GL now joins some illustrious company in the cancelled soap thread.

Let's share memories and ask questions here.

46 minutes ago, DeeVee said:

 

The other reason is secret children and inconvenient pregnancies (especially those caused by the married main villain) create a lot of drama, as happened with Mindy's ill-fated pregnancy by Roger and what was intended by the introduction of Hart.

There were various reasons Hart kind of failed as a character (I think one of the actors was badly injured in an accident, is that right?) but you can understand why they would think bringing Roger's secret child into the story would be a win.

Yes, Leonard Stab was injured in a hangliding accident. I didn't mind his Hart---Roger was someone who deserved children who gave him hell.

The Guiding Light Sentinel: Weekly Alumni Feature...Leonard Stabb

Ran into this looking for something else & it looked interesting. 

https://marlenadelacroix.com/2009/09/290/

Apologies if everyone else has already seen it recently or something.

2 hours ago, Contessa Donatella said:

Ran into this looking for something else & it looked interesting. 

https://marlenadelacroix.com/2009/09/290/

Apologies if everyone else has already seen it recently or something.

Thank you for posting! I love to read critiques of the show written while it was airing.

Not that I agree with everything. Alan Michael and Eleni--a super couple? Never. In fact, I would argue AM was the spoiler for Frank and Eleni, who as a couple didn't exactly set the soap world on fire.

The thing that strikes me as most interesting here is that this was likely written not long before GL fired Ellen Parker. (Lillian's cancer storyline is mentioned, which leads to the affair with Ed).

If this was a mostly universal opinion among soap critics and the audience at the time, they sure did burn up a lot of good will by killing off Maureen.

@DeeVee I read about the vasectomy and thought that was ridiculous! No way would Roger do that. Why would Peggy do that?

Mindy was the one obsessed on having a baby, not Roger. Thankfully, the German dubbed channel had a Closed-Captioned episode not shown with Blake Marler's channel where they first talk about it during Lizzie's Christening. Roger loved babies, but pretty much thought having another would never happen.

@Contessa Donatella I recall watching some Guiding Light press kit in video form where Michael Zaslow praised the Lillian with breast cancer storyline.  People mentioned how (before his ALS illness caused a mental health crisis) Michael was always up to date on all the storylines. 

I need to learn to post YouTube vids here for an example of good writing can do. 

 

Edited July 20Jul 20 by MLH
corrections

15 minutes ago, MLH said:

Why would Peggy do that?

Honestly, I'm as puzzled as you are. I watched the show on and off at the time. I do remember their wedding. (Fran Myers was hugely pregnant at the time and carried the world's largest bridal bouquet to hide her tummy).

Peggy wasn't just a good character--she was SAINTLY. She had a son, Billy, who she loved. (Roger loved him, too--like you said, he loved kids). On soaps, saintly women loved children and always wanted more.

One explanation I can come up with is that she was told not to have more children after Billy. 

Or, this being written during the mid-70s, feminist issues were brought up on soaps a lot. Possibly, the Dobsons were making the point that even "nice" women didn't always want to have lots of children.

Maybe someone else remembers why?

1 hour ago, DeeVee said:

Thank you for posting! I love to read critiques of the show written while it was airing.

Not that I agree with everything. Alan Michael and Eleni--a super couple? Never. In fact, I would argue AM was the spoiler for Frank and Eleni, who as a couple didn't exactly set the soap world on fire.

The thing that strikes me as most interesting here is that this was likely written not long before GL fired Ellen Parker. (Lillian's cancer storyline is mentioned, which leads to the affair with Ed).

If this was a mostly universal opinion among soap critics and the audience at the time, they sure did burn up a lot of good will by killing off Maureen.

Yeah, agreement? LOL!!! Haven't you heard? It is notable that they say (you know "they") soap fans can never agree on anything. But that makes me wonder aren't they in solidarity in their lack of agreement? 

And, I honestly do not know the answer to your nicely implied question however, in retrospect they phuqued up royally when they killed off Mo!!!

Of course one thing we know there was an excellent writing team in place & they still managed to mess up that bad?!!! 

One last thing, agree about spoiling Frank & Eleni. (They were just asking for it.)

Here, see what Nancy Curlee said, after:

GL HW Nancy Curlee when asked if she had any story regrets, "Although Maureen's death was a lynchpin in a carefully conceived, well-executed story, Ellen Parker was so fine & so well loved, that her absence left a hole in the show that was later hard to fill."

 

 

18 minutes ago, MLH said:

I recall watching some Guiding Light press kit in video form where Michael Zaslow praised the Lillian with breast cancer storyline.  People mentioned how (before his ALS illness caused a mental health crisis) Michael was always up to date on all the storylines. 

I need to learn to post YouTube vids here for an example of good writing can do. 

Those press kits can be very interesting and also sometimes they reveal things they don't intend to by accident. Yes, I remember people remarking on it, that Zas was really savvy & on top of things!

If I can help you with your posting how-tos just say so. 

 

3 minutes ago, Contessa Donatella said:

GL HW Nancy Curlee when asked if she had any story regrets, "Although Maureen's death was a lynchpin in a carefully conceived, well-executed story, Ellen Parker was so fine & so well loved, that her absence left a hole in the show that was later hard to fill."

It was a EXCEPTIONALLY well-executed story and we'd be praising it to the skies to this day--if Maureen had not died at the end of it!

It would have (forgive the pun) breathed life into three characters who were very  underused and boosted the Bauer presence in the story.

But some random people who wanted to make a few quick bucks answering questions about a show they don't watch said no. ☹️

20 minutes ago, DeeVee said:

It was a EXCEPTIONALLY well-executed story and we'd be praising it to the skies to this day--if Maureen had not died at the end of it!

It would have (forgive the pun) breathed life into three characters who were very  underused and boosted the Bauer presence in the story.

But some random people who wanted to make a few quick bucks answering questions about a show they don't watch said no. ☹️

Ahyes, that awful new-ish soap disease that is far too popular, Death By Focus Group!

If ONLY it had ended with the "what if" Curlee described at the Locher Room!!!! 

 

@Contessa Donatella After reading the article you posted, I truly believe that Proctor & Gamble did a decent job promoting the show at the time that article was written.  However, the show relied on Reva's character way too much and re-introduced past characters way too late.  

The show became two different shows.  The Reva Show and Guiding Light.

I also figured out how to post my favorite from April 1979 in my previous post.  This is what I want from a Soap Opera!

Edited July 20Jul 20 by MLH

51 minutes ago, Contessa Donatella said:

Ahyes, that awful new-ish soap disease that is far too popular, Death By Focus Group!

 

or, as the late eileen fulton called them, “f*ck us groups.” 

Edited July 20Jul 20 by wonderwoman1951

9 minutes ago, MLH said:

The show became two different shows.  The Reva Show and Guiding Light.

Like I've said before, if there was any character that defined GL's final 25 years, it was Reva.

Gail Kobe/Pamela Long Spring 1983-Summer 1984 saw the ratings go up from the post-Marland slump and set in motion characters and storylines that carried GL through its final 25 years, but it was too much chasing 1980s trends which wasn't sustainable and caused long-term damage. The ratings from Fall 1984 onward reflected this, and some may say GL never really recovered from it.

6 minutes ago, wonderwoman1951 said:

or, as the late eileen fulton called them, “f*ck groups.” 

Oh, I did not know she'd dubbed it so! I LOVE IT. Thanks!!! Really. Perfection. 

1 hour ago, MLH said:

@DeeVee I read about the vasectomy and thought that was ridiculous! No way would Roger do that. Why would Peggy do that?

Mindy was the one obsessed on having a baby, not Roger. Thankfully, the German dubbed channel had a Closed-Captioned episode not shown with Blake Marler's channel where they first talk about it during Lizzie's Christening. Roger loved babies, but pretty much thought having another would never happen.

@Contessa Donatella I recall watching some Guiding Light press kit in video form where Michael Zaslow praised the Lillian with breast cancer storyline.  People mentioned how (before his ALS illness caused a mental health crisis) Michael was always up to date on all the storylines. 

I need to learn to post YouTube vids here for an example of good writing can do. 

 

Yes, I see!!! Good for you. Hooray, today, for MLH, so hard to pronounce, no vowels & all! (Please I hope you know I am just teasing.) 

 

10 minutes ago, kalbir said:

Like I've said before, if there was any character that defined GL's final 25 years, it was Reva.

Gail Kobe/Pamela Long Spring 1983-Summer 1984 saw the ratings go up from the post-Marland slump and set in motion characters and storylines that carried GL through its final 25 years, but it was too much chasing 1980s trends which wasn't sustainable and caused long-term damage. The ratings from Fall 1984 onward reflected this, and some may say GL never really recovered from it.

Now, if we can just get you to narrow it down: Blame, Fault, you get the idea. Was it Kobe/Long? ConWest? Rauch/Madd/Moonves? or does poor Ellen Wheeler stand alone?

See, I made it multiple choice! (Even people like me who love her find fault.)

 

26 minutes ago, MLH said:

@Contessa Donatella After reading the article you posted, I truly believe that Proctor & Gamble did a decent job promoting the show at the time that article was written.  However, the show relied on Reva's character way too much and re-introduced past characters way too late.  

Very interesting. I am more familiar with AW, so NBC not CBS, but still P&G and NBC did ALL of their show promotions. Different setup at CBS! Amazing, you've given Procter & Gamble a compliment. ... I think. 

17 minutes ago, Contessa Donatella said:

Now, if we can just get you to narrow it down: Blame, Fault, you get the idea. Was it Kobe/Long? ConWest? Rauch/Madd/Moonves? or does poor Ellen Wheeler stand alone?

See, I made it multiple choice! (Even people like me who love her find fault.)

We can blame the decline of GL on many factors:

Douglas Marland departure.

Gail Kobe/Pamela Long chasing all the 1980s trends.

Writer turnover during Joe Willmore run.

Killing off Maureen Bauer.

Nancy Curlee departure.

To me killing off Maureen Bauer felt like the beginning of the end and Nancy Curlee departure felt like the end.

GL was not in a good place creatively in June 1994 (Nancy Curlee departure was three months earlier) when OJ began and I feel it was effectively over in the aftermath of OJ. 

Just now, kalbir said:

We can blame the decline of GL on many factors:

Douglas Marland departure.

Gail Kobe/Pamela Long chasing all the 1980s trends.

Writer turnover during Joe Willmore run.

Killing off Maureen Bauer.

Nancy Curlee departure.

To me killing off Maureen Bauer felt like the beginning of the end and Nancy Curlee departure felt like the end.

GL was not in a good place creatively in June 1994 (Nancy Curlee departure was three months earlier) when OJ began and I feel it was effectively over in the aftermath of OJ. 

Thank you. Very thoughtful & considered opinions. 

It's sorta misleading to say that Douglas Marland departed? But, then, again, maybe not. 

 

Good to read that Marlena write-up above.  Especially notable is the observation that at the time, GL wasn't underestimating the intelligence of its audience.  It was when GL decided to insult my intelligence circa 1995/1996 that I cut my viewership down to maybe 1-2 days per week.  That plus an overload of Reva was too much.  I severed ties with the show completely in 1998.  Why should I remain loyal to something so determinedly poor?

What De LaCroix doesn't mention is the almost unbelievable degree of "adept temperance" that those at GL exhibited during the early 1990s.   The actors, writers, producers, stage hands, etc.  

As an example, speaking of the Lillian/Maureen confrontation in the Bauer kitchen...notice what's NOT in those scenes.  The speed of line delivery has been slowed.  No out of the ordinary lighting.  And, most importantly, NO MUSIC!  None.  Consequently, there's all sorts of room for the audience to feel a very palpable sense of dread.  The scene is set up so well.

Yeah, the writing is much above average, but we know that already.  People comment frequently on the "suburban joke" line that Parker delivers, but in my mind's eye, it's an earlier line in that scene that really makes my eyebrows go up - where Lillian asks, "is this a good time" to which Maureen responds, "another time might be worse".  WHAT?!!  Holy sheyit!  And other than spoken words, there is no other sound.

I've commented earlier how as a consumer of entertainment, I greatly appreciate being manipulated.  This is yet another example of it at Guiding Light, when it good.