Should soaps have more primetime episodes?

[DRW50]

In the 90s, ABC, NBC, and CBS experimented with letting some soap episodes air in primetime. OLTL had the episode where Todd held half the town hostage until he found out the identity of Georgie's killer. GH had the episode where Stefan shot Katherine. DAYS and AW had summer heat, or winter heat, or something I can't remember. Y&R had several episodes with big parties; I remember one very entertaining episode where Nikki ruined a party for Diane and Victor by announcing that she and her gyno husband were going to try for a baby.

I know the Daytime Emmys aren't going to bring the ratings in now, but they haven't been entertaining in years and a lot of people already have to sit through enough awards shows.

With primetime showing more reruns than ever, dealing with lower and lower ratings, fewer and fewer hits, do you think they should try to show a few soap episodes in primetime and see the results?

[Phoenix11]

I could go for some primetime Otalia!

[Y&RWorldTurner]

The thought of GL's production values on primetime. ::shutters::

I recall an article Paul Raven posted a few weeks ago regarding the primetime episode Y&R aired in 1994. According to what Ed Scott said, it was very expensive and it came directly out of the show's budget. Given that soap budgets are shrinking, I don't think we'll be seeing a daytime soap episode specifically for primetime anytime soon.

[MarkH]

I saw GL today. It is REALLY not so bad! It is different from other shows, but it looks and sounds quite good to me.

[DRW50]

When ABC Daytime dipped the OLTL primetime episode in what some soap critic (Marlena?) referred to as dirty bathwater, the result wasn't that much different than a GL episode. GL's production values have improved a great deal over the past year.

I was thinking more of Y&R or OLTL or GH being put in primetime, since they did in the past, but GL would also be a kick. An episode like the reunion + Grady going over a cliff, with better production values, could have been better than a lot of stuff in primetime now.

[Y&RWorldTurner]

Sorry, they've yet to perfect that production model, and airing something that looks like GL on primetime would look horrible. GL's filming style is a lot closer to that of many primetime dramas, there's just no comparison.

The sound is still grotesque on this show to me, especially outdoor scenes. I've seen student films with better sound and camera work. Don't even get me started on their indoor scenes.

Not that the old studio style of the other soaps are anything groundbreaking, but at least the remaining soaps have better lighting, music, sound, overall audio, and camera work. If you want to be on primetime, you have to present a package that is aesthetically good. Not that most soaps fall into that category anymore anyway.

[Phoenix11]

I love GL's production values. It did take some getting used to when they first debuted last year, but I absolutely love them now. And don't even get me started on the night scenes from the last few days! The outdoor scenes from GL make all the others look incredibly fake - 100 times more noticeable than in years past when GL used fake outdoor sets too. I'll take GL's real winter scenes over Y&R's from Brad's death any day.

[Y&RWorldTurner]

I remember hearing that episode was originally supposed to air during the day, but due to some newsbreak, ABC decided to air it in primetime in the summer, when things are slow for television regardless. It wasn't like those episodes Y&R, DAYS, and GH specifically created for primetime.

[DRW50]

I think they also did that with a GH episode around the same time. And a few DAYS episodes were run in primetime during the OJ hell of summer 1994.

[Y&RWorldTurner]

I'll take GL's production values circa 1992 over what's on today easily. Not to mention, when GL sometimes flubs their outdoor scenes, like one instance where there's snow on the ground, and when they go back to that scene, the snow's not there (obviously scenes for this episode were shot on different days). I recall a show like that just a few months back. I have to find the clip on YouTube, it's hysterical for all the wrong reasons. Just overall weak production coordination on that show.

Their camera work is horrid IMO, no matter if it's improved over when the production model first started. There's no reason for anything on television to look like a home video.

Don't get me started on the background music GL uses...

[DaytimeFan]

I think Y&R, B&B, GH and DAYS would all benefit from prime time episodes. Not necessarily in that they'd see a ratings boost, but more in the fact that it would show some network faith behind them and give them some sense of legitimacy in terms of the network at large.

I really liked last season's ABC campaigns that featured some of the network's soap stars (including La Lucci) because it made daytime seem more inclusive within the network.

That's really the benefit I see from prime time episodes of soaps, it just provides a small sense of inclusiveness.

[DRW50]

I think we'd all take anything soap 1992 on what we get today. Compared to the cheapness and constant indoor focus which pervades most soaps now, I do tend to prefer GL's model. I'd rather see semi-amateurish outdoor scenes like that dumb Grody dummy going off the cliff than Greenlee going off a cliff in a studio set.

Since DAYS is the only NBC soap, they probably could use the sign of faith.

Y&R was a crown jewel for CBS in the 90s, they did seem to be more interested in showing their support at the time. Like having the primetime crossovers with The Nanny, and Diagnosis Murder (made easier because of VR's involvement, but still a nice touch).

[EastMA2]

GL and ATWT got renewed. We're going to see alot more outdoor scenes. More shows are going to adopt GL's production model. I HATE to say it, but Ellen Wheeler and the way they shoot the show has saved it.

[Y&RWorldTurner]

Outdoor scenes can be done and done nicely on soaps. See B&B's recent location shooting, though nothing big, it's better filtered, shot, and more natural looking than anything on GL.

ATWT's location stuff is also better shot and filtered than anything I've seen on GL too. But I realize it's different doing occasional location shooting and doing almost all location shooting like GL.

That's a very scary thought. GL goes out of its way to make its actors look ugly, IMO. They way they light their actors and shoot them violates just about any rule you'd learn in any professional directing program. The way the makeup jobs on the GL actors come across on screen is just atrocious. I don't expect soap lighting and makeup to be on par with that of motion pictures or primetime, but geesh, I have no words for the way this production model GL uses makes its actors come across on screen.

I should also add, there's just no comparison between the way GL looks and the way a British soap looks. UK soaps use a similar production model, yet the camera work is miles better, the actors are better lit, the makeup is generally better, the scenes are filtered nicely, and the sound is great.

If the future of soaps on daytime looks anything like GL, then they need to go out with some dignity and better produced aesthetics. No show deserves to have to sink that low. Again, I don't expect soaps to look like films or primetime shows, but they shouldn't look like home movies or second rate student films either. To be on network television, I expect production values to be above adequate. Television IS a visual medium after all.

[DRW50]

They have areas which were custom-built for them many years ago, villages or neighborhoods, when they had more money to throw around. All they have to do is maintain those areas and then the rest of the money can go for sets, and most of those sets have also been around a long time. They also have quite a few actors who look very haggard. There are different standards for looks on American soaps and UK soaps; they don't have to worry about lighting or soft filtering away the age.

I don't think the actors looks that bad compared to most other soaps with the old production model, but I haven't taken enough time to study the difference. Gina Tognoni looks about the same to me now as she did in her last few years at OLTL. CC, Beth Chamberlin, Grant Aleksander, Robert Newman, Bradley Cole, etc. all look the same to me as they did with the old production model.

I think they are a big work in progress on location footage, but even with the kinks I still think the inclusion of location footage has helped GL and when the writing and acting is good enough, the indoor sets I don't even notice. B&B may have better location work, I don't know. The writing is so completely terrible now that when I do watch I can't pay attention to the production methods. ATWT has a better production model but they've lost nearly a million viewers in only a year.