GL now joins some illustrious company in the cancelled soap thread.

Let's share memories and ask questions here.

9 hours ago, DRW50 said:

@alwaysAMC Glad to see the mini-reviews again.

Sad to say I don't even know if Hearst would have sold it as he didn't have as much Bauer interaction as he should have, but he would have tried.

Don Stewart fit back in so well, they really should have capitalized on it and at least had him as a recurring figure.

I think to fully enjoy Harley's return you'd have to know her history on the show. They dipped heavily into this (much more than I had expected, especially with Josh and Reva). The scenes with Harley and Reva got some soap press praise at the time, rightfully so. This complicated history isn't really used when she returns full time - I think the work here may be down to the interim writers having more history with the show than the writers who joined in a few months. 

The ball is also Michael Tylo's final appearance as Quint. He was abruptly fired, no exit, and I don't even remember if he was ever mentioned again until Nola's return in 2009. He deserved at least a proper exit, given how important he'd been to the early '80s for GL, but that's what we were getting by this point with P&G.

Don Stewart should have been brought back..with a wife and children born off screen. 

Tylo really needed to be written out but there needed to be an exit I agree...not just because of his past 80s success but just because he was there..and I hate when characters just disappear.  I think having Quint propose to Nola at the ball (flashbacks to courtship and wedding) and Nola just saying "no" she has a life here, which she had to give up for Quint's career, and now she wants her own life...(of course I would not make her Ms. Sad Sack that Rauch did, I would her her open a jazz club styled on her 1930s/40 movies, and she would be like ATWT's Lisa, knowing where all the bodies were buried and who was the baby daddy.) One last dance (flashback to their engagement dance) and we are done, Quint rides off in the sunset with a promise of a reconciliation in the future. 

Edited July 9Jul 9 by Mitch64

10 hours ago, DeeVee said:

Someone commented on YT that the episode before it was the first one after Pam Long's return. Minutes in and Reva is back in her Slut of Springfield red dress and KZ's getting 10 minute monologues for Emmy consideration. 🙄

I always thought not seeing the Ross/Vanessa/Alan story through and making Alan one of Reva's many love slaves was a mistake, but MK leaves a few months later, so it wasn't meant to be, I guess.

With no disrespect to KZ, yeah....and as best I can figure out, she's upset because Josh has a (presumed at this point) dead wife, and he gave her grief over Marah's paternity. I'm sure there's more to it, and Josh could be a pompous a-hole, but she was flippin' intent on marrying Kyle six months after Josh left town. 

I do think that Long too often used Reva's poor upbringing as an excuse for her selfish behavior. 

It's too bad more of the Ross/Vanessa/Alan story preceeding this isn't in English. Ross and Alan had a long history of animosity, and I always thought Jerry and Chris played off each other well. And don't get me started on casting Vanessa as some malleable also-ran to Reva. Not that any attraction between Vanessa and Alan makes sense, as Vanessa knew Alan was a snake from the minute she vamped into town. 

9 hours ago, MLH said:

@P.J. Ben Warren.  I stopped watching when they had Blake acting stupid again over him and all that actor did to me was whisper his lines and acted like that meant he was mysterious or whatever. It was hard enough with how they did the Roger/Amanda storyline after Michael Z. left.  

I loathe and despise Hunt Block's characters. I remember being disgusted at the Blake/Ben affair and then they fired him---and ATWT snatched him up to play Craig Montgomery. I lobster hated him in that role. Not only did they destroy Craig (by rewriting him into reverting into his previous a-hole behavior), but they insisted on making him the also-ran between Carly and Jack for nearly all of his five year run. SMH.

1 hour ago, P.J. said:

And don't get me started on casting Vanessa as some malleable also-ran to Reva.

Just like they did with Sonni, Annie, Olivia...it was always ridiculous. Vanessa should have wiped up the floor with Reva.

1 hour ago, P.J. said:

Not that any attraction between Vanessa and Alan makes sense, as Vanessa knew Alan was a snake from the minute she vamped into town. 

There's so much history being rewritten here. I would much rather they had them acknowledging that they're on to each other because they know each other so well. Vanessa usually had to suppress the vampy--and yes, snaky--part of herself with other men.

1 hour ago, P.J. said:

I loathe and despise Hunt Block's characters. I remember being disgusted at the Blake/Ben affair and then they fired him---and ATWT snatched him up to play Craig Montgomery.

I had the same problem with Ben as I did with Jeffrey. It wasn't just that he was a bad guy. He was so UNPLEASANT. No nuance, no layers. 

Hunt Block was on ATWT around the time Roger Howarth came on the show. Always thought Howarth would have been a much better Craig. Even though Howarth was a tad young at the time, I think it could have worked.

Edited July 10Jul 10 by DeeVee

1 hour ago, DeeVee said:

Just like they did with Sonni, Annie, Olivia...it was always ridiculous. Vanessa should have wiped up the floor with Reva.19

There's so much history being rewritten here. I would much rather they had them acknowledging that they're on to each other because they know each other so well. Vanessa usually had to suppress the vampy--and yes, snaky--part of herself with other men.

I had the same problem with Ben as I did with Jeffrey. It wasn't just that he was a bad guy. He was so UNPLEASANT. No nuance, no layers. 

Hunt Block was on ATWT around the time Roger Howarth came on the show. Always thought Howarth would have been a much better Craig. Even though Howarth was a tad young at the time, I think it could have worked.

Now that I watched a couple of more episodes....Van and Alan do mention their history and how this would be making order out of their chaotic lives and not a love match (which of course causes chaos). But time and again, Alan tells Van one thing, only to run to Reva and say the exact opposite. He proposes to Van out of the blue, then turns around and invites Reva on a business trip to Hawaii. OY. There is a delicious moment after Alan and Van have sex where she flat out tells him that if he marries her and then turns around and hurts her, she will make him pay. DAMN...talk about a missed opportunity. It was like 1982 Van stepped out of a painting (LOL) and came out to play.

Yes, of course Van should've wiped the floor with Reva. But Long was never interested in Reva being on the losing end of any fight. What I also noticed is how Vanessa's wardrobe practically changed on a dime with Long's return. Just a few months before, Van is in cute, flirty dresses (the dress that Harley later wears, there's a red sundress-y type that she wears to the anniversary celebration, and a real cute dress she wears at Dinah's graduation.) But Long comes back, and suddenly she's running between dates in a huge formal gown only slightly less noisy than Grand Central Station, and the gown she wears before bedding Alan has a huge skirt with a stiff looking jacket. 

The lack of nuance is what I hate about both Block and Howarth. Block couldn't even muster an emotion when his on-screen son died.

2 hours ago, DeeVee said:

Hunt Block was on ATWT around the time Roger Howarth came on the show. Always thought Howarth would have been a much better Craig. Even though Howarth was a tad young at the time, I think it could have worked.

howarth was barbara bloom first attempt to turn ‘world turns into an abc soap. there was no reason to recast paul ryan when scott holroyd was so good.

then, a few years later, scott bryce was fired as craig and replaced with jon lindstrom.  fwiw: bloom worked with both actors when she was running abc daytime. 

47 minutes ago, P.J. said:

Yes, of course Van should've wiped the floor with Reva. But Long was never interested in Reva being on the losing end of any fight.

I've pointed this out before, but I think Pamela Long diminished Vanessa in favor of her creations Reva and Alexandra.

I have some questions.  Did Vanessa hate the Spaulding family and that is why she told Roger about the 'file' that would bring them down? What happened to Roger's former agency boss, Vaughn?  He was like a father figure to Roger, and i thought they worked well together. Did they drop WSPR altogether?  What did Holly do for a living after Roger and Fletcher left? Did Holly even try and find Meg?

@P.J. Gary Swanson went to prison.  I recall reading an article with the actor saying that his character was really popular and he was open to returning, but I guess when Sherry left, they went for more toned down (to me boring) Blake. Sherry's version was way more film noir. 

IMO, when it came to Reva and Josh, they were the ultimate 'love the one you're with' characters.  

IMO, the outdoor scenes done when Billy Lewis returning in 1989 were 1000% better than anything they did by the late 90s into 2000s.  

Unpopular opinion, I thought the Brent/Marian storyline was just OK. I wish they went the Giallo route instead. I thought the Coopers were way overdone and uninteresting. 

Edited July 10Jul 10 by MLH

30 minutes ago, wonderwoman1951 said:

howarth was barbara bloom first attempt to turn ‘world turns into an abc soap. there was no reason to recast paul ryan when scott holroyd was so good.

then, a few years later, scott bryce was fired as craig and replaced with jon lindstrom.  fwiw: bloom worked with both actors when she was running abc daytime. 

Sounds like JFP wasn't the only one who did "friends of..." casting. 

Didn't realize Howarth was a touchy subject. 😂 My mom was a big fan and followed him to every soap he went to.

22 minutes ago, kalbir said:

I've pointed this out before, but I think Pamela Long diminished Vanessa in favor of her creations Reva and Alexandra.

Yeah, once Jordan was gone, she didn't seem to know what to do with her. She inherited the Ross/Vanessa rekindled romance situation and canned it practically on the first day of her return.

4 minutes ago, DeeVee said:

Sounds like JFP wasn't the only one who did "friends of..." casting. 

 

Roger Howarth notwithstanding there were more than one attempt at the ABCification of P&G/CBS soaps. Can we all spell Susan Batten? Yes, I thought we could. No good reason at all to fire Allyson Rice-Taylor.

9 hours ago, Contessa Donatella said:

Roger Howarth notwithstanding there were more than one attempt at the ABCification of P&G/CBS soaps. Can we all spell Susan Batten? Yes, I thought we could. No good reason at all to fire Allyson Rice-Taylor.

yes, susan batten was the first at ‘world turns — one of the worst recasts ever —  but nothing compared to what barbara bloom did when she took over cbs daytime in 2003. left jfp in the dust.

it was like a full employment program for people she worked with at abc: after roger howarth and jon lindstrom — nothing against any of the actors —  there was noelle beck replacing martha byrne, kin shriner, stuart damon, julie pinson, and probably a few more i don’t recall off the top of my head. 

Edited July 10Jul 10 by wonderwoman1951

9 hours ago, DeeVee said:

Didn't realize Howarth was a touchy subject. 😂 My mom was a big fan and followed him to every soap he went to.

9 hours ago, kalbir said:

which is exactly what bloom was hoping. but gaining new viewers comes at the expense of alienating current viewers — some of whom will stop watching. 

Edited July 10Jul 10 by wonderwoman1951

1 minute ago, wonderwoman1951 said:

which is exactly what bloom was hoping. but gaining new viewers comes at the expense of alienating current viewers — some of whom will stop watching. 

Not everyone is as devoted a fan as my mom was. 😂

Recasts are bad enough. It's when they create new characters for actors who were a big deal on another soap that we get  some of the worst outcomes. Usually, because they don't bother to take the time to create a character and weave them into the fabric of the show. They expect their "stardom" to carry the day.

I think something TPTB never realize is it's not just the actor who appeals to the audience, it's a particular actor playing a particular character that creates the magic.

It's not that actors can't successfully create more than one indelible character--Bev, for instance, created two on two different soaps. Marcy Walker was hugely successful on two soaps. But then she came on GL and tanked because Tangie was not a well-defined character. 

Not understanding this kind of thing is why they come up with dopey ideas like trying to cast Micheal Zaslow as Alan. Luckily,  Zaslow was smart enough to immediately shut that down. 

56 minutes ago, wonderwoman1951 said:

yes, susan batten was the first at ‘world turns — one of the worst recasts ever —  but nothing compared to what barbara bloom did when she took over cbs daytime in 2003. left jfp in the dust.

it was like a full employment program for people she worked with at abc: after roger howarth and jon lindstrom — nothing against any of the actors —  there was noelle beck replacing martha byrne, kin shriner, stuart damon, julie pinson, and probably a few more i don’t recall off the top of my head. 

I know. I lived through it. We all did. At times I did not know if we would make it. I mean, don't get me wrong. I love Stuart Damon & I even love Julie Pinson but between Bloom at the top & Jean Passananante identifying with her character, Italian from the midwest, Pinson almost ate the show. And, this was after Goutman for no reason kicked Martha to the curb. And, this after the year before Martha voluntarily took a substantial $$ cut. BTW, I don't know why we're talking about ATWT. Sorry.

11 hours ago, P.J. said:

The lack of nuance is what I hate about both Block and Howarth. Block couldn't even muster an emotion when his on-screen son died.

And, OMG, what went on, when they killed him off. Much has been written, and more may be. Todd Rotundi, Craig's oldest child, a son, those of us who really were into Jenn, didn't count.

Edited July 10Jul 10 by Contessa Donatella

15 minutes ago, DeeVee said:

Not everyone is as devoted a fan as my mom was. 😂

Recasts are bad enough. It's when they create new characters for actors who were a big deal on another soap that we get  some of the worst outcomes. Usually, because they don't bother to take the time to create a character and weave them into the fabric of the show. They expect their "stardom" to carry the day.

I think something TPTB never realize is it's not just the actor who appeals to the audience, it's a particular actor playing a particular character that creates the magic.

It's not that actors can't successfully create more than one indelible character--Bev, for instance, created two on two different soaps. Marcy Walker was hugely successful on two soaps. But then she came on GL and tanked because Tangie was not a well-defined character. 

Not understanding this kind of thing is why they come up with dopey ideas like trying to cast Micheal Zaslow as Alan. Luckily,  Zaslow was smart enough to immediately shut that down. 

Totally agree.  Roger should have been mentioning Tangie vaguely or by name before she showed up.  

IMO, GL didn't know how to have two villains at once. They made Alan and Roger way too similar. I also think they didn't know how to do the Spaulding family dynamic right like GH did with the Quartermain family, because of the constant recasting.  I like the Alan Michael that Harley & Blake married.  I like Rick Hearst, but Alan Michael became another person once Eleni showed up. 

I think I stopped watching Soaps when I started working full time.  I didn't have a way to tape anything and basically followed storylines by reading Soap Opera Digest or whatever magazine at the grocery store. 

Looking back, I was basically a GH gal (80s to 90s) that turned into a DAYS gal in 89/90  (I was really into Jack D., Eve and Izzy B). 

3 minutes ago, MLH said:

IMO, GL didn't know how to have two villains at once. They made Alan and Roger way too similar.

That was true only of the late era of GL. Back during the Dobsons/Marland era they were much more defined and a fantastic dynamic. Plus, Raines was never on the same level as Zaslow. Bernau and Zaslow were like watching two champions go at it.