Knots Landing

[alphanguy74]

I LOVED the Ciji/Laura dynamic. And Richard's insecurity, thinking they were becoming Lesbian lovers... and Laura not categorically denying it was so fabulous. Here's the scene from "Celebration" i was talking about. Just AMAZING:

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[DRW50]

You know the first time I watched that I didn't know it was her corpse. She looked so different with the wet hair. Then of course it was obviously her. They did a great job going from her poster to that scene on the beach.

Poor Kim Lankford. I've heard a lot of ribbing over that singing but I think she would have sounded better without the backing track or whatever that was. Her voice fits the "earnest" female singer era which was winding down around that time and would kind of pop back up in a different form at the end of the decade. But I always had a soft spot for Ginger. I wish they could have kept her around, I felt like Kenny dragged her down.

When I watched these episodes originally I was surprised they mentioned lesbianism and also surprised and happy with Laura's reaction. Sometimes 80s TV is a lot more progressive than it gets credit for, especially compared to today.

I wish the episode about Abby giving Diana one of her kidneys was online. That is perhaps my all time favorite episode, especially the scene where Abby looks out over the beach at that gorgeous house of hers, and then the last scene where Karen, all attempts at gratitude rejected by Abby, goes into Abby's room while she's sleeping and kisses her on the forehead.

Edited August 10, 2010 by CarlD2

[alphanguy74]

I don't know why Kim would get ribbing for that.... I think it's fabulous. The only reason the backing tracks falls short is the BACKGROUND SINGERS.... it would ahve come off even better if those were done away with. She brigns more emotional depth, IMO. Now... you want COMEDY, any of the scenes where Julie Harris is playing that autoharp... EGADS! And yes, the eppy where Abby doantes the kidney was so compelling, Abby and Karen arguing, and her fianlly telling her.. "I'm doing it for Diana.. and for Sid... NOT FOR YOU". The rich character driven quality is what made this show outlast all the others. producers today should note that... ESPECIALLY those in daytime. But these dorkwads just quip.. "it's a new day, people aren't into that anymore". BULLSHIT.

Edited August 10, 2010 by alphanguy74

[DRW50]

You're right it would be better without backup.

Lillimae got on my nerves...I still crack up at the scene where Ben put her in a headlock.

No one really knows what character development means now. People are afraid to write serials because they assume viewers are idiots. These days the idea of a serial is Desperate Housewives. Every time I hear that compared to Knots Landing I cringe.

[saynotoursoap]

All of the Lorimar serials began as self-contained and for a reason. Self-contained episodes that are not required to be transmitted in a particular order sell better in syndication than serialized dramas. The conundrum is that serialized drama usually picks up viewers more easily than the self-contained format for dramas which are basically soaps. Dallas, KL, and FR all started with poor ratings and captured more viewers once they went to a serialized format. Falcon Crest garnered good ratings from the beginning despite its self-contained format; however, much of its early success came from following Dallas on the Friday night schedule.

Good luck to Lonestar. Hopefully it will avoid much of the camp and excess which ruined 90's soaps and did not do a thing for the dreadful 90210 and Melrose revivals.

[alphanguy74]

Well, Carl, after 10 years of posting on message boards and interacting with so many viewers... they ARE idiots. About 80 percent of them (Present company excluded, of course) but they shouldn't write to the lowest common deonominator. Sometimes you can write over the viewers' head and they can rise to the occasion. other times you fall flat on your face. It's a gamble, really.

[saynotoursoap]

I disagree. Desperate Housewives is more of a dramedy with serial elements. There is a reason the series gets Emmy noms in the comedy category. I have never considered it a "straight" soap. I enjoy it immensely, but it is NOT a traditional serial such as Knots Landing!

[alphanguy74]

the only reason they compare DH to Knots is because thye all are neighbors living on the same street. no other reason, IMO. I'd enjoy DH much more if it didn't have that STOOPID background score. Brothers and Sisters is much more like Knots in reality.

[DRW50]

I agree with you both -- I don't see the shows as being very similar, especially since DH went so off the rails early on. I think they are compared because, as mentioned, they're set in neighborhoods, and then the Knots ladies, some of them, kept saying they were the original Desperate Housewives.

I think Brothers & Sisters, at least in the first year, did have a lot in common with Knots, especially the Lotus Point era of Knots (which I enjoyed -- I loved the Sumner Group storylines but I think Lotus Point was a much better use of the entire cast, minus Val, who was isolated). Unfortunately B&S lost a lot of that soapy power relatively early. One of the reasons I enjoyed the early episodes was that they were pure family drama.

[saynotoursoap]

Comparing DH to KL because the characters are neighbors is like comparing the Police Academy series to CSI because both series have a law enforcement environment.

If you are referring to the music, I must respectfully disagree. Steve Jablonsky's score is, IMO, one of the best for any series because it fits the tone of the series perfectly. DH is not a traditional soap and has elements of comedy and drama. Jablonsky's music is evocative of those elements. I find his score is often better than scripts. You and I will just have to disagree about this matter.

[saynotoursoap]

The first season of Brothers & Sisters was refreshing. When ABC ousted Jon Robin Baitz, the series went to hell. They brought in the thirtysomething production team, and predictably, the drama turned to incessant whining. When my favorite character is a conservative Republican, and the most interesting son is the gay boyfriend, you know there is a problem.

[All My Shadows]

ITA about Brothers and Sisters. It went to pot for me when the politics took center stage. Kitty and Robert, the two most boring characters on the show, becoming the focal point (which, Kitty always was, but the show became even more centered around here) did it no favors. I could do without both of the sisters, really. I mainly watched for Nora, Justin, Kevin, and Holly, and especially the Holly/Nora relationship which was so soapy you could wash dishes by holding them up to the TV during their scenes.

[alphanguy74]

This is an old posting Carl, but I had something to add. First, it WAS brilliant that they wrote it as being Sid's choice. The thing is, he wans't going to be in a wheelchair, it was his neck that was broken, he was going to be a quadroplegic, which is a HELL of alot worse. I remember the Doctors saying his chance of coming through the surgery was about 50/50. I would have chosen the same if i were him. If it was a matter of just being not able to WALK... then that's a different matter. I probably would have NOT had the surgery.

[Khan]

For posting the sequence from my all-time favorite KNOTS episode ("Celebration"), alphanguy, you have officially become my favorite post-er. :-D

[alphanguy74]

Why thank you, and incidentally, ins't Donna Mills' hair in that scene the most perfect thing ever?