Vee

That Portia/Esme stuff was all the strike IIRC. It's not that serious.

Fantasy camp.

I agree with all of the above, but we've all talked about it before and I've rambled on at length about this so I won't belabor it. Sonny back with Brenda and taking a backseat is the only solution. I have little sympathy for Mo's position at this point. He doesn't seem to like being challenged and complains whenever story doesn't go his way, then attacks young actors who don't genuflect before him. He puts in a minimal effort onscreen and then harder story is curtailed either because he complains or struggles with playing it. I think the meds, etc. story stalled out largely because of the creative struggle BTS over vilifying Sonny again and having the town turn on him, which I thought was good material, but if he can't play that what is he willing to play? And what can he bring any consistent energy to at this point? So yes, I'd put him back with Brenda and give her most of their shared story together or separate. Let him cruise in his cushy backburner spot.

Like many characters on the show, Willow has almost no prior character to be 'out of character' against so that complaint doesn't hold water. I agree it's very simple: She's hot for Drew and has been for a long time. People are like that IRL. It's not always about logic.

The fact remains that Mulcahey's work was the only stuff that's fully engaged me with this show for years. I'll miss what we've gotten (particularly if the Drew/Willow/Nina stuff is about to hit a new peak). I couldn't care less which kind of Sonny the general audience prefers, because I don't really care about Sonny much. Watching him spiral and the town turn on him properly has worked well for me. MB is barely able to function onscreen these days anyway. Blaze I also couldn't care less about. But the turn to sympathizing with Natalia is clearly about protecting ELR's place on the show, who is yet another soap 'get' and going interest for Frank Valentini. That's not about PM. I am impressed the Drew/Willow makeout sesh went to air. I thought they'd curtail this with the writing change before it got there, as this show has such allergy to actual soap and sin among the 'good' people.

A mystery man moves along:

@Khan @DRW50

The good news there is they all remain a very online minority, dwindling more.

We shall see.

Oh, it's not that dramatic! But I take your point.

Wild as hell it took half the first page for people to mention Mac Scorpio. Robin, Maxie, Georgie and frankly Maxie's kids as well half the time. I will of course second John as I thought how Sami treated him was unbelievable when he never did anything but step up.

That just looks like a Kids in the Hall character.

I'm not saying the Matthewses serve no purpose, I'm just saying I think the period where they were dominant was relatively smaller compared to some other big sea changes in soap history. The issue was that Rauch and Lemay had no real regard for most of the family, especially Jacquie Courtney and Alice who were absolutely essential to putting over story and new characters IMO. I absolutely agree you needed them as a counterweight and also as foundational elements and key characters. Lemay's show had too few of those and was more enamored of fleeting creative heavyweights from the NY theater scene, many of whom came and went. I think if they'd had stronger Matthews characters (including Pat) to counterbalance the later found family elements you mentioned the show would be in a stronger position. Or if they'd dared to recast some of those cosmopolitan characters Lemay introduced, maybe they would've been more lasting.

LOL you and I both know this ain't shít compared to the old days. I absolutely hope you are right.

There's always going to be media nitpicking of any media hit he does. And there's always going to be Dem bedwetters in Congress. What will matter to me is if it breaks or lasts beyond a few outliers and malcontents once Biden begins to put in the work. All that remains to be seen.

It's been a very long week but it's way too soon to know what the party is going to do overall about the presidency and those efforts. A lot has to happen and coalesce. Biden has been counted out so many times and I believe he can punch back. But it is going to require a lot of media work. I think the majority of the general public, flawed though it is, is more than willing to give him another win if he can meet a minimum standard of proof that he is not embalmed and undead, which I think should be easy for him. He just has to get out there and do it, with more urgency than what exists in the WH press shop right now.

I think this is a wonderful discussion with a ton of valid points, but I also think it's complicated. When Lemay came in AW had been on the air less than a decade. The Matthews were not any more deeply baked in than some of the early families or couples on other soaps in formative periods, like how Bell did a sea change at Y&R or like how certain key couples and characters got sunsetted out at ATWT, GL, etc. early on on television. Even AW had managed to turn over stars like Bill and Missy, Lee, etc. all before the Rauch regime. So I'm not sure we can say that the singular moment in time when the show was simply about the Matthewses, etc. was its purest and best form vs. the next 20+ years. And I say that as someone with very little affinity for AW, so I may just be talking out of my ass which I am known for. What I think is obvious and true is that Lemay and Rauch did not value certain key stars and connective family tissue as much as they should've. It was a massive mistake letting Jacquie Courtney walk who could've shored up so many new arrivals or storylines if they'd had any respect for her, and there were other interesting Matthews family characters that could've been bolstered or brought back, and found better recasts for. (I'm not convinced the twins in their adult forms were the most fascinating options, but I do like Lionel Johnston.) The other key problematic issue is Lemay loved to invest in Broadway/NYC theater talent for roles on his show who would inevitably leave quickly when they got a more exciting gig elsewhere, so you had a revolving door of mostly cosmopolitan characters and some hardscrabble ones, all played by high-end urban actors who would all dip when the next muse surfaced. That's turning over a ton of the canvas often throughout the '70s with little time put into recasts, or putting down stronger roots with some more lasting characters. By the '80s Iris is gone, most of Lemay's fairhaired stars are gone, and what do they do but flounder for much of the next several years and onward? You could've forestalled some of that by investing more in some of the Matthews characters, or marrying them to some of those chic newcomers. What happens if you get a better Willis recast or actually (gasp) recast the enigmatic Carol Lamonte, or others?

I like Gio. But as I said before, what is 'there' of the character? He's a nice boy who plays pretty music. Unless you're gonna go into a hot and heavy summer story with Trina rediscovering her passion with this innocent young man (good luck with the social media outcry watching a Black woman seduce a sweet white kid), there's not many layers yet. He seems to have little flaw. I wouldn't dump him or anything, but there needs to be a hook found. Maybe perfect musician Gio has a drug or self-harm habit related to his obsessive skills, or his imposter syndrome, etc. As for Ava, if this show wanted to get really real they'd finally reveal what I've suspected since before Avery was born: That she is Morgan's, and that Carly has known for her entire life. She kept it from everyone because she knew Morgan was not ready to raise a child and wanted him kept away from Ava Jerome's influence. Then I'd kill the kid, and then the truth would come out.

I'd forgotten about Tracy-Ann Oberman's unfortunate social media hijinks. Great actress but I can't see how she's needed on the show today. Was Cindy's return actually a flop? I wasn't aware one way or the other. I definitely think it was a stunt and part of the same tiresome Americanized trend others have mentioned in this thread above me, sure, but I didn't know that it (or bringing on her ex, family, etc) hasn't had some success. It seemed as though people had taken to Colin Salmon's character at least.

My concern is about the alleged private polling out of some blue wall states (MI, PA, etc.) that is apparently newly bad, where Trump supposedly has opened up like a considerable multi-point lead since the debate. I don't usually go in for this kind of stuff and I think most people know that about me, but if it's real I don't think it can be ignored. I agree Trump hasn't increased his base and has continued to bleed loyalists since 2016. He will always turn the independent off and lose more. That is his major weakness. My concern now is getting Biden in front of the cameras as much as possible to prove who he still is, and pushing back on the Times, A.G. Sulzberger and much of the Beltway media's concerted campaign to take revenge on him for their boredom and loss of access and book deals over the last four years, so he can regain momentum and strength. Then there's the big donor revolt he needs to stop. There is a lot of 2016 in this summer in that the press were bored, put their thumb on the scale against the Democrat they deeply resented and were tired of and are ignoring Trump bc they think he is baked in (and also fun for them). The difference is Hillary never gave them the kind of opening Joe did last week. We're lucky it's early.

I feel this thread is a fairly accurate take. I also feel the media are absolutely overplaying their hands in glee. I do think it's hurt him in some quarters, and I do think (since I first posted that, as we've seen some numbers since) it's getting bad. But I also still think it may yet be too early and too much from the media (which loves to count him out) if the WH is prepared to play this out and get him out in front of enough people and unfortunately, enough craven Beltway talking heads strongly and forcefully. It's going to be work. But fortunately, it's also still July. In the end, if he can push back hard with a full court media blitz and play this out, I think it can burn itself out by the end of the month (if not earlier) and leave them nowhere to go. But we'll see.

It is peanuts. As I said it does nothing to damage Sonny's bottom line or make a move on him. If Ava wanted to get away clean she should've met Natalia in public, plied her with drinks and then been able to blame it on someone like DeWitt targeting Blaze's mother. But still, what does this get her tactically? Nothing. It's just the show meandering.