On 2/15/2024 at 12:48 PM, Vee said:

I wouldn't quite call Jacob and Angie a flop. It was definitely a Xerox couple at best but they worked for me on both LOV and TC and had a real following simply because of Darnell and Debbi. It was not a situation like what was going on with Stefan and Katherine further down the schedule. But yes, it was right to just bring Jesse back (even if the explanation and storyline were ludicrous and still don't make a lot of sense to me, and I watched that storyline everyday).

Pratt couldn't explain his way out of that way; it made no sense, no matter how good it felt for Jesse to be back.

14 minutes ago, Liberty City said:

Pratt couldn't explain his way out of that way; it made no sense, no matter how good it felt for Jesse to be back.

In fairness IIRC it wasn't Pratt; I believe Brown and Esensten wrote the original return story (supposedly with some input from Agnes, who I suspect may only have provided the idea of David Rasche's villain being a Gardner). It was Pratt who later added the angle with Natalia and Jesse having shacked up with Laura Bonarrigo from OLTL for decades.

The story was far from genius but I will give B&E credit for frontloading Darnell and Debbi on multiple soaps and working with a strong Black canvas on Loving, TC and their brief AMC run in this period (which had like 4-6 Black characters at that time, not all related, though again the stories weren't great). I still remember us all revisiting it in 2020 and talking about how revolutionary the major Black quad during the Loving Murders was given what crumbs we often have today.

Edited February 23, 20241 yr by Vee

2 minutes ago, Vee said:

In fairness IIRC it wasn't Pratt; I believe Brown and Esensten wrote the original return story (supposedly with some input from Agnes, who I suspect may only have provided the idea of David Rasche's villain being a Gardner). It was Pratt who later added the angle with Natalia and Jesse having shacked up with Laura Bonarrigo from OLTL for decades.

The story was far from genius but I will give B&E credit for frontloading Darnell and Debbi on multiple soaps and working with a strong Black canvas on Loving, TC and their brief AMC run in this period (which had like 4-6 Black characters at that time, though again the stories weren't great). I still remember us all revisiting it in 2020 and talking about how revolutionary the major Black quad during the Loving Murders was given what crumbs we often have today.

Oh completely; I was unaware James Harmon Brown & Barbara Esensten were behind the return of Jesse; I was just getting into All My Children at this point, honestly, but it was nice seeing a "classic" couple reunite in a then-modern time. Those like Brown & Esensten just don't exist much anymore. Have hopes that Mulcahey may be able to do something alike this on General Hospital at some point in 2024. And I've heard some good things concerning the Loving murders (was it also called the Corinth murders?).

B&E were never brilliant writers anywhere - their hackwork is equally infamous - but I will give them credit for the Loving Murders (which are controversial to this day, as a stroll through the LOV thread will tell you but which I enjoyed a lot) and for their seeming commitment to a Black canvas at most of their shows.

A few years ago the entirety of the storyline was uploaded to YT; it lasted from (IIRC) July '95 to the show's end in early November '95. I don't know if it's still there or not, it went up and down a few times. That's how a lot of us got to revisit it during lockdown, I hadn't seen it since it first aired. I think a lot of people would credit the quality of the LM material vs. B&E's multiple attempts to revisit that hype (like the less popular Masquerade serial killer arc on The City, or the Nursery Rhyme Stalker mess on GL which I believe was also them) to the other creatives on staff at Loving at the time, like Linda Gottlieb who actors from the show recently confirmed was consulting in that storyline in some way - I suspect the excellent ad campaign was her, if nothing else.

But as for how they've been referred to, it's always only been the Loving Murders online or in print. It was alluded to occasionally on other shows (OLTL '95 had Todd hilariously ponder if the unstable Viki might have been 'piling up the bodies like cordwood' in Corinth) and when GH had Luke and I think Holly visit Corinth and the abandoned Alden mansion in summer 2013, I believe Luke did actually call them 'the Loving Murders' in a clever way by referencing the killer's motives.

Edited February 23, 20241 yr by Vee

Quite interesting; thanks so much for the explanation and back story; it's very much appreciated! 🥰

Just now, Liberty City said:

Quite interesting; thanks so much for the explanation and back story; it's very much appreciated! 🥰

There is a lot more in the Loving thread if you dig around; there's much much more knowledgeable posters about the whole of that show than me.

4 minutes ago, Vee said:

There is a lot more in the Loving thread if you dig around; there's much much more knowledgeable posters about the whole of that show than me.

I will have to check it out, thanks so much!!! 🥰

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Edited September 1, 20241 yr by ccroom50