Y&R: Significant Decline in Black Viewers?

[Y&RWorldTurner]

I'm sorry, but why should any character act like someone else? I have problems with the Lily character as well, but I sure as hell wouldn't like it if she was Dru 2.0, it would be as annoying as Lulu on GH being Carly 2.0 right now. That's partly what's wrong with soaps these days, they try to fashion these younger characters off of more popular vets, but the writing isn't there and the actors aren't any good.

Would I like some zest injected into spineless Lily? Yes. Do I want her to come off as a Dru copy-cat character? No.

Lily didn't have the childhood Dru and Olivia had, so I can't see why she has to be exactly like her mother.

[MoTheGreat]

CKLily is bland. she spent her time with Dru. She should have something that take after Dru. Her facial expression. CKLily come off more like Olivia with Neil help raise her.

[Chris B]

Lily was raised by her mother, not Neil. She wasn't raised in Genoa City or the Valley, she was raised in Paris. Dru brought her back to GC because she was such a hellraiser in Paris, hanging out with the wrong crowd. That sounds like a Mini Dru and the type of daughter Dru would raise. Christel Khalil has never been successful at pulling this off. Had Lily stayed with Neil and Victoria when Dru went off to model, I think people could accept Khalil as Lily better. Davetta fit the backstory that Y&R asked us to believe.

[Y&RWorldTurner]

There's no denying that Lily is a bland character. However, she didn't have the same childhood experiences as Dru. Should she have some Dru-like qualities? Yes. But she shouldn't be a carbon copy of Dru either.

There was some major conflict in Dru and Lily's relationship, mainly over the paternity issue, but those problems weren't anywhere as severe as the problems Dru and her mother had. Lily also had a better education and didn't run away from home when she was illiterate like Dru did. Lily didn't growing up with an overachieving sibling that her parents loved more than her like Dru did, etc. All of these environmental issues shape who people and fictional characters are.

[Y&RWorldTurner]

Lily was raised by her mother, not Neil. She wasn't raised in Genoa City or the Valley, she was raised in Paris. Dru brought her back to GC because she was such a hellraiser in Paris, hanging out with the wrong crowd. That sounds like a Mini Dru and the type of daughter Dru would raise. Christel Khalil has never been successful at pulling this off. Had Lily stayed with Neil and Victoria when Dru went off to model, I think people could accept Khalil as Lily better. Davetta fit the backstory that Y&R asked us to believe.

We know she was raised in Paris, but seeing as Dru probably had tons of high society friends in the modeling world there, Lily probably grew up around such people as well. She was raised by Dru, but she wasn't raised the same way Dru was raised.

It's typical for soaps and other types of television shows to create hellraising teenagers.

Christel Khalil is just a horrible actress who shouldn't have been cast in the first place.

Lily should have some Dru-like qualities, but she shouldn't be Dru.

Devetta does fit the backstory better. But Jack F. Smith originally was there for that backstory and he helped to cast Khalil originally. I think they intentionally wanted to downplay Lily's ethnicity from the get-go.

But even with Devetta in the role, I still didn't see her as mini-Dru. The writing for Lily has always been inconsistent.

[EttaKit]

Given the diversity within the black community Dru is hardly the blueprint for black women. We do come in different shades and we do have different personalities and styles, etc. Between the 2 there's no question that I identify myself with Lily rather than Dru. Dru's persona and experience were not representative of me but that didn't prevent me from appreciating the character.

Like any viewer I want good story first. As a black viewer what I want most is for black characters to have the same opportunities. I want Dru to be able to be b!tchy and outrageous just as easily as Phyllis. I want Lily to be able to be the young heroine who gets the handsome, rich guy just as easily as a Sharon or a Heather.

Obviously the show has a ways to go in many areas and it begins and ends with the writers. So I believe that writing more than anything else is responsible for the decline. On a tangent I do think the show is improving and hope Hogan will bring some soapiness without destroying characters.

[DeeeDee]

Bingo.

Not really.

The writing has stayed the same.

Davetta's success where Christel couldn't is proof enough of that.

[DeeeDee]

The main problem with POC on Y&R (and tv in general) is the minute they start to act culturally specific in any way viewers yell "stereotype" or "minstrel show".

[MTSRocks]

Word WorldTurner on your Lily/Dru comparison.

On another note, I've always realized the differences between how black people are portrayed on US shows and Canadian shows. It seems that American shows adapt the whole "You're American" mentality, while Canadian shows allow there characters to express more of there upbringing. This is just in general.

I don't get why writing for minority characters are so hard? It's like the writers are so afraid of having them fall prey to stereotypes. Here's a clue? Write for them like you would any other character. I'm so tired of the "he's not hard enough," or "she's note ghetto/street" enough, which only qualifies as a small segment of an entire population. Even in movies it bothers me the way writers portray black people, with all the wise-cracking, stupid remarks at times (Ie. end of Hancock).

[MoTheGreat]

See I won't say that she's a terrible actress. I just said that she shouldn't have been hired to play Victoria Rowell daughter. If she was Olivia child or Niel child by someone else then I understand it. Or even a bi racial part.

I can't name one thing that is Dru-like qualities when CK plays Lily.

[DeeeDee]

Because it's a balancing act.

One which can only be corrected by having more POC working behind the scenes as well as in front.

Eh.

The "colorblind"/"we are all the same" mindset is a straightjacket too.

Heaven forbid POC retain any vestige of humor. lol

[DeeeDee]

She doesn't work as Olivia or Neil's child either.

They weren't as hard edged as Nathan, Dru or Malcolm but they were very culturally oriented too.

That's the point.

TPTB don't want Lily to be "Dru-like" and/or "ethnic".

They want her to be representative of their notion of "diversity" via "colorblindness".

[Y&RWorldTurner]

It's amazing how TIIC recycle the same writers and producers from show to show. You'd think that if you were fired multiple times for doing a bad job, you wouldn't be allowed into the industry again, but it happens.

I feel so bad for Michele Val Jean at GH, she's probably the most notable African American writer in the soap industry, yet she's stuck on a show that doesn't even embrace diversity amougst it's white characters, yet alone characters of other ethnicities that aren't tied to the mob. It's a shame because she's so talented and I'm sure she wants to write for characters of her race.

Even as someone who is not of colour, I just see an industry that is too set in its ways and doesn't embrace any sort of change. I watch British soaps too, and they're so over the interracial relationship taboos, yet American soaps aren't. I think it's just sad. They also portray characters of colour in great respect to their culture, whereas American entertainment is so watered down in that respect.

[DeeeDee]

That's what's most irritating.

The only way real change can happen is if more POC are able to write their own experiences.

It's only through them giving voice to their experiences & POV's that the stories that should be told, will be.

It really is.

For instance any time the Dead Quartermaine's are listed, Justus is rarely included.

Amen.

It wants to do everything shorthand.

Take Nuke for example.

ATWT have attempted to make Luke & Noah representative of Teh Gay Experienz to the point where they've eaten the entire canvas so as to cater to an agenda driven fanbase that expects them to be The Second Coming.

Yet whenever an attempt at diversity fails through overkill or any other dozen factors the industry uses that as a convenient excuse to continue it's self destructive spiral into oblivion.

[Y&RWorldTurner]

Here's an article about diversity on daytime television that quotes both Michele Val Jean and Victoria Rowell:

http://goliath.ecnext.com/coms2/gi_0199-36...ma-despite.html