Vee

Dorian did try to use it for leverage against Viki at the very end, when Viki was haranguing her about Joey, etc. This led to Viki's split into Tommy and attack on Dorian in that same scene. I can buy Dorian holding it back beyond her usual instincts til the bitter end, especially given her own family background, working any other angle to get free or even perhaps hoping Viki would remember on her own. I think that makes her all the more complex.

Amelia Heinle, of all people, has one of the great one-liners of all time in Loving Murders #49. Tony: So how's the breathing coming? Steffi (dryly): Well, I'm breathing, which makes me kind of unique in this town.

Notice, too, they don't just bring Hillary back on Y&R. I know she died onscreen but come on. So did Jesse Hubbard and Mitch Laurence (twice). Keeping Mishael Morgan as the less-popular doppelgänger is, to me, at least partly strategic if not also possibly thoughtless. Whether it was by design or not, no twin will have the same fire and built-in fanbase. (And when Loving did it, Darnell Williams was swiftly re-paired with Debbi Morgan)

I remember this entire damn forum going through the stages of grief on the Loren Lott mess and that was not that long ago. Another waste. Just goes to show how systemic the issue is.

I haven't always thought everything Holly said was fair. But that doesn't really matter in the scheme here because on one level or another, literal or figurative, it's all true, most of it absolutely factually so. You don't have to watch her or read her book for longer than two minutes. It's what she lived and she'd been suffering with it for decades. We didn't have as clear a light shone on it in years past but we do now. Just because we as a removed audience can now see her onscreen wedding with Arthur Burghardt as described shot for shot in her book years ago, or hear corroboration of many of Vicky Rowell or Kristoff St. John's experiences at CBS from other performers of color, doesn't mean they haven't had to live with those wounds for decades before we could know it for ourselves. On a side note: I am still deep in the Loving Murders of 1995, which I hadn't seen since childhood, and it's still unbelievable that a frontburner black canvas of six people is more active, vibrant and central than any show's black cast twenty five years later.

Dorian knew and never told, and I always thought that was the most brilliant part of the story. She could've exonerated herself any day for decades but lived with the hatred and scorn from the town for years out of a higher sense of honor. She does rail at Viki about it in the final reveal scenes in early '95. I knew people who loved Helen Gallagher from RH as Mel's mom, and that whole era. I knew many who did not. I loved Labine's GH but I found her OLTL sleepy at best. She didn't want to be there anyway; she was running out her contract after ABC passed her over for the Heart & Soul spinoff with Ned and Lois.

I'd forgotten that in #8 in the LM playlist - the great episode with Clay's twisted Leave it to Beaver VR(!!) interlude and the wonderful scenes with Gwyneth and Jeremy - that the biggest clue is right there from the very start.

I don't know how anyone can watch some of that '86 stuff with Holden and Lily, the stables, the horses and the storm and not know this is a gay man enraptured with one of several very specific types of men and ingenues he revisited again and again.

Marland's work always reads very queer to me onscreen. From what I've seen over the years it's consistently populated by imperious and/or neurotic, layered women struggling with secrets or deeper passionate needs, and gorgeous yet very vulnerable or tempestuous young men. (And Doug Cummings, played by his longtme favorite JWS, is basically a deranged theater queen) If you go by the scuttlebutt you can project that Marland was infatuated with the men and embodied in many of the women, like Iva or Lily. But I suppose that's reductive stereotyping too.

What!!

@DRW50

Jordan Peele did say he appreciated the gesture, actually. He was just amused by the meme.

January '93, on a break from LM: Patricia Barry - glamorous, chic and imposing, AMC's Peg English (was Agnes in one the recast?) - is instantly more compelling an Isabelle than nice old lady Augusta Dabney. I've yet to see the legendary Celeste Holm in the role but I love her Hollywood work. It's interesting how dramatically they'd change a traditional elder female character based on a recast, or was Dabney's original ever an operator like Barry's? I guess when Agnes brought Cabot back her role was seen as redundant. Barry and Wesley Addy together would be interesting to see; based on my memory of Addy's work in film and occasionally here, she's tougher than he is. They are really working those (wonderful) film score cues from Jennifer 8 and Presumed Innocent to death. We now know Gottlieb was involved at LOV in '95, but could this be her influence across the daypart earlier? She used many film cues at OLTL; OTOH, some soaps had used them prior to the advent of Gottlieb. They are still treating Gwyneth very differently (negligee, young stud Armand - what happened to him?) than they would by November (and Agnes), when she comes off as a frumpy woman in a midlife crisis desperate to hold on to Buck. This show really did burn through story insanely fast. The year opens on Jeremy, the most powerful college art instructor ever, being teased with Stacey, while Ava is fully into the frankly very dim-seeming Leo. By summer's end or so Ava has burned through both Leo and Jeremy and on to Alex, Stacey is being pulled to Buck I guess, etc. No clue how things ended with Jeremy and Stacey. All I know is Susan Keith is wasted with or without Leo as far as I see. When did Jack Forbes die, why did they kill him off and how long did it take for Clay to marry Stacey? In fairness they were clearly bored with Jack beforehand, as I can recall them teasing Stacey with Trucker the previous spring during that hidden room caper - which led to the reveal of Clay's paternity, right? Clay's drunken lament and justification for his scheme at her bedside was another excellent showcase for Dennis Parlato. Nada Rowland seems dressed and styled much more as a geriatric woman than she would a year or two later. Also, Ally watching AMC on the couch - lol. This is Guza and Taggert, right? Agnes is later in the year. Who introduces Steffi?

Is there a good, long, substantive piece out there on de Blasio's foolishness and long fall during the pandemic and onward? I can't keep track of everything rn and have only fitfully monitored his tomfoolery since moving west. He was a fool when I lived there too.

If you can't see the full article, be sure to copy and paste the above link into the bottom field here at archive.is - it archives all stories for free.

Apparently 2020 is the year of COVID-19, BLM and Loving. Are they all on the same 93 playlist?

I have always believed there is more out there of the early Carla, etc. material from OLTL and its '60s/'70s in general than we know. The Museum of Television and Radio has some. Ellen Holly, by her own word, has more she saved, via kinescope I believe. She also claimed urban market affiliates in the '70s kept some of those key episodes featuring her storyline to push it in those markets. ABC may not give a shít but they may still have more somewhere. And in the age of YouTube, so much of what was thought forever lost (like the clips posted so far) keeps turning up. Hell, who knows about Agnes Nixon's estate. She never forgot that storyline, even in her final years; if Holly saved some of it, I wouldn't be surprised to hear Nixon did too. Meanwhile, per those 80s episodes it always struck me how similar Holly comes off in those scenes with Lillian Hayman to Erika Slezak, and Viki. The heart is all right there.

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