jr.'s character. His "you're cheating on me?" remark seemed more like a smarmy joke than an actual accusation. Yes, Billy's mom carried a torch for Alison when he got married to Sam. I wasn't a huge fan of the actress who played Billy's sister. Every time she said the phrase, "little brother," I cringed. As I'm halfway through S4 again now, my mind isn't fresh on the S5 & S6 messiness, but Billy & Sam was the worst pairing on this show ever. Ever. In the 1st season, there was one single interaction between Jo and Billy in the episode when his father died. Maybe they were chemistry testing the characters, or it was just character development, or maybe they just needed to fill time. But yeah, that was their only scene alone together. I also enjoyed how Billy and Amanda maintained a friendship and always looked out for one another, even if for selfish reasons (usually on Amanda's part).

Yup, it's casually "revealed" in the pilot episode when Billy moves in and Matt and Rhonda introduce themselves. After Billy exits, Matt says, "he's cute." And Rhonda says, "Nuh uh, I saw him first!"

@Brolden Love your assessment of Alison. When Melrose started out, it was indeed Alison, Billy, and Jake as the main characters. Jane & Michael usually had stand alone storylines that were wrapped in one episode (as nearly all storylines were during the first half) or weren't featured at all, just as Matt, Rhonda, and Sandy had intermittent storylines. What I loved about the first season and to a lesser degree the second season, is that we really got to know the characters. Especially Alison and Billy. We understood their values, their ambitions, their hopes in a romantic partner, etc. Despite her raging alcoholism (which was actually pretty organic to the character and all she suffered leading up to it) and her brief stint being a corporate monster, Alison was always one of my all-time favorites. The ad-exec-turned-Shooters-waitress is one of the biggest WTF's for character development. Seeing all the back 'n forth misses in the 3rd and 4th season between Billy and Alison is aggravating as a viewer because you knew they were meant to be together in the end, just as Jo and Jake should've been endgame.

@Antoyne +2 I think RHONY is in a much stronger, stabler place than they were in Season 4 when Bethenny left and they tried their best to make rivalries that went nowhere (Ramona vs. Kelly, Sonja vs. Cindy). Plus, the Season 5 purge.... Nowadays, you've got strong anchors with Ramona, LuAnn, Dorinda, and Sonja. The ups and downs they've been through make their history and present-day interactions intriguing. With Bravo cleaning house at the OC, BH's anchor gone, NYC's main anchor gone, and ATL's Nene being phased out (?), I can see why veterans like Ramona and LuAnn might be worried. It was reported that within days after Tamra was fired, Ramona was calling her in a panic, fearing she could be next. But here's the thing (may be just my opinion, but): To me, New York City has never felt played out these past five years. Their real life drama and their on-screen antics are still entertaining. The fact that so many of them are actual friends in real life helps keep this show chugging along.

RHONY season 12 trailer is dropping next week!!! According to Ramona on Insta

Agreed! I too was surprised when she finally made the opening credits because in all honesty, as much as I loved Kimberly and Marcia Cross, I think anything post-explosion was a stretch of anything reality-based, including her being a free woman a mere two months after the blast. Quite honestly, at the time when I originally watched, it would've been a satisfying crazy ending if she hadn't survived her own bombing. Richard Hart (Muldoon) was the biggest Debbie Downer and dragged the mood down in every single scene. From the moment the 4th season began, any scene with him and Jane was just a cesspool of misery and petty barking at her. And Jo/Richard? That was an oddball pairing. Some of the male characters brought on in later years (Richard, Craig, Coop) were such Negative-Nancy Debbie Downers. Thank goodness we had devilish & dopey Michael, or even dumb & clueless Billy to balance it out.

I don’t know if this has been posted online but I just saw on NBC Nightly News that among the stars being featured in Super Bowl ads, there’s one of Teresa and Caroline Manzo together! They’re in an all red room sitting together at a table. Apparently it’s for a brand of hummus.

Ugh. The biggest WTF ever was having Alison give up the advertising world altogether to serve drinks at Shooters. Alison was motivated to succeed from day one. Talk about writing for sets and convenience. Alison and Jake, two of Melrose's most successful characters, together became a vortex of suckage as a couple.

I agree with you there; she probably wouldn't have fit into the melodrama that Melrose became. I loved when Jasmine Guy was briefly on the show in Season 3, and had they written it in such a way, they could've kept her character longterm or brought her back, just as they were able to bring Peter Burns back. I loved the tension between her and Amanda. I also liked Alycia Barnett (Anne-Marie Johnson) too. I also agree they should've kept former characters "alive" by mentioning them more often. Even when Jo left after season 4, there was nary a mention of her again, not even by Jake. When Rhonda left, I remember Matt mentions her in like the second or third episode of the new season. Otherwise, he mentions her one more time as he's recalling his time at Melrose when he leaves the series. One thing Melrose was good at for the most part, though, was bringing back key parents of the main characters... Jane & Sydney's mom and dad, Billy's mom, Matt's mom and dad, Kimberly's mom, etc.

That was her in a nutshell. With those early Season 1 episodes, some characters like Sandy only had storylines on select episodes, unlike Billy and Alison which were the main leads the entire season. Did you also notice her accent disappeared? I actually agree that she could've worked had they brought her back in later years. Hell, you know Michael Mancini would've tried to hit that. I'm watching the early episodes of season 4 currently and I agree that it's still the final waning days of their "glory era." What I liked about Seasons 1-4 that ended in the 5th season is that the show would introduce new characters into the fold without giving them a contract right off the bat, so if it didn't work out with the audience or if the character served best in a single storyline arc, they would be written off. EDIT: Speaking of "cartoon characters," I don't think Melrose started turning their characters into caricatures until the 4th season. Case in point: Sydney suddenly wearing 60's go-go outfits and being all over-the-top prissy cutesy. That is NOTHING like how she was as madam-in-the-making 2nd season. The show started adding in a lot of humor to scenes with Michael, Sydney, Peter etc. which made them less believable. By Seasons 6 and 7, Michael is a total boob.

WOW. Still going through all the comments here but couldn't believe hearing the news about Vicki and then Tamra over the weekend. This is right up there with NYC's purge of 2011. Vicki and Tamra have been the anchors for over 10 years, love 'em or hate 'em. It's sad that this is how Vicki went out, and production certainly did her dirty. I guess we'll never get an epic Tamra Sue takedown (paging Lizzie -- stat!), but the worst of all this is that Kelly Dodd no doubt feels triumphant in kicking off the two longest running castmembers and thinks she's the new Queen Bee that everyone wants to see... No honey... You may be friends with Ramona Singer, but you are not a Ramona. You are more like your other friend, Brandi Glanville... Agreed, a thousand percent (© Jill Zarin) Lordy... her tone deafness continues... I don't think she realized what she was saying. She was probably thinking "phys ed" not special ed. No pessimism detected here! I agree and thought the same exact thing when those scenes were playing out. I never hated Tamra, but I didn't exactly root for her either. I felt she was a necessary evil that sometimes made good jokes. That's always been my thing with OC; they're not people I necessarily root for, or that I have my *favorites* like a Vanderpump or Ramona or The Grande Dame. In fact, up until Margaret joined New Jersey, I've felt that whole cast has been mostly unlikable too (Teresa's daughters are her saving grace) for the past 6-7 years.

I think it's pretty groundbreaking that SNL, who had a long history of distasteful gay-hating jokes throughout the 80's and 90's, is having RuPaul host. Taking a look back, and even 12 years ago when RuPaul's Drag Race began, he didn't get to make appearances on late-night talk shows and popular daytime shows like he does now. It's pretty remarkable how Drag Race has only grown in popularity over the years (despite some clunker seasons) and it's not just a cult hit, but a mainstream hit now. Side note: I'm sure RuPaul's episode will give a lot of great material for newcomer Bowen Yang, whom I absolutely *love*! He's become an instant hit, IMO, right out of the gate.

We look forward to hearing from you I randomly started to rewatch Seasons 1&2 last January and I've picked it up again at Season 3 (must be a January thing for me). Currently on the season finale and will get into the 4th tomorrow.

Yup. Exactly.

Total clickbait. Love her or hate her, people are going to read and respond to what she has to say. But yes, there is an unnatural, unjustifiable hatred towards this woman and all the evils she hasn't done. Sigh... We should've done away with the electoral college after Bush/Gore 2000...

Wow, this could backfire on Nene, even though it wasn't her idea for Wendy to air it out. I could see Bravo/Andy getting a lot of viewer feedback praising the news of Nene's impending departure.

Yeah, I'm rooting for her too. But I don't think he's the end game for her. She loves that baby, but that poor girl looks like her daddy... Just by reading Tanya's face, you could tell she already knew/realized Kenya was talking about her and her man at the table, or at the very least, she knew she fit the description Kenya was explaining. Either way, to go after Tanya is like a bulldog going after a toy chihuahua. Yeah, the toy chihuahua can bark, but her bite won't even break skin. I'm indifferent to Eva. I don't not like her (© Ramona Singer) but she's just kinda there. Nene who? lol They are doing her dirty LOL but at the same time, what a waste of money. Tanya and Marlo have given so much more to the show this season, yet Nene's making like 2 million this year or something?

I feel like at this point, the "core" of Atlanta is Kandi, Cynthia, Porsha, and Kenya. Yes, even Kenya. Others around them, including Nene, can come or go as long as these core four remain on the show, and RHOA will continue to coast along just fine. Re: OC, so apparently the rumor is that Tamra, Shannon, Kelly, Braunwyn, and Emily have gotten invited back. Vicki is being invited back as a Friend Of with a salary that's further reduced from last season. They're on the fence with Gina and it could go either way. However, Messy Boots Andy says it's just a rumor and that no contracts have been sent out yet. Furthermore, apparently for whatever reason Tamra was thisclose to getting the boot, but will be welcomed back. Hmm... Re: NJ. Even though it feels a tad forced for the cameras, I appreciate Jennifer bringing her family issue to light about her mother's hesitance to acknowledge her son as gay. It's an important topic to address; old-school people struggling with their longstanding beliefs versus the reality of life. However, it looks like Jennifer is back to being outlandish next week. Side note: Something about Dolores sometimes resembles Senator Kamala Harris to me (P.S. If Joe Biden gets the presidential nomination, I hope she's his VP. But that's for the Politics thread)

Where is everyone? LOL Apparently there's some casting news for next season's OC.... a certain OG will not be happy, especially with a further reduced salary. Methinks Bravo is coaxing her to quit without officially doing the dirty work of letting her go.

Re: GMA3... I've watched that painful dreck only a couple times and the only thing worth watching is Keke Palmer. They could ditch Strahan and Sara and just kick it with Keke (which would likely be their newly revamped title!)

Okay, call me a stodgy old man for always being a champion of network television or basic cable, but I'm finally getting into content that's streamed exclusively, and yeah, this whole new era of Netflix films vs. standard theatrical releases is getting so murky with what constitutes what. When hubby and I watched A Marriage Story (super low budget, by the way, minus whatever salaries the actors likely received), I'm like, "I've never heard of this. Was it in theaters?" Turns out, it was released for less than a month in November to a very small, select group of theaters, raking in a whopping $160,000; not that it mattered to them, because it was basically an exclusive streaming deal. So weird how this works now. P.S. Laura Dern did basically nothing in the film (certainly nothing note-worthy; the role was pretty stagnant, requiring next to no range or depth at all), yet won Supporting Actress at the Globes. Dumb. Stepping off my soapbox. (P.S. I love Fleabag and Olivia Colman)

What's the blind item on Miss messy boots Andy?

She was entertaining at the debates, I'll give her that. And a good yodeler!