vetsoapfan

While I personally found the show unwatchable for much of the 1980s, I didn't believe TGL was in serious danger of cancellation until the 1990s. From decades past, I knew that various long-running soaps had experienced both plunges and surges in the ratings, but as the years went by and TGL continued to dwell in the toilet, I realized it was living on borrowed time. It got to the point where I almost wanted cancellation to come, to put the old war horse out of its misery.

Oh, Duh! Of course! I completely zoned out about the change of locals, and was only thinking about the major events in TGL's overall history, which would have garnered attention in the newspapers. In this instance, it would make sense that the news stories would be restricted to Springfield residents. Thanks for the correction.

I'd say 1984-1988 were the nadir years of the 1980s. (Everything after 1993 sucked big time, too, IMHO. I was furious how poorly-handled and empty the tribute was. Meta Bauer's murder trial should have been included among the headlines.

May Terry/Danfling rest well. It's always sad to hear about a life ending before its time. I appreciate your letting us know, @slick jones.

I would have accepted a time lapse like that; one being mentioned and acknowledged.

The "youth mandate" hurt TEON (and most soaps, IMHO). Since the very beginning of the genre, fans of all ages have made it clear that they love soap characters of all ages. I have never understood how TPTB can be unaware or (just as possibly) indifferent to this fact. Replacing Maeve McGuire with Jayne Bentzen was a serious blunder. Not only was she a whopping 18 years younger that McGuire, she was a painfully wooden performer. Rona Barrett's Daytimers magazine posted a comment: "Although well liked by her cast-mates, most feel she should have remained a model." Ouch. Nicole never again attained the immense popularity the character has garnered under McGuire. It was like replacing Jacquie Courtney on AW with some of the dreadful actresses who somehow ended up in the role of Alice. Lisa Sloan was a better thespian that Bentzen, fortunately, but neither Bentzen nor Sloan ever felt like the "real" Nicole to me. Getting rid of Mandel Kramer as Bill Marceau was another slap in the face, but at least the character of Bill was hitting a believable age to retire from the police force. As you pointed out, some of the "model hunks" hired by the show simply weren't well cast. I personally found Derek Mallory to be...icky and completely unappealing, but the majority of the performers hired over the years I watched the series were quite good. The original leading man, Mike Karr, was recast twice, and the show really lucked out there. All three of the actors chosen for the role were fine.

Ah, yes, those gray "wings" the show used to stick on Ellen Demming's hair to make Meta look older. Hilarious. I did not realize Meta's pregnancy only lasted two months. Soaps are notorious for pregnancies lasting...forever! A shortened pregnancy like that would have vexed me at the time, for being absurdly unrealistic. Of course, I am used to kids being SORASed after they're born, although some shows handle the leaps in ages better than others. Curiously, their peculiar idiosyncrasies end up making our shows all the more charming, LOL!

I somehow missed your tagging me in the ATWT ep, @DRW50. Thank you, as always. I'd miss so much without kind folks tagging me!

Watching both TEON and SOM live during the time Slesar wrote the series, I was thrilled to see that each one was on fire creatively; excellent entertainment that kept me glued to my TV set. Soap historians rightfully praise the likes of Phillips, Nixon and Bell for their contributions to the genre, but Slesar was also a master writer in his own right, and deserves so much respect. No one else has ever been able to match his ability to weave intricate, absorbing mystery dramas on daytime TV. I'd say Slesar reached his zenith in the early 1970s with the original Whitney-family/Jonah Lockwood saga, but even his later material, which isn't seen as his best, was miles above anything we've seen on soaps for the last few decades. Slesar could write it all: mystery, romance, domestic strife, and even comedic bits. The best aspect of his work is that during it all, his characters were layered, complex and INTELLIGENT.

That's interesting, because when Meta was on the witness stand during her trial in 1950, she was asked her age and she replied that she was 31, making her year of birth 1919. She went from 24 in 1948 to 31 in 1950...an early case of slight SORASing, I guess! 🙃 (Actually, I know there were changes in factual information in Irna's scripts at the time, like the Baum family being renamed the Bauers, Bert's original surname later being changed to Miller, etc. Nobody would even know or remember the inconsistencies today if vintage scripts and radio episodes had not resurfaced.)

Steve and Audrey Hardy, Jessie Brewer, Lee Baldwin...the characters that made me live GH in the first pace, and remain loyal to the show through the 1960s and 1970s.

I want Scotty on GH, too, but I wish they would write for him effectively. That hasn't been the case in years. As the longest-running character on GH, debuting in 1965, I think he deserves a place on the canvas. (I know there are people who don't care about such things.) The character of Julie on DAYS also debuted in 1965, but more than likely Scotty began appearing on GH before November of that year, which is when DAYS was launched.) For me, part of the joy and comfort of soaps is watching characters whom we have known for years/decades. Newer viewers (well, newer compared to me) have told me that older characters are irrelevant to today's audiences and could easily be discarded, but I want to see people like Scotty Baldwin, Jill Foster, Julie Williams, Maggie Horton, etc. on screen. While soaps cannot be top-heavy with dozens of characters over 60 (bringing in fresh blood has always been important), I truly believe that even youngsters in the audience enjoy seeing the vets. Alice Horton, Lila Quartermaine, Bert Bauer, Katherine Chancellor: younger viewers loved them as much as we, the oldtimers, did. If Leslie Charleson or Denise Alexander are ever up to appearing on GH again, I'd happily accept them in any capacity. Seeing Rachel Ames as Audrey Hardy again (I know this is dreaming in Technicolor) would make me ugly cry.🥺

I remember thinking at the time that if TIIC even DARED to try replacing Charita Bauer with another actress, there would have been WAR. Literally, the fans would have gone berserk.

When James Carroll Jordan briefly took over the role in 1972, Steve was again confirmed to be Julie's younger brother. I don't remember if it was mentioned specifically when SS was cast in 1978. By that time, I assumed everyone already knew, and I probably didn't pay much attention. I should say, however, that if Steve was then said to be OLDER than Julie in 1978, I'm sure I would have picked up on it and remembered it. Inconsistencies with details like that always grate on my nerves and stick in my mind. In 1964 on AW, Pat Matthews shot and killed her ne'er-do-well boyfriend, Tom Baxter. For years afterwards, it was reported in the soap press and even by the likes of writer Harding Lemay, that Pat had stabbed him to death. Lemay even had Pat flashback to "stabbing" Tom after she had killed Greg Bernard. UGH! Doug Davidson of Y&R expressed good-natured vexation in the press that it had become known as "fact" among fans that Paul Williams had given Nikki Reed a sexually transmitted disease. Nooooooooo. Those of us who were watching way back when knew it was the other way around; she infected him. Other fans have not believed me, because they "read it in a book" that Paul was the one responsible. The soap opera landscape is littered with misinformation which has become accepted as factual through decades of erroneous reporting.

In the early days of the show (1965), Julie is said to be the older child.

She was earning a whopping $1,000.00 a week in 1959, which translates to $10,614.00 today. It was incredibly stupid to pull a power play and screw that up. I'd fire her too, frankly, unless she could reign in her husband. I believe all three actresses who played Vanessa were capable enough, but I agree that Audrey Peters was the best/strongest of the bunch. It's appropriate that she stayed in the role the longest.

I've read that article about Slesar before, but I love that sort of stuff, and was thrilled to see it again. Thanks, @DRW50.

I wasn't necessarily referring to the implications of replacing an actress in the midst of a wedding, so much as simply replacing the leading actress of a show during any significant event. Recasting a performer on her character's wedding day, or during the heroine's final/deathbed appearance, or when she is reunited with loved ones after a long bout of amnesia, etc., would all be unfortunate choices to me. Emotionally, viewers want to see the faces we know and love play out the key, important moments on soaps. I do agree with you that the Vanessa/Bruce courtship was probably not as important to the audience as the Steve/Alice wedding, which AW devotees had been obsessed with seeing for so many years. Still, if TBTB knew their leading lady was leaving the show, Love of Life should have scheduled the wedding to take place before Bonnie Bartlett departed, and then introduced Audrey Peters after the honeymoon. Love of Life had made a miraculous turnaround just a few years earlier, under Claire Labine's creative genius, and had become must-see TV. To witness its collapse and falling into such a state of disrepair during the tenures of people like Holloway was painful. The soap did start to pick up again after Ann Marcus took over the writing reigns, but by that time, alas, it was too little, too late.

I didn't accept many of the recasts in later years, but I adored Ellen Demming as Meta, Barbara Rodell as Leslie, Mart Hulswit as Ed, Maureen Garrett as Holly, and several other golden oldies. Ellen Parker was by far the better Maureen, IMHO. Jennifer Cooke, as the recast Morgan, was possibly the first replacement performer whom I disliked intensely (probably because by the time TPTB replaced Amanda, Alan, Justin, Alexandra, etc., I was barely watching the series and usually fast-forwarded through them, LOL). Love of Life was fortunate in that both replacement Vanessas gained the audience's acceptance. It must have been jarring for most viewers, however, to see Audrey Peters assume the role on Vanessa's wedding day, of all days. If Susan Harney had replaced Jacquie Courtney on AW's 10th anniversary, the episode in which Steve and Alice got remarried, I would have had a fit.

While AW was beyond its prime and years of solid ratings, at least it had a once-loyal audience who may have been lured back if the quality had picked up and the structure of the show had been stabilized. As a newbie soap, Port Charles did not have the same assets (aside from some beloved crossover characters from GH), and really destroyed any possibility for success by introducing the ludicrous supernatural, idiotic storylines.

Oh, I absolutely adore many radio soaps, and agree they could be absolutely fabulous. The Guiding Light, Ma Perkins, One Man's Family, and several others come to mind. Alas, Jean Holloway's tenure as Love of Life's writer was (IMHO, of course) subpar. Not because it harkened back to the radio era, but because her material was just bad. LoL was very good in the 1950s; better than any soap being produced now in 2024! I usually resist soap recasts unless the original performer is noticeably weak, but Ellen Demming became my favorite Meta. I adored her, and it was painful to see the actress and actress fade into oblivion by the 1970s.

Um...no. You REEEEEALLY don't want to put yourself through that.😬

Actually, there are many episodes of TGL from 1966 (25+) that have been floating around among collectors for many years, and most of which have been on Youtube. Lots still are. The quality is usually not great, but as soap fans know, beggars can't be choosers!

ITA. I think Kobe killed the show in 1984, and Wheeler finally just cremated it. I can't really see RR as a good replacement for Mike, either. I just meant that casting him as Alan was even worse than casting him as Mike. The last year I truly loved the show and felt it was the "real" TGL was 1982. Then I appreciated the resurgence of Roger and Holly in 1989, Robert Calhoun's run as executive producer (1989-91), and Nancy Curlee's tenure as head writer in the early 1990s. Other than that, I loathed much of the final 25 years.

The idiotic butchering of Amanda's paternity was such an awful and unnecessary mistake; it really needed to be wiped out. She was Alan's daughter, period. I would have happily accepted your concept of how to repair the damage. Yep. (Although I would have been happy with Stewart, Mart Hulswit as Ed and Ellen Parker as Maureen all being part of the canvas. I wanted Ellen Demming to return as Meta in 1985 after Charita Bauer died, too.) History just not relevant to TGL at that point, alas. If Stewart was definitely off the table, I wanted Jed Allen cast as Mike Bauer. As for RR, I could see him as a better replacement for Mike than for Alan Spaulding.