This is the Presidential Campaign Thread.

Barack Obama Vs. John McCain.

Edited November 6, 200817 yr by Toups

I don't need to understand at all. My opinion is that it's irrelevant since Ifill is not running for office so you can say it as many ways as you want....it's a moot point as far as I'm concerned.

I find it extremely offensive that you were so willing to go after Gwen Ifill's professionalism without being familiar with her at all. Then when people offered up their opinions you disregarded them. Now I understand that yours is the only opinion that matters to you but by the same token you might consider that other people's opinions matter to them.

I have no idea what Oprah's mother has said or has not said about her. It's besides the point. No one should be held responsible for what their relatives say or may say.

You brought up Oprah...you compared her to "being just like a relative"...My point was that Oprah had not praised her mother as being "brilliant"..Ifill had praised her relative. IA with you that Oprah is beside the point, but you brought her up.....The key issue with Ifill's cousin is if Ifill feels that she is brilliant, then it would not be a huge leap to believe that she agrees with the ideals of her cousin. Usually one would not call someone brilliant unless they agree on subjects..

What is offensive in raising questions about her possible biases? Your use of the term "extremely offensive" is raising my eyebrows...Could you explain that a little further?...You would think that you are related to Gwen Ifill, with the passion in your defense of her "professionalism". This woman has penned a novel covering only one of the candidates participating in this election, and even went as far as naming a political age after him!

It's not like I am questioning her as being unethical out of the blue...!

Mark my words...you will see a shift in the polls...in the direction of McCain..

Great job Sarah!

Sure......

If you flip the chart upside down.

Sure......

If you flip the chart upside down.

Care to make a wager?

Biden did a great job, she was mediocre. I found her stiff, rehearsed and when she had to answer to a question, she avoided it and went back to talking about energy. I wanted to hear where she stood on the issues. I didnot want to hear her shout out to some grade school or how she was in the soccer field. I did not think that she sounded confident at all in her answers and at one point I thought she might lose it. Biden was good in the fact that he didn't ramble on nor did he jump all over her. I thought at times he was visibly trying to keep his mouth shut when she refused to answer a question.

Line of the night goes to Biden with the Bridge to Nowhere crack.

Am I the only one that thinks Biden has great caps on his teeth? He has a great smile for an older gentleman. And Palin's youngest, the five month old, My God, has she ever cried? Every time I have seen that baby the baby is asleep. Are they giving the baby tranqualizers?

Is it true she didn't answer many of the questions, and just went into some sort of stump speech or slogan she had learned?

Question.

How is that "holding her own"?

I don't need to understand at all. My opinion is that it's irrelevant since Ifill is not running for office so you can say it as many ways as you want....it's a moot point as far as I'm concerned.

I find it extremely offensive that you were so willing to go after Gwen Ifill's professionalism without being familiar with her at all. Then when people offered up their opinions you disregarded them. Now I understand that yours is the only opinion that matters to you but by the same token you might consider that other people's opinions matter to them.

I wonder why Gwen is being gone after so tough.

Hmmm.........

Line of the night goes to Biden with the Bridge to Nowhere crack.

The line of the night IMO, was Palin calling Biden on "looking to the past".."instead of the future"..

This was a point that Obama brought up in the first Pres. debate...he said the McCain Camp. is stuck in the past...Great comeback by Palin..pointing out Obama/Biden are just as guilty if not more, of "looking backwards".

I wonder why Gwen is being gone after so tough.

Hmmm.........

Maybe because she has a financial stake in an Obama victory...not actually too hard to understand...

Poll: Biden wins debate, Palin exceeds expectations

Posted: 11:06 PM ET

A post debate poll suggest Sen. Biden won the debate, but Palin exceeded expectations.

A post debate poll suggest Sen. Biden won the debate, but Palin exceeded expectations.

(CNN) – A national poll of people who watched the vice presidential debate suggests that Democratic Sen. Joe Biden won but also hints that Republican Gov. Sarah Palin exceeded expectations.

The CNN/Opinion Research Corporation survey is not a measurement of the views of all Americans, since only people who watched the debate were questioned.

Watch: 'The most important election,' Biden says

Fifty-one percent of those polled thought Biden did the best job in Thursday night's debate, while 36 percent thought Palin did the best job.

But respondents said the folksy Palin was more likable, scoring 54 percent to Biden's 36 percent.

Watch: 'We will fight for America,' Palin says

Both candidates exceeded expectations — 84 percent of the people polled said Palin did a better job than they expected, while 64 percent said Biden also exceeded expectations.

But on the question of the candidates' qualifications to assume the presidency, 87 percent of the people polled said Biden is qualified while only 42 percent said Palin is qualified.

Biden's running mate, Sen. Barack Obama, was also selected as a winner in a CNN/Opinion Research Corporation about the presidential debate last week.

Poll: Biden wins debate, Palin exceeds expectations

Posted: 11:06 PM ET

A post debate poll suggest Sen. Biden won the debate, but Palin exceeded expectations.

A post debate poll suggest Sen. Biden won the debate, but Palin exceeded expectations.

(CNN) – A national poll of people who watched the vice presidential debate suggests that Democratic Sen. Joe Biden won but also hints that Republican Gov. Sarah Palin exceeded expectations.

The CNN/Opinion Research Corporation survey is not a measurement of the views of all Americans, since only people who watched the debate were questioned.

Watch: 'The most important election,' Biden says

Fifty-one percent of those polled thought Biden did the best job in Thursday night's debate, while 36 percent thought Palin did the best job.

But respondents said the folksy Palin was more likable, scoring 54 percent to Biden's 36 percent.

Watch: 'We will fight for America,' Palin says

Both candidates exceeded expectations — 84 percent of the people polled said Palin did a better job than they expected, while 64 percent said Biden also exceeded expectations.

But on the question of the candidates' qualifications to assume the presidency, 87 percent of the people polled said Biden is qualified while only 42 percent said Palin is qualified.

Biden's running mate, Sen. Barack Obama, was also selected as a winner in a CNN/Opinion Research Corporation about the presidential debate last week.

Oh Lord..it's the CNN poll again...I guess, I should post the Drudge Poll...

Well Palin did not fall off the stage or wet her pants so she exceeded expectations. :lol:

I thought both of them held there own. I do think that Biden was much better informed and appeared much more knowledgeable. I give both of them credit for outlining their parties' positions. I also appreciate the fact that they were respectful of each other.

The ONE thing that surprised me, and really showed a little bit of unawareness on minor detail, you know like the Constitution, was Palin's comments about the responsibilities of the VP. The VP is not in the legislative branch and really has very little role in presiding over the Senate.

In my opinion, Palin did not lose any ground for the Republicans. The race is still between Obama and McCain.

Edited October 3, 200817 yr by Jess

Oh Lord..it's the CNN poll again...I guess, I should post the Drudge Poll...

Now Casey, the CNN poll is a random survey of people who watched the debate. The Drudge report is not.

The truth is, people don't vote on who won the debate. There really is nothing to get upset about. Palin did not cost McCain any votes tonight. It is also unlikely she changed the direction of the campaign. Nor should either of the candidates change the direction. It really is about Obama and McCain.

Both of the VP nominees said they would do nothing different than the heads' of their tickets.

Edited October 3, 200817 yr by Jess

Oh Lord..it's the CNN poll again...I guess, I should post the Drudge Poll...

I now see exactly what Wales was talking about.

I now see exactly what Wales was talking about.

Who cares?

Maybe if you guys gave a little respect..you would get some in return..

My Drudge poll was blasted for being from a "neo-con" site...Is that respectful??

WOAH! Bill O'Reilly absolutely goes off on Barney Frank...I've never seen anything like this!! Crazy...

Now Casey, the CNN poll is a random survey of people who watched the debate. The Drudge report is not.

The truth is, people don't vote on who won the debate. There really is nothing to get upset about. Palin did not cost McCain any votes tonight. It is also unlikely she changed the direction of the campaign. Nor should either of the candidates change the direction. It really is about Obama and McCain.

Both of the VP nominees said they would do nothing different than the heads' of their tickets.

Random? Yeah right!

CNN admitted to surveying an audience with a Democrat majority in the last debate. How can their Poll, on the debate winner, be any more credible than Drudge?..It's the exact argument that you use against Drudge...So you think people voting on Drudge..didn't watch the debate?? LOL!

Well Palin did not fall off the stage or wet her pants so she exceeded expectations. :lol:

I thought both of them held there own. I do think that Biden was much better informed and appeared much more knowledgeable. I give both of them credit for outlining their parties' positions. I also appreciate the fact that they were respectful of each other.

The ONE thing that surprised me, and really showed a little bit of unawareness on minor detail, you know like the Constitution, was Palin's comments about the responsibilities of the VP. The VP is not in the legislative branch and really has very little role in presiding over the Senate.

In my opinion, Palin did not lose any ground for the Republicans. The race is still between Obama and McCain.

The Vice-President is the President of the Senate ex officio, and thus is the highest-ranking official of the Senate..limited or not..it serves a role in the legislature..Biden misquoted the constitution..

Edited October 3, 200817 yr by Casey008

arah Palin and Joe Biden face off tonight at Washington University in St. Louis. Her limited official media appearances so far haven’t done a good job convincing voters she’s ready for primetime, to say the least. We all know she can give a fiery teleprompter speech, but how will she fare in a tense, high-profile showdown with one of the most knowledgeable and longest-serving members of the US Senate? Which Palin will we see tonight? The aggressive firebrand we saw in Minneapolis? Or the clueless, moose-in-the-headlights neophyte we saw with Couric and Gibson? We’re about to find out…

You can watch live online here.

***

9:00 pm: Here we go, my friends.

9:00 pm: Palin asks, “Can I call you Joe?”

9:04 pm: First question on the economy. Biden is crystal clear and CNN’s insta-meter seems to like him. Palin goes right for the soccer moms.

9:08 pm: Biden: John McCain’s poor judgment “doesn’t make him a bad guy. But it does mean he’s out of touch.”

9:09 pm: Palin repeats the “by ‘fundamentals’ McCain meant the American workers” BS. Team Obama is all over it.

9:13 pm: Palin repeats the lie that Obama wants to raise taxes on those making less than $42,000.

9:15 pm: Biden corrects the record and notes that by his own standards, McCain voted to raise taxes on middle-/low-income people over 400 times. Wish Obama said that during his debate.

9:18 pm: I must admit, Palin is coming off as very empathetic. CNN’s uncommitted Ohio voters seem to agree somewhat. She’s distorting Obama’s record, of course, but still more solid than most probably expected, myself included.

9:21 pm: Biden on McCain’s health care “plan”: “The ultimate bridge to nowhere.”

9:25 pm: Biden hits back on the distortion of Obama’s vote for the Cheney energy bill. Yes it included tax breaks for oil companies, but it also called for the biggest alternative energy investment in history. That’s the perfect rebuttal. Again, something Obama should have noted last debate.

9:27 pm: See here for Team Obama’s real-time rebuttal.

9:29 pm: Can Sarah Palin actually start answering the questions that are asked?

9:34 pm: Biden: How can we solve the climate crisis if we refuse/fail to acknowledge the cause?

9:35 pm: Palin: “Nucular” Truly George Bush in lipstick. NOTE: Her convention teleprompter speech actually spelled out nuclear as “new-clear.”

9:38 pm: Palin truly is a GOP talking point robot. Affording our gay brothers and sisters equal rights under the law does not threaten the “traditional defintion of marriage.”

9:43 pm: Did Palin really just say that Obama’s plan (endorsed by Maliki and the finally the Bush administration) is tantamount to “waving the white flag.”

9:44 pm: Thank God Biden is hitting back at the “Obama hates the troops” BS. Biden hits back hard: “John McCain voted against funding the troops. Let me repeat: John McCain voted against funding the troops.” Boom!

9:45 pm: John Biden is the Democratic answer to John McCain re: foreign policy experience/credibility. Only Joe Biden actually gets it.

9:48: NEW RULE: Anyone who can’t pronounce the world “nuclear” is immediately disqualified for high office.

9:51 pm: Biden: John McCain won’t even meet with SPAIN!

9:52 pm: I don’t know if it’s delivery or what, but Palin is just not credible on foreign policy. She’s reciting McCain’s line verbatim, but it just doesn’t come across as believable. I guess that’s a tough feat when your standing next to Joe Biden.

9:56 pm: Money quote: “How is John McCain’s policy going to different from George Bush’s.” Substitute any policy in that sentence and you have the question that should be asked incessantly for the next 33 days.

10:00 pm: Reuters wants Palin’s ears checked for covert feeds? I’m no conspiracy theorist, but Bush’s mysterious “hump” from the 2004 debate still bothers me.

10:06: Palin reading from a script, Biden is speaking from experience. That about sums it up. She’s holding up fine, but it’s coming across as too canned. The meter is reflecting that. I can’t think of a better choice for Obama than Biden. He is brilliant and uber-knowledgeable on foreign affairs. Any concern voters had on that front are dissolving as we speak, in real time.

10:12 pm: Palin: “There you go again, Joe. Doggone it.” Ronald Reagan called. He wants his 30 year old line back.

10:13 pm: Props to Gwen Ifill. I dare right-wingers to complain about her performance.

10:17 pm: Nicole:Killer question by Ifill on VP extra-constitutional duties. Palin gives boilerplate. Biden goes for the jugular. CNN meter shooting up shows just how loathed Cheney is.

10:20 pm Biden: “I passed the Violence Against Women Act. John McCain voted against it. Both times.”

10:22 pm: Biden chokes up talking about his late wife. Powerful stuff. Again, tales of steady experience from Biden. Boilerplate from Palin.

10:23 pm: Biden on McCain’s maverickness: “Maverick he is not on the issues that affect people at their kitchen tables.”

10:28 pm: 538’s Nate Silver (8/29): “Her authenticity factor is off-the-charts good; her biography sings. But do Americans really want their next-door-neighbor running for Vice President, or rather someone who seems like one?”

10:29: Laughable line of the night: Palin: “I love to answer these questions without the filter of the mainstream media.” Gimme a freaking break. Try talking to them first before you make such a claim.

10:30pm: Closing statements: Palin is solid; well-received Reagan reference. Biden hits his populist stride. Meters shoot up.

MY VERDICT: No huge gaffes, only the expected distortions. McCain needed a game-changer. He didn’t get it. Palin may have successfully distanced herself from the Tina Fey caricature (her primary goal), but Biden was simply too strong. Palin came off as folksy (another goal) but I just don’t see how this changes the underlying fundamentals. Biden spoke from his decades of experience. Palin delivered the lines, but they came off as rather unauthentic and boilerplate. CNN Meter gives a slight edge to Biden, who probably delivered his best debate perfomance to date. Palin held her own and defintiely pleased the GOP base, but I don’t see independents seeing it the same way.

Random? Yeah right!

CNN admitted to surveying an audience with a Democrat majority in the last debate. How can their Poll, on the debate winner, be any more credible than Drudge?..It's the exact argument that you use against Drudge...So you think people voting on Drudge..didn't watch the debate?? LOL!

So, if the CNN poll had stated that Palin won, would you then think it was fair?

Interesting.

So, if the CNN poll had stated that Palin won, would you then think it was fair?

Interesting.

If Palin had won with a majority Republican audience..then, no..it would not be fair..

I've never said Drudge was "fair" just a representation on a number of people's belief on the winner..

The Drudge does not try to mask it's Poll in a shroud of "fairness" like CNN..

Would you think the Drudge Report was fair if Biden was the winner??