2008: The Directors and Writers Thread

[heatherwebber]

I wouldn't even begin to guess who's in control. I think there's way too many parties involved now to figure it out.

Unlike B&B which is mostly Bradley, Y&R has a bunch of hands in the pot at this point. And as I said earlier those in charge might be quite happy with things as they are. Only time (and possible future changes) might tell us the answer to that question.

You've also got to factor in that the networks and production companies are struggling to keep the soap format alive in a world of shrinking viewership.

And it's also got to be a factor that the SoapNet model appears to be failing "as is." That's why it's growing various non-soap material and being "made over" slowly. If for example they'd suddenly drop Y&R & Days that might have a financial impact on both shows. Or maybe not. Who knows?

I would also suspect that Barbara Bloom is more of an influence on Y&R and to a lesser extent B&B. I think in the past the Bells were allowed more freedom but that the network has likely been butting in more and more.

[Y&RWorldTurner]

As I said before, I wouldn't be surprised if both Bell and Griffith are out by the end of the year. I know soap ratings across the board are irratic, but how do you explain going from a 4.3 to a 3.4 in one week? Something isn't right there. Even if the strike didn't happen, I bet my life on the fact that Latham would've been fired when her contract cycle was up, because of the creative damage she had brought to the show, but also sinking ratings. Well, now we have a problem of ratings being lower post-Latham, I don't think Sony, The Bell's, and CBS are too happy about that. the good thing is, Y&R makes changes fairly fast when compared to other soaps. The bad part to this is that they can sometimes makes really bad changes, like now.

I don't think Griifth and Bell will be there for too long, at least if the ratings and storylines don't improve...

[heatherwebber]

Sad truth is I think ratings are going to continue to fall across the board. I think the format is probably doomed, ultimately.

[Chris B]

The main problems with Y&R stem from MAB's original stories and new characters. She's done a fantastic job ending LML's stories or at least making them interesting, as is the case with David's development. This story has revived Jabot, involves Nikki, Brad, Jill and to a lesser extent Cane, Heather, Lily and Chloe who could be better utilized. Overall her stories are dull and her new characters Chloe, Sabrina, Adam, etc. seem pushed on us with thin development. She also has LML's problem of bringing on characters like Kyon and Skye who hog screentime for two days and disappear. You just don't do that on a soap opera. In order for the show to truly improve it needs a new EP and someone with Y&R experience to match MAB and her boring art stories. Someone who can truly dig in the past, give us some interesting returns and spice things up.

[Sylph]

I only said how long she's been in the credits. Nothing else, i. e. that doesn't mean her stories started Dec. 26th, 2007.

I know. That is why I love her. I'm not one of her detractors, I just said that slowly, slowly I'm starting to lose patience.

[Sylph]

As I said previously, Sony lost all authority since their interventions were completely damaging. Now they returned Y&R in the hands of the Bells. So I really think they don't have that much of an influence, at least not on a daily basis.

[MarkH]

The main problems with Y&R stem from MAB's original stories and new characters. She's done a fantastic job ending LML's stories or at least making them interesting, as is the case with David's development. This story has revived Jabot, involves Nikki, Brad, Jill and to a lesser extent Cane, Heather, Lily and Chloe who could be better utilized. Overall her stories are dull and her new characters Chloe, Sabrina, Adam, etc. seem pushed on us with thin development. She also has LML's problem of bringing on characters like Kyon and Skye who hog screentime for two days and disappear. You just don't do that on a soap opera. In order for the show to truly improve it needs a new EP and someone with Y&R experience to match MAB and her boring art stories. Someone who can truly dig in the past, give us some interesting returns and spice things up.

See, now I'm with you to a point. I think Adam and Sabrina are the best thing since sliced bread. I think both are remarkably well acted, especially for newbies just out of the gate, I think both are already interesting, and that we're getting to know them more and more every day (especially Adam). I think that we're in set-up mode....frankly, I think Adam and Sabrina are headed for a torrid affair that they both regret...and the dynamics will be "how could we have done this to Victor?". The suspense can last months...especially if Sabrina turns up pregnant (since Victor's had a number of vasectomies).

For the kind of story I am speculating will occur, you MUST give it time...it simply requires months of setup for us to invest deeply.

Oh, sure, it could go faster...but then that would be a Brad Bell story, and I don't want that.

Yes, the balance is still off. We got a bit too much Gloria. As much as I love Adam and Sabrina, we're getting enough of them that it is cutting into others.

Y&R never really did the "umbrella" story--except for corporate stuff, which only wrapped up a subset of the cast. I do think we need to find some ways to increase use of other beloved vets and characters on the show.

That said...let's face it...the canvas is simply too big, and Y&R has not done any hard trimming in ages. I don't want any of the following to happen, but they could happen without much pain: (A) The Winters' leave Genoa City; ( Paul goes to California to be with Ricky, and takes Heather; © Jeanne Cooper retires, and occurs infrequently on recurring status; (D) Jeff Bardwell and David Chow die horrible deaths and leave town.

Already, we have a much smaller canvas, and (in light of how stories have been for the last 12 months or so), we don't feel it much.

One thing that seems to be emerging is a pattern of writing stories for people that are "bounded". So. Lily's pregnancy drove story (in a good way) for several weeks...but it had a defined start-middle-end. So too, Gloria and the Karma saga drove story for a few weeks, and now it seems to be on hold.

That is not a structure that works well on daytime. It means we see this intense period with a small group of characters, while everyone else fades to the background. Moreover, the intense story ends, and the repercussions of it for longer-term story are less obvious.

What the Y&R crew is NOT doing well right now (with the possible exception of the Newmans) is setting up "long story". Here is where Bell stalwarts like Kay Alden, Jack Smith, Jerry Birn all excelled. I think they need to bring those consultants in to help Maria plot out some long arcs (6- and 12-month stories), and then I think she can execute better. Maria's most immediate writing mentor was BRAD Bell, and he sucks at long story.

One final note: It may be that there is a deliberate attempt to avoid long-story, believing that you need shorter stories requiring less commitment from the busy modern viewer. If that is the case, then we're again dealing with story directed by some corporate (e.g., CBS) mandates...and not by the creative needs of the show.

[heatherwebber]

<<<Sony--- Now they returned Y&R in the hands of the Bells. So I really think they don't have that much of an influence, at least not on a daily basis. >>>

If that's true then things will change. But hopefully it won't turn into another B&B where 2 characters (Ridge & Brooke) end up dominating the show in a constantly repeating cycle of the same thing over & over. That seems to be a Bradley Bell flaw.

But really we have no idea yet what Maria wants or won't want, how much influence Josh will retain, etc.

So far I haven't seen any sweeping changes. That might suggest they're happy with the status quo.

I think the show seemed to have a bit more focus during the strike when it was Josh & Maria, but sort of slowed down when Josh stepped back upstairs. I'm not sure how to explain that. It also became a bit more Adam-heavy which I don't think is all that great. I'm getting to have more & more reservation about this particular actor.

[R Sinclair]

Don't go there, Ron Jay. For the love of GOD, don't go there! I tried to gloss over that because even back before McTavish was canned, people were just KNOWING that Kay Alden was rewriting McTavish's stuff, talking about "the Alden Influenced episodes." The "Alden Stint" is just a myth, but people will go to their graves believing wholeheartedly that this woman was WRITING.

Nevermind the fact that her "consulting" stint was just code for "auditioning" -- which, clearly, she didn't make the cut. There is NO WAY Alden could learn the show's history, write her own SIX MONTH story projection and rewrite another writer's stories in the brief amount of time she was there. But, like I said, people are going to wrestle the naysayers to the ground, believing Kay Alden's "stint" actually existed.

[Dr. Jay S.W.]

There you have it!!

[Sylph]

I love this post.

But it is also possible that she watched AMC closely for some time before her agent tried to sell her to ABC and in that time made some rough draft of a bible. It's not like she didn't do it before... Still, I don't think so.

[DevotedToAMC]

Hey I would rather have Kay Alden at AMC than those hacks B&E

[PAsoapfan]

Me too I really think Kay could bring AMC into another Golden ERA.

[Sylph]

Apparently, no one reads my posts... I warned you, and so did many others, about those two. I also for the gazillionth time have to say that she would do well at AMC, but the clock is ticking and this whole "Kay Alden to AMC" seems very unlikely now.

[Y&RWorldTurner]

Alden's never leaving the safety of Brad Bell's show, especially to depart to something on ABC, especially after her experience there.

I'm with R Sinclair when it comes to Alden's consulting at AMC last year. She sure as hell didn't write anything, or else she would've have to have been credited for it. Also, how is anyone sure she'd be a good fit at that show? She did say she started watching only when she was hired to consult by ABC, has no experience with that show, and she'd mostly like have to learn the history of the characters and their prior storylines as she went along - that would make for a very choppy show.