Nick hasn't had anything to do with the Marone shipping empire since early 2007. After Stephanie exposed Jackie's secret past selling herself for sex in Seattle at the first fashion show of the Marone-run Forrester Creations, the Marone board voted to oust Nick as Marone's CEO and to sell Forrester Creations (which Marone had purchased from the Forresters and Brooke). Stephanie and Ridge were quick to offer to buy back the company, but Nick pulled a fast one and sold all his Marone stock options to the new CEO in return for getting Forrester and the Marone mansion as his severance package. When the Forresters opened their new company, Forrester Originals, Nick tried to lock them out of the market by taking out loans against all his assets to buy up all the couture distributors except Fenmore's, which he incorporated into Jackie M. After Nick sold Forrester back to Eric, he used some of that money to buy Spectra, which has also since been incorporated into Jackie M, but he still had loans to pay off. So pretty much everything Nick has is tied up in Jackie M in one way or another.

Wow! Now that you write out all this, I remember. I also confess that this one of the two periods where I took B&B off my DVR (until I got sucked back in by Betty White, Heather Tom, Eileen Davidson).

I think it might have been good to remind viewers a bit about all of this.

Jack Wagner must be miserable. His character is SO far from the 'strong sailor' he created, it is incredible.

Wow! Now that you write out all this, I remember. I also confess that this one of the two periods where I took B&B off my DVR (until I got sucked back in by Betty White, Heather Tom, Eileen Davidson).

I actually liked that period with "Dark Nick" being out to take down the Forresters by using their own company. I thought the twist of having the Forresters as "the little company that could" while Nick's Forrester had all the assets the Forresters built over the years was the mirror of all those years where Forrester lorded it over Spectra, and of course the end game was always that the Forresters would be back on top in the end. And the way they ended that - Eric buying Forrester back, Nick then buying Spectra for Jackie - had potential, too, until TPTB decided to drop fashion stories for a year and a half.

I think it might have been good to remind viewers a bit about all of this.

That's B&B's weak point, even when it has stories with promise running. They just jump right in without build-up a lot, and expect after the fact exposition to take the place of seeing stories gradually come to life. The Phoebe death story was the same way. "Hi, I'm back - I'm pissed at Rick - I'm dead." So here we had the financial woes of Jackie M just dropped in out of the blue when some reminder of the history behind it might have helped soften that blow.

Jack Wagner must be miserable. His character is SO far from the 'strong sailor' he created, it is incredible.

And he certainly hasn't been helped by the way his relationship with Katie unfolded. The only saving grace I see in the Jackie M story is that it might remind Nick how far he strayed from that sailor who sailed in B&B's port 6 years ago. Sure, Massimo was a great businessman, but it sometimes seemed like Nick went from hard-nosed sailor to master CEO/financial wizard overnight. The financial woes of his mother's company and its ties to his own personal finances might be a harsh reminder that even Marone blood's not enough at times like this.

The only saving grace I see in the Jackie M story is that it might remind Nick how far he strayed from that sailor who sailed in B&B's port 6 years ago. Sure, Massimo was a great businessman, but it sometimes seemed like Nick went from hard-nosed sailor to master CEO/financial wizard overnight.

I feel like that had to with him finding out he was Massimo's son. Even though he was never a businessman, his real father was a successful one and so he needed to become one, which, IMO, makes no sense because had gone 35+ years without knowing Massimo at all.

That's B&B's weak point, even when it has stories with promise running. They just jump right in without build-up a lot, and expect after the fact exposition to take the place of seeing stories gradually come to life. The Phoebe death story was the same way. "Hi, I'm back - I'm pissed at Rick - I'm dead."

Reminds me of Beth. We didn't see her for a decade and then she comes back and has dementia within in two weeks. Is anybody supposed to really care about the character?

Edited January 24, 200916 yr by bandbfan

I brought up Aldrich and Seymour to make the point that Heinle is much more accepted by viewers. Bellcurve brought up Sursok to be provocative. That's the difference.

BTW, I didn't mean to offend anyone who liked Aldrich and/or Seymour.

(1) No she's not and (2) you were trying to start a fight (a Y&R fight in the B&B thread, no less!).

So can we PLEASE keep these conversations civil and on-topic?

Who brought up Y&R recasts in the first place? It certainly wasn't me and you were the one who continued talking about Y&R in a B&B thread. You have a habit of hijacking threads with your endless love of all things bad about Y&R.

So, maybe we should ALL stay on-topic and be civil?

Who brought up Y&R recasts in the first place? It certainly wasn't me and you were the one who continued talking about Y&R in a B&B thread.

We were discussing Heather Tom and the possibility of her leaving B&B for Y&R, which led to my mentioning Amelia Heinle and how she is a much more accepted recast than the others I mentioned. You brought up Tammin out of the blue for no apparent reason other than to inflame. You are in the wrong here.

You have a habit of hijacking threads with your endless love of all things bad about Y&R.

Well that's just plain insulting.

Are you done yet?

Good.

So, I just caught the week's worth of B&B and while I don't particularly care for the stories, I did enjoy the structure of the episodes and the dialogue. Even Tuesday's episode was pretty good, and Shannon Bradley hasn't churned a decent script since she started. But her Tuesday show was good.

And I enjoyed Lesley Anne-Down playing fierce and fab Jackie. It's nice to see her do something other than prop Nick and Brooke/Nick and Bridget or be the narrator of the show. I wish the success that Jackie M inherited could have come from Felicia or a new, hotshot designer. The "stolen designs" stuff is played out.

I also didn't like the historical references to Sally. It's like the show is working too hard to "make Jackie the new Sally." It was like, "Sally would have been SOOO proud," or "OMG, Sally did this years ago." I think one nod would have been enough. And I would much prefer Jackie to come into her own and have help from someone, in addition to Bucky. But, I haven't enjoyed Jackie in years. This is a welcomed change.

And I wish they would keep that outdoor set Il Guardino's. it looks better as a restaraunt and I think they get way more mileage out of it being used as a restaraunt instead of it being some sort of gym/workout/hangout facility for the Forrester Sky Lounge. Would be even better if, during the days they need the characters to meet and have a drink, they can simply add a small bar in the foreground. They could even say, "Well, Il Guardino's is next door. Let's go there."

I also wonder if the set for Owen's Forrester Office and the set for Jackie's Office(which we saw this week when the models were getting ready for the fashion show) are one in the same. They look very similar; white walls, the door is in the same place...

And Rick and Steffy are just WRONG on so many levels. I can't believe they've trashed Steffy's character to build the rivalry between Rick and Ridge. There were better ways to do that without making her a tramp.

And ANY week without crazy ass Pam in overdrive is heaven. I love Alley Mills and I think she's great, but I have no idea what any of her fans see in this crazy ass Pam stuff. I preferred Pam when she was this Conservative, never married, ice queen who baked goods and knitted all day. I thought we were heading towards a Pam/Eric thing, with Pam calmly resenting Stephanie for having the life she's always wanted. But instead, we get stuck with crazy Pam for shits, giggles and "The Soup" reels. For all that was worth, they could have dragged Kimberlin Brown out of retirement.

Oh, and Owen and Bridget? Zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz. When is Felicia gonna get some action on this show? Lesli Kay and Brandon Beemer were off the charts over the summer.

This was a better week than I expected, but I hope they keep these people at work instead of bedhopping every episode or crying about something.

Are you done yet?

Good.

Seriously, what's with the attitude? Is there any particular reason you chose to attack me specifically?

Seriously, what's with the attitude? Is there any particular reason you chose to attack me specifically?

How is that ironic?

I feel like that had to with him finding out he was Massimo's son. Even though he was never a businessman, his real father was a successful one and so he needed to become one, which, IMO, makes no sense because had gone 35+ years without knowing Massimo at all.

I liked the way Nick was when he first came into Marone, since it created a contrast with Ridge. Here you had two sons who never really knew their father at all. But in Ridge's case, Mass knew Ridge was his son before Ridge knew it, so he lavished all that attention on Ridge. He tried to make his newfound son fit into a job and a company befitting a Marone heir, but Ridge didn't really fit into that role because of his upbringing as Eric's heir apparent. Then along comes #2 son Nick, who was part of Massimo's world as a sailor and captain for his shipping fleet, so there was some foundation for him to catch on quickly once Mass brought him into the management end of the company. That all made sense, but they took it a step too far when they had Nick advance to his father's level in such a short time. It only became worse when Nick took that business acumen he built at Marone into the fashion world he showed such a disdain for and became an expert there even faster than he did at Marone.

Reminds me of Beth. We didn't see her for a decade and then she comes back and has dementia within in two weeks. Is anybody supposed to really care about the character?

Since they had name-dropped Beth a few times after Patrick Duffy started playing Stephen, bringing her back after the fallout from Storm's death/Katie's medical woes seemed appropriate. The problem with the dementia thing is that they popped it into the story so suddenly and then dropped it just as quickly, so why should anyone care in the long run?