Jump to content

Was Another World's Rachel original Erica Kane?


Recommended Posts

  • Members

First off, just saying i know if Susan Lucci never played Erica, she probably wouldn't have gone past being the teenager "naughty girl in town" Susan took that character and ran with it. Without Susan, there would be no "super star" Erica Kane that lasted 40 years.

But i thought i read somewhere that Agnes Nixon was writing for Another World at the begining and helped create Rachel in a way like Erica Kane because P&G didn't want her All My Children soap. I know Rachel was obsessed with marrying wealthy. and she did marry a doctor first in Russ Matthews (Like Erica with Jeff Martin) and she tried everything to break up a "supercouple" of Alice and Steve Frame (like Tara and Phil.) By the time Rachel met Mac, Erica Kane was already created on AMC so they let Rachel have her "wealthy husband" in Mac Cory (not that it was smooth sailing at all. i think they married three times.)

Another Simlarity was that Ada Davis was a working class single mother hairdresser. Mona Kane was a working class single mother doctors secretary. Of course where as Mona was sweet and put up with Erica's drama (most of the time), Ada was more outspoken and sometimes put Rachel in her place...along with everyone else. I remember one scene where Ada really let her younger daughter Nancy "have it." I think they were living at the Cory Mansion and Nancy had been bouncing checks and Ada just told her off. Mona never really did what with Erica.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gPcqjR5Wu_g&feature=related

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Replies 25
  • Created
  • Last Reply
  • Members

I think Rachel and Ada were harder-edged versions of Erica and Mona. There were some moments which AMC never did with Erica, like Rachel reveling in Alice's miscarriage.

Rachel being with Mac didn't have anything to do with Erica finally being created, though - Agnes was already long gone from AW by then.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Members

Erica and Mona were created first, on paper. When P&G passed on AMC, Agnes Nixon borrowed Erica and Mona from her AMC bible and redubbed/retooled them as Rachel and Ada. One could argue that Robin Strasser essentially created the role of Erica Kane, but simply put, she was Rachel, not Erica. To me, the situation is more akin to what Tennessee Williams often did, which was sort of workshop and explore a certain character prototype, creating the definitive example along the way. There is Blanche DuBois, but there is Mrs. Fenway and the Lady of Larkspur Lotion, too. AN would use this earthy, dependable, and devoted working class mother/strong-willed, raven-haired vixen daughter duo again with Ava and Kate on Loving, and arguably, even earlier with Sadie and Carla on OLTL.

Carl is right, the change in Rachel had more to do with Harding Lemay's vision. He wanted to see what would happen if "some of Rachel's dreams came true", and he wanted to move in his own creation, Iris, as the show's bitch.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Members

I think in some ways, at least until the rape rewrites, Erica and Mona were more of a fantasy of abandonment, and Rachel and Ada were more of a reality. Mona, for instance, was always sweet, kind, nice, and ultimately found her happy ending. I guess you could say Ada did too, but there was always a great deal of sadness and regret under the surface. Erica also found her dreams, and her demons became cute quirks. Rachel was never very cute, she was a very complicated and ultimately damaged person who just managed to overcome as best she could.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Members

Back in the WoST days, a viewer who was watching at the time said that Rachel was more "down", more of an "around the way girl" than Erica. An example he used was that Rachel would casually call Ada "mom" while Erica was more inclined to put on airs and give Mona an, "Oh, mother!". He also said, however, that he'd have bet money that SL was instructed to watch RS because her characterization of Erica seemed just that close.

Rachel and Erica both modeled in department stores, both hoped to marry rich and respectably, and did indeed when both nabbed doctors... and in both cases that still wasn't enough. Rachel couldn't resist the dashing more glamorous charms of wealthy architect Steve. But it seems like Rachel was more content to marry well whereas under AN's pen, Erica needed FAME too.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Members

I think Felicia inherited the fantasy world neuroses and glam that Erica and audiences would enjoy in the eighties and beyond before sobering, no pun intended, in her own right. Rachel definitely grew up sooner and she was tough as nails in a way that Erica never was. I would also say that VW's portrayal had a lot to do with that. She reminds me of my childhood friend's mom, they shoot you a silent look with those gigantic eyeballs and you could crap your pants

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Members

VW's Rachel could be very girlish, almost nauesatingly so at times (at least until she dropped that and instead became a zonked out Shakespeare's Sister), but there was such a level of pure ice.

A lot of this sums up the many sides of Rachel.

Please register in order to view this content

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Members

You're right about that.

I think the best example of that was the few months Lemay was back in 1988, around the time Rachel was at war with Sharlene and Jason, and Liz told Matt about how he was conceived. She was vulnerable yet scary.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Members

It seems, earlier on,under Nixon,Ada was more of an enabler of Rachel's behaviour,rather than the tougher character that evolved.

This is from the AWHP detailing Ada's first scenes

Sam: "Oh, hey, I forgot to tell you. Rachel called."

Ada: "[NOW A TRANSFORMATION COMES OVER THIS WOMAN AT EVEN THE MENTION OF HER DAUGHTER'S NAME. WE SEE THAT THIS IS THE ONE THING THAT SUSTAINS HER AND AT THE SAME TIME, THE ALTAR ON WHICH SHE WOULD GLADLY SACRIFICE HERSELF] Rachel! Why didn't you tell me before?"

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Members

I guess Sam served as the Nick Davis figure.

It's interesting to me that AW brought Rachel's father in within a few years, while Agnes waited a long time for Erica (and probably should have kept on waiting, if she had any say in the matter). I wonder if she approved of Gerald Davis coming in so early.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Members

This is Rachel's first scene in Feb 67

Sam: "What have you told her about her father?"

Ada: "That he's dead."

Sam: "Rachel may be in for a real shock someday."

...

Ada: "Rachel's gonna be a big movie star."

Sam: "Oh, sure..."

...

'THEY ARE INTERRUPTED BY THE OPENING OF THE DOOR AND RACHEL'S ENTRANCE. HER DRESS IS NOT HIGH CAMP YET SHE CERTAINLY LEANS MUCH MORE TOWARD THE OUTRE THAN THE REST OF OUR YOUNG GALS. IN THE POCKET OF HER COAT OR IN THE POCKET OF HER TOTE BAG SHE HAS A FOLDED NEWSPAPER. WE SEE IT BUT IT ISN'T DISPLAYED PROMINENTLY. THERE IS, AT HER ENTRANCE, AN IMMEDIATE SIGN FROM ADA FOR SAM TO KEEP QUIET.'

Rachel: (Intro Line) "Hi."

Ada: "Oh, hello, honey. Did you have a nice day?"

Rachel: "[sHE FALLS DOWN INTO A CHAIR] I had a long day. Modeling dull clothes for dull people."

Ada: "Oh, this was the fashion show for the Hospital Benefit?"

Rachel: "Uh huh... and there were only four of us and we had to change ten times apiece."

Ada: "Oh, you poor baby. I'll get you some coffee."

Rachel: "No, I don't want any. Just tell me when we're getting out of here? Huh, Uncle Sammy? When are Mom and me leaving for Hollywood? [TAKE ADA LOOKING QUICKLY TO SAM AND WE FADE OUT]"

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Archived

This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.

  • Recently Browsing   0 members

    • No registered users viewing this page.



  • Recent Posts

    • Download isn't working for me either.  With that said, thank you for all the work you have done!
    • @P.J. Well, it wasn't her first award. I am sure she has written books, and spoken at colleges, and gotten some notoriety from it. Most importantly, she is fulfilled. Something Dani is not.  @Paul Raven Exactly, it does not ring true to me. Dani has that big personality because she is masking pain. And she probably clung to Bill because he made her feel smart and important (at one point). There are ways to add more layers to her.
    • Absolutely. And IIRC Rose Alaio has mentioned production having it out for her.
    • That goes back to Chance/Abby-there was way more to explore with their marriage but the first problem that pops up that's pretty much it-moving on. And Kyle/Lola, years worth of story dropped so he can fall back in love with Summer. Sharon/Rey married off with no plans for their future so they kill him off. And so on...
    • All of that would be interesting. Why would JG ever do that?
    • GH 1976 Pt 2 Medical student Bobby Chandler’s bone-marrow test results are in, and Steve Hardy has the difficult task of telling him he has Malenkov’s Disease, a rare and fatal blood disease. Bobby, newly married Samantha, hears his one-year-maximum prognosis and insists that Steve not tell anyone, as he has to have time to work out his own feelings. To cover up the treatments he’ll be starting immediately, Bobby, with Steve, decides to tell his family he has mononucleosis. His wife and his mother, Caroline, accept this story, but attorney Lee Baldwin senses it’s much more and presses Bobby for the truth, then promising to keep Bobby’s secret. Even though Bobby moves into a state of remission, Lee realizes the gravity of the problem and moves his wedding to Caroline forward, assuring Bobby that he will always be there for both Caroline and Sammi. But Bobby’s remission is short-lived, and his symptoms are now more severe, requiring frequent whole-blood transfusions. And a new experimental drug he is taking holds the threat of serious side effects. Sammi learns that Bobby’s attempt to buy life insurance was turned down and, herself a nurse, realizes that his symptoms are more severe than mono. She tries to press Leslie for the truth, but Leslie can’t violate a patient’s confidence. She does, however, pressure Bobby to let Sammi share is with him. Bobby insists that he can’t; he won’t send her into mourning while he’s still there to watch. But Sammi, angry at being treated like a child, presses the issue and manages to find out the truth. She then asks Lee to convince Bobby that his mother must be told so they can all show him the love they have for him before it’s too late and they have only  regrets for what went unsaid. Lee agrees, and after the wedding he protectively tells Caroline the truth. Sammi then tells Bobby that she is pregnant, news that he receives with very mixed emotions. Steve hits an optimistic note when he tells Bobby that a new breakthrough in leukemia chemotherapy may help him in his fight for life. This new treatment calls for more extensive testing, and Steve is overjoyed to find that there has been a variation in Bobby’s condition which indicates that he -doesn’t have Malenkov’s Disease after all. His condition, while serious, can be successfully treated  extensive drug therapy in New York, and Lee quickly arranges for all of them to move there so they can support Bobby during the extensive treatment and long recovery.  Dr. Jim Hobart and his wife, Audrey, are continuing their therapy sessions, trying to decide if they have a future together. Audrey admits she has stayed with Jim only because he needed her while he was drinking, and he in turn admits that he knows Audrey married him not out of love but out of gratitude for saving her son Tommy’s life in surgery. When Jim finally tells Audrey that he created his own alcoholic abyss and blamed her only because she was conveniently close, she wonders what will happen to: her when he recovers. If he doesn’t need her, can she go on? Does she need so much to be needed? When Jim, improving, starts teaching at the local college, he finds his self-image improving. But Audrey, worn out from therapy, suggests that she take a short vacation alone. Jim sees this as a way of undermining his recent strides and is angry. He relates this situation to his recent impotence, caused by his emotional problems. Jim reacts to his own feelings of inadequacy by withdrawing from Audrey, treating her impersonally and coldly. She takes this as an indication of her own failure. But when Jim reacts enthusiastically to one of his students, lovely young Sally Grimes, Audrey questions her own responsibility for the situation and accepts a dinner invitation with Steve Hardy, her first husband. Steve’s reassurance that she’s been a paragon of tolerance is negated when Jim walks in late and showing signs of drinking. When she asks how he could do it, he bitterly replies, “It’s a way to help me escape from you,” and turns and leaves. He goes to Sally’s, where they make love. When Sally later expresses regret at interfering in his marriage, Jim assures her there was nothing left to spoil—his wife is frigid but has blamed their sexual failure on him; thanks to Sally, he now knows he’s not inadequate. Since Sally won’t have an affair with a married man, Jim decides to make the break with Audrey. He bit- _ terly tells her Sally proved to him that he never had a problem—all he needed was a real woman, not one who was all burned out. He scathingly says that she takes men and castrates them; cases in point, her three husbands: Steve Hardy, Tom Baldwin, and himself. Shocked and horribly hurt by his accusations, Audrey swallows sleeping pills but immediately realizes the folly of her actions and tries to get help. Steve, meanwhile, senses something wrong and on a hunch goes to her apartment, where he finds her unconscious. He rushes her to the hospital for treatment, and after sixteen hours she begins to come around. She tearfully repeats Jim’s accusations while still groggy, and Steve reassures her that nothing Jim said was in any way true. As she dozes in the security of his presence, he whispers to her, “There’s a lot of woman in you, there was and there is, my sweet, lovely Audrey.”  Nurse Beth Maynard, despite her frequent pronouncements that she’s immune to emotional involvement, has fallen in love with resident Kyle Bradley. Beth’s sister, Nurse Diana Taylor, feels that Kyle treats Beth as if she were a casual conquest, however, rather than a woman he loves. Kyle’s life is now complicated by the arrival of Nurse Kate Marshall in town. She is staying with her godmother, Jessie Brewer, R.N., while. she recovers from a painful divorce. She and Kyle had an affair a few years ago, and she knows he’s married but keeps his wife “under wraps.” Kyle, in turn, knows that the discovery of Kate’s affair with Dr. John McAllister drove his wife to suicide. Kyle and Kate resume their affair. Despite the fact that Kyle is now living with Beth, Diana has seen enough to convince her that Kyle is deceiving her sister. But Beth won’t believe this, until she sees them embracing herself. When she confronts Kate, Kate bitterly tells Beth everything past and present about herself and Kyle, including the interesting fact that he’s married. Beth, shocked and hurt, throws Kyle out, and Jessie, who overheard Kate’s vindictive diatribe to Beth, arranges her transfer to another hospital.     
    • This is so true - the instant love is annoying. Adam/Sally/Billy/Chelsea are the best evidence of why this rings hollow. While I can see Adam/Chelsea reuniting based on a long history and Connor, there's no way Sally would instantly declare love. While Billy is just a desperate soul, Sally would be far more cautious after what happened with Adam. The *real* Sally would not only scheme to get Adam back, but make Chelsea's life difficult. She just got over it and gave up. Please. Instead of insta-love why can't some of these characters more casual? I hope Claire flings with Holden after Kyle falls into Audra's trap. Abby turns to Nate when Devon obsesses over Amanda - even if she's not in town. Lauren turns to Jack during this Michael stress, who in turn lands in Diane's web. We need messy triangles/quads and more.
    • Literally looks like a damn VFA or bingo hall. But we’re supposed to believe high rollers go there.
    • More 1976 LOL Carrie is very afraid that Ian’s paying her bills will force Arlene into a relationship with him she doesn’t want. She asks Joe if there’s some way to give Ian  back the money. Joe tells Arlene that her mother’s afraid of the situation, but Arlene assures him that the only thing she fears is that Tom will find out and think she’s more than a friend to Ian. Betsy, understandably resentful of Arlene, can’t see what her brother sees in her and is upset to see Arlene with Ian, as she’s sure Tom will be hurt. Tom is initially quite angry when he happens to learn that Ian paid Carrie’s hospital bills in full but believes Arlene when she assures him Ian’s just a friend. Ian, meanwhile, after Arlene admits she has strong feelings for a young doctor and can therefore regard Ian only as a friend, puts the pieces together and makes an appointment to see Tom for a cardiac examination. Tom realizes why Ian has chosen him and refuses a considerable fee to become Ian’s personal physician. . Betsy has suggested that Tom not ask Arlene to Meg’s formal New Year’s Eve party for the sake of all concerned. Meg, while having Carrie alter her party dress, mentions she’s being escorted by a wealthy man but doesn’t mention Ian by name. Ian had asked  Arlene to fly to Mexico with him for the New Year, but she declined, explaining she had another date. Tom, seeing how left out she feels, tells Arlene they are going to Meg’s party after all, and she begins looking for a dress, unable to afford the type of smashing creation she really wants. Ian, learning that Arlene’s  looking for a dress suitable for Meg’s party, arranges to have a designer creation sent in place of the off the rack dress she selected. When it arrives, Arlene and Carrie immediately plan to return it, but, on second thought, Arlene decides it wouldn’t hurt if she wore it just this once.  Ben Harper is released from prison, and Betsy tries - to show him they have nothing left between them by dating Jamie. However, her feelings for Ben get in the way of her enjoying Jamie’s company. Jamie has decided to accept an out-of-town law firm’s offer and, before leaving, helps Diana arrange the passport requirements for her newly arranged missionary trainee post in Peru. Diana tells Jamie she’s finally found peace except for her sadness at having to leave Johnny  behind. Beaver Ridge has continued to deteriorate since Rick left Meg in control, and Jamie warns Rick that since he owns fifty-one percent of the club, he’ll have to come up with fifty-one percent of the money needed to put the place back on its feet. Cal has mentioned to Rick that she would rather have a smaller, more informal home than his imposing house, and when she learns he’s put the house on the market she assumes he’s considering her desire for an easier home to run. Rick is determined that Cal not know the full extent of his financial problems. Since she wants it so badly, Rick promises Cal he’ll buy the mill house as their home, but he refuses adamantly to accept money from her trust fund toward the purchase, recalling the trouble resulting from the last time he borrowed  money from a woman—her mother, Meg.  Ian informs Ray that he'll get his cut of Beaver Ridge only when he, Ian, has the controlling interest.  When Rick can’t raise his share of the Beaver Ridge capital, he approaches Ray for help. Ray sends him to Ian, who refusés to make a loan, explaining it’s his firm policy, but suggests he pay one hundred thousand ~ dollars for two percent of Rick’s holdings in Beaver Ridge, thus transferring majority ownership to himself. Rick thinks it over and realizes he has no choice but to accept. He hates losing control of Beaver Ridge but  feels his first responsibility is Cal and he must protect her from his financial worries. Ben has moved in with Van and Bruce, explaining to Meg that he wants no help and no coddling, he has to make it on his own. He manages to find a job as a salesman in a sporting-goods shop, despite his parole. Betsy hires Carrie as Suzanne’s baby sitter in order to be absent when Ben visits his daughter. Ben finally tells Betsy he’d hoped there was still a chance for them despite everything but her dating Jamie and avoiding him seems to mean he was mistaken. Betsy admits she’s no longer seeing Jamie and agrees to be home when Ben visits. They then call a truce and decide to attend Meg’s party together.  
    • A few years after my grandfather and great aunt passed away, my grandmother married her widowed brother-in-law. You could have knocked us all over with a feather when they told us. My point is: it happens in RL, a lot more often than people think. In the Jack/Siobhan case, it would have been super messy, which is exactly what you want on a soap. Putting Siobhan with Joe forced them to write her as very naive and gullible, which seemed totally wrong for the character they initially introduced. I liked Rose, too, but that story also got derailed by the stupid mob stuff.
×
×
  • Create New...

Important Information

By using this site, you agree to our Terms of Use and Privacy Policy