3 hours ago, P.J. said:

What's odd---just from a continuity point of view---is that they've completely written out Vanessa's engagement to Alan. If you didn't know the history, Ross makes it sound like Vanessa just walked out on him to go take care of Billy. They had broken up. He had either slept with Meredith or come damn close to it. She was engaged to Alan, and ditched him to go help Billy (not only because it was Billy but essentially because she admitted to herself that she didn't love Alan and knew he was using her as an emotional buffer to Reva) It was less than two years before, and written by Long, so why the situation was oversimplified, I don't understand.

I'm going to guess the reason for that at this point is they were moving away from Alan--I think Pilon appears only a few more times late 1989, then Alan is gone for the next five years. So maybe they decided, why dredge up any history to do with him?

I find it almost hilarious that Ross was acting hurt over something that didn't even happen over 2 years previously!

Were they toying with a Holly/Johnny pairing? 🤢

Honestly, watching teen-aged boys obsessing over babies is kind of bizarre. And how ironic that AM ended up never having children.

(Ross almost slept with Meredith? I do not remember this!)

40 minutes ago, DeeVee said:

I'm going to guess the reason for that at this point is they were moving away from Alan--I think Pilon appears only a few more times late 1989, then Alan is gone for the next five years. So maybe they decided, why dredge up any history to do with him?

I find it almost hilarious that Ross was acting hurt over something that didn't even happen over 2 years previously!

Were they toying with a Holly/Johnny pairing? 🤢

Honestly, watching teen-aged boys obsessing over babies is kind of bizarre. And how ironic that AM ended up never having children.

(Ross almost slept with Meredith? I do not remember this!)

re: Alan, there's also the fact that Alan/Vanessa were never that serious a couple. I wouldn't think they'd need to remind the audience about Van/Billy's connection, but maybe that was part of it too?

There was a period where it looked like Holly/Johnny were vibing. She was trying to build him into a media host, Chelsea was jealous, etc. Frank is even trying to flirt with her and Johnny heads him off.

Van and Ross were on the outs, but still kind of circling each other. Then during the AM/Dinah/stolen motorcycle drama (where they'd crashed into Harley) Alan proposes to Van. Van doesn't give him an answer, but Alan lets it "slip" to Ross. Ross storms off. I'm not exactly sure how Meredith got pulled in, but in one episode, they're naked in bed. There's some joke about limp pizza, which can be interpreted as meaning nothing happened. For whatever reason, Vanessa shows up at Ross', and I think Meredith walks out in his robe. Van runs out, and accepts Alan's proposal via telegram. Alan and Reva are in Hawaii on a "business" trip. Alan then goes out to buy Van a ring, which Reva appropriates to teach Alan some kind of lesson. Alan then lets her keep it, and buys a second ring for Van.

It should be Nov/Dec '87. Josh and Sonni then show up in Hawaii on their honeymoon, and Van shows up and there's tension there between Reva/Alan/Van about the ring. There's some kind of realization on Reva and Alan's part that their games have hurt Vanessa. I'm not sure a lot of that's up in English, though.

On 3/8/2026 at 1:35 PM, alwaysAMC said:

I can't remember if this was already discussed, but I ran across a new YT channel called BauerBBQ and this person is uploading tons of full episodes, as of 3 weeks ago. It looks like they have more to add, but for now they have all of 1999, 2000, 2003, 2005, 2008, 2009... but more importantly, a TON of 1989 episodes. Unfortunately it doesn't have every single episode, and I'm not sure how it compares to what's in the Vault for that year, but definitely is interesting. It's becoming like the old Blake Marler channel, but hopefully this one doesn't get taken down any time soon.

https://www.youtube.com/@Bauer_BBQ

@alwaysAMC Thank you very much for this information.

Annette

19 hours ago, Speed Racer said:

Van/Holly anything would have been interesting. There's an undefined obliqueness (for lack of a better descriptor) between those two that I find fascinating. Story? If not a Ross/Holly/Van triangle, then have Roger blackmail Holly of all people, with her ticket out of the mess being the destruction of Vanessa's career. Via WSPR, naturally.

I wished the writers had given Vanessa and Holly more scenes together. I think having these two actresses share the screen together more would have been a smart move.

This is a great scene between the two.

Annette