This is the Presidential Campaign Thread.

Barack Obama Vs. John McCain.

Edited November 6, 200817 yr by Toups

The Failure of "Because I Say So"

Harry Shearer

LONDON -- Over dinner last night, i was trying to explain to a British friend why the majority of House Republicans fled the bailout bill compromise. Reading the polls, it's easy to understand why those with the most hotly contested elections this November were the least eager to sign up for the bill. But, in surveying the wreckage, one fact became clear: the credit crisis was exacerbated by a credibility crisis.

It's easy for Americans to look at President Bush -- he of the 935 lies in the Iraq war runup--and Henry Paulson, the Goldman Sachs-bred Treasury Secretary -- and say, "prove it" regarding the dire predictions of doom if a bailout doesn't occur. As an American typically ignorant of the arcane ways of the financial wizards, what was missing for me in the scare talk last week was somebody who could put the danger in concrete terms: a businessman, say (as opposed to a financier), who could tell me how lack of credit would prevent him from stocking up on new inventory or meeting payrolls. An administration marked by profound arrogance (hello, Mr. Cheney) sent a financier to Congress to demand unprecedented power for a financier, and the scare talk sounded familiar and empty. It's the boy who cried Wolfowitz.

Somehow, if the danger is that real and that near, somebody with a shred of credibility and some real skin in the game has to stand up and tell us exactly what's in the alleged abyss. The administration's failure to understand that fact is telling and profound.

Pelosi was just an easy excuse that makes them look childish. Here's what Sam Stein posted:

Damn! Newt the Nuke is taking aim at his own party. All I have to say is this made the GOP look pretty bad. I know people say that the public was overwhelmingly against this, but I'm not seeing it. I know that people who were against it called Congress, but people I talk to say things like they did not know the effect not passing the bill would have on average joes. They thought it was just saving fat cats.

That is the good and the bad. Had Congress passed the bill, no one would have known that it was a good thing. Now Congress did not pass the bill, the stock market went into a free fall and now the public blames Congress for not having the courage to pass the bill. Tis a mess.

You know, I do not get the McCain/Palin team. Do they really think that banning the media is a good thing? Even conservatives like Maureen Dowd. Drudge likes Maureen Dowd. She's consistent. Amazing. I just think everything McCain is doing these days, he's doing out of anger. The unfortunate thing is I still think he has a very good chance of winning this election. I truly worry about the gap between registered voters and likely voters. I also worry about the "Bradley Effect". Can you imagine John McCain bringing the decision making skills he has displayed the past two weeks to the White House?

Happy Birthday Dr. Jay.

Pelosi was just an easy excuse that makes them look childish. Here's what Sam Stein posted:

It was ill-timed. But, as bad as it comes off, here's my thing....

They never listened to her before. NOW you do? Ignore the woman!

And NG? I wonder what tree stump he's hiding under this morning? I was watching that live when she said that, and the guy who said "Surprise, surprise, surprise, surprise" had me rolling. Gingrich torpedoed his own party for his selfish gain.

The RP is just imploding right before my eyes.

Happy Birthday Dr. Jay.

Thank you Jess.

Damn! Newt the Nuke is taking aim at his own party. All I have to say is this made the GOP look pretty bad. I know people say that the public was overwhelmingly against this, but I'm not seeing it. I know that people who were against it called Congress, but people I talk to say things like they did not know the effect not passing the bill would have on average joes. They thought it was just saving fat cats.

That is the good and the bad. Had Congress passed the bill, no one would have known that it was a good thing. Now Congress did not pass the bill, the stock market went into a free fall and now the public blames Congress for not having the courage to pass the bill. Tis a mess.

You know, I do not get the McCain/Palin team. Do they really think that banning the media is a good thing? Even conservatives like Maureen Dowd. Drudge likes Maureen Dowd. She's consistent. Amazing. I just think everything McCain is doing these days, he's doing out of anger. The unfortunate thing is I still think he has a very good chance of winning this election. I truly worry about the gap between registered voters and likely voters. I also worry about the "Bradley Effect". Can you imagine John McCain bringing the decision making skills he has displayed the past two weeks to the White House?

Well now I can rejoice at the thought of Newt Gingrich running for President in four years.

I don't care about polls because I don't think they're accurate whether or not people tell the truth when polled.....though in some cases they can be informational.

The election will come down to the economy because as we get closer to the end of next month, people will become more concerned about the holidays and what they can afford to do.

I would have agreed with you on McCain's chances before Palin but I think some of the people that absolutely don't want to vote for Obama aren't likely to vote for McCain because of Palin. People with extreme racist convictions may choose racism over the economy but I think the number that is likely to do that is going to start to go down.....they just won't tell their friends.

Well now I can rejoice at the thought of Newt Gingrich running for President in four years.

I don't care about polls because I don't think they're accurate whether or not people tell the truth when polled.....though in some cases they can be informational.

The election will come down to the economy because as we get closer to the end of next month, people will become more concerned about the holidays and what they can afford to do.

I would have agreed with you on McCain's chances before Palin but I think some of the people that absolutely don't want to vote for Obama aren't likely to vote for McCain because of Palin. People with extreme racist convictions may choose racism over the economy but I think the number that is likely to do that is going to start to go down.....they just won't tell their friends.

I do not think bigots would support the Democratic Party period. Maybe the bigots will stay at home. I hope so. You know though bigots are stupid and they probably are too stupid to be offended by McCain's cynical selection of Palin. Oh, let me make it perfectly clear that I do not think that McCain panders to bigots, nor do I think most of the Republican Party pander to bigots. I just think Democrats are tied in to the civil rights movements and are advocates of civil rights for people of color, low income people and gays and lesbians.

It was ill-timed. But, as bad as it comes off, here's my thing....

They never listened to her before. NOW you do? Ignore the woman!

And NG? I wonder what tree stump he's hiding under this morning? I was watching that live when she said that, and the guy who said "Surprise, surprise, surprise, surprise" had me rolling. Gingrich torpedoed his own party for his selfish gain.

The RP is just imploding right before my eyes.

There's a split in that party and it's not over voting for this or that, it's over who the leader is. It's not Bush and it's not McCain.

I do not think bigots would support the Democratic Party period. Maybe the bigots will stay at home. I hope so. You know though bigots are stupid and they probably are too stupid to be offended by McCain's cynical selection of Palin. Oh, let me make it perfectly clear that I do not think that McCain panders to bigots, nor do I think most of the Republican Party pander to bigots. I just think Democrats are tied in to the civil rights movements and are advocates of civil rights for people of color, low income people and gays and lesbians.

I was thinking more along the lines of some of them not voting. I don't think bigots are all stupid. I think there are those who are ignorant about certain things....race being one of them.

There are Democrats who are like that as well and I think those that are not as extreme and may just have an issue with "change" might come around depending on the effects the economy has on them.

I don't think the Republican party panders to bigots either but I do think that bigots are more attracted to that party than the other. Part of that is because the Republican party looks more exclusive and the label that they are the party of the rich. Even though there are plenty of rich Democrats, the civil rights connections make them appear the more inclusive party.

Bill Clinton is the star of McCain's new national ad.

Full script:

ANNCR: John McCain fought to rein in Fannie and Freddie.

The Post says: McCain "pushed for stronger regulation"..."while Mr. Obama was notably silent."

But, Democrats blocked the reforms.

Loans soared.

Then, the bubble burst.

And, taxpayers are on the hook for billions.

Bill Clinton knows who is responsible.

PRESIDENT BILL CLINTON: "I think the responsibility that the Democrats have may rest more in resisting any efforts by Republicans in the Congress or by me when I was President to put some standards and tighten up a little on Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac."

ANNCR: You're right, Mr. President. It didn't have to happen.

JOHN MCCAIN: I'm John McCain and I approve this message.

My reaction...

Like I haven't heard of Rick Davis.

Bill Clinton is the star of McCain's new national ad.

My reaction... Like I haven't heard of Rick Davis.

I wonder what BC will say now about the McCain campaign.

OOOPS, I was wrong and Casey was right. The Senate can vote on the rescue package first. I thought it was a revenue bill and they have to originate in the House.

My boo boo.

I think John McCain and Barack Obama would be well-served to never mention the other in ad for the remainder of this campaign. McCain has not had a positive ad -- well I can not remember him ever having a positive ad. It's just exhausting.

OOOPS, I was wrong and Casey was right. The Senate can vote on the rescue package first. I thought it was a revenue bill and they have to originate in the House.

My boo boo.

I think John McCain and Barack Obama would be well-served to never mention the other in ad for the remainder of this campaign. McCain has not had a positive ad -- well I can not remember him ever having a positive ad. It's just exhausting.

I still don't think it makes any sense for the Senate to waste time voting on something that will require a re-vote since the hurdle remains with the House.

IA with you on the ads....especially the negative ones.

I just read this a little while ago:

DES MOINES, Iowa — Republican presidential nominee John McCain is urging the Treasury Department to intervene aggressively to limit damage from the financial meltdown, action that McCain says President Bush can take with the stroke of a pen.

Opening a business round-table Tuesday in Des Moines, Iowa, McCain said he has urged the Treasury to use its exchange stabilization fund "as creatively as possible" to backstop the market crisis. He says officials also should use the authority granted in a housing bill to purchase up to a trillion dollars in mortgages.

McCain decried the defeat of the financial bailout measure in the House, and he warned that the nation's political leaders will have to take risks even though solutions to the crisis may be unpopular.

The ESF has about $50.1 billion, $50 billion of which it made temporarily available on the 19th to guarantee deposits in certain money market funds so they probably won't be able to do much "as creatively as possible."

The big irony is the housing bill was sponsored by none other than Nancy Pelosi with no bipartisan support, and there's a possibility that what McCain is suggesting could bankrupt the FHA.

I still don't think it makes any sense for the Senate to waste time voting on something that will require a re-vote since the hurdle remains with the House.

IA with you on the ads....especially the negative ones.

I just read this a little while ago:

The ESF has about $50.1 billion, $50 billion of which it made temporarily available on the 19th to guarantee deposits in certain money market funds so they probably won't be able to do much "as creatively as possible."

The big irony is the housing bill was sponsored by none other than Nancy Pelosi with no bipartisan support, and there's a possibility that what McCain is suggesting could bankrupt the FHA.

I agree about the Senate. There is no reason for it to act unless it wants to show the House how big boys and girls behave.

I didn't know that about the ESF. It's just another gimmick. Now really is not the time for gimmicks.

I agree about the Senate. There is no reason for it to act unless it wants to show the House how big boys and girls behave.

I didn't know that about the ESF. It's just another gimmick. Now really is not the time for gimmicks.

They're still not doing a good job communicating the credit issue to the public. I watched CNN briefly and they did this piece on why Bush's message isn't getting through.....well it was all about voters distrusting him. All those strategists and it doesn't dawn on them that they should send someone out with more credibility with a simpler explanation of the problem.

Katie Couric is going to be cursed again because of this:

Katie Couric: You made a funny comment, you've said you have been listening to Joe Biden's speeches since you were in second grade.

Gov. Palin: It's been since like '72, yah.

Katie Couric: You have a 72-year-old running mate, is that kind of a risky thing to say, insinuating that Joe Biden's been around awhile?

Gov. Palin: Oh no, it's nothing negative at all. He's got a lot of experience and just stating the fact there, that we've been hearing his speeches for all these years. So he's got a tremendous amount of experience and, you know, I'm the new energy, the new face, the new ideas and he's got the experience based on many many years in the Senate and voters are gonna have a choice there of what it is that they want in these next four years.

Is she really saying people should go for change over experience?