GLATWT88

I personally didn't mind Presley in the role. I actually thought she did a good job - season 9 and 10 were rough tho. 

1 hour ago, Soapsuds said:

Agreed. The beginning of the season wasn't that bad. The ratings were still ok. The ratings really started falling when the show became about Angelica and the jungle emerald mine story. When Pam disappeared in the jungle the ratings did go back up. That was the last big number for Dallas until the cliffhanger.

Season 10 ended all of those three stories and put the awful pairing of Jenna and Ray together. Jenna became what Donna feared the last two seasons before. A housewife obeying her husband and dressed like sh!t.

I also noticed when the Knots writers took over as producers too that we had female friendships in Sue Ellen and Jamie plus Jenna and Donna.

Honestly, Jenna and Ray just gives me the ick. I would have preferred Bobby awakens from a coma and learns that Jenna and Jack have gotten closer. 

4 minutes ago, Soapsuds said:

The reunion..

 

Amazing! Will give it a watch.  

27 minutes ago, Soapsuds said:

Steve Kanaly said Dallas lost 10% of it's audience because of season 9 being a dream season.

He also said that the writers were still very nervous till the end about the decision to make the season a dream.

He also said there were pissed cast mates over the decision to wipe out the entire progress of their stories. He wouldn't say who the actors were though.

Personally, I felt like season 9 was a good direction for most of the characters' stories. 

Season 10 was a hard reset for a lot of great stuff that was going on, such as the adoption storyline for Ray and Donna, the progress of JR and Sue Ellen's relationship, Jamie and Jack integrating into the canvas, Jenna and Jack. 

There were a few misses as well, but overall it was a solid season and I think the stories helped keep Dallas in the top 10 considering all the other soaps were out.

Also, the real audience erosion came during season 9, not in season 10. If I remember correctly from the ratings thread, the premiere for season 9 did quite well. I am assuming most people were interested in the aftermath of Bobby's death, but with his departure, they didn't care to continue watching. Season 10 was a bit of a bandaid, but it wouldn't help when a bunch of familiar faces exited at the end of the season. Then with season 11 onward you have a very steady and significant decline. 

14 hours ago, Chris 2 said:

I was watching the remastered episodes on FreeVee and I agree she was stunning during that first year. Her look was very simple and that worked because she was a natural beauty. Then in the middle of the first year she got the shag and started wearing heavier makeup. There’s speculation that she got some work done during the dream season because she missed an episode (during the Colombian emeralds storyline) and after she came back, she never looked the same.

Omg, yes!!!! I was wondering why she wasn't in an episode in Colombia, and my initial thought when she next appeared was that her face looked different, but I couldn't quite pinpoint what was different.

7 hours ago, SoapDope said:

She definitely had something done. She almost looks like a totally different person. She claims that she has never had plastic surgery (even though she was married to a plastic surgeon) and that her skin care line is all she uses.

There is a 1973 episode of Love American Style on youtube featuring her. She was good at comedy and has a Marlo Thomas That Girl thing going on. I almost kept waiting for her to say " Oh Donald".....LOL Lenore Kasdorf (Rita GL) is also featured. 

 

Thank you for sharing. Wow, Victoria looks completely different here. 

3 minutes ago, JAS0N47 said:

 

FROM THE VAULT: WEEKLY DAYTIME NIELSEN RATINGS: WEEKS OF 2/11/80-2/15/80 & 2/18/80-2/22/80:

 

Wow, Guiding Light really wasn't messing around, considering the popularity of GH. 

46 minutes ago, SoapDope said:

I also thought it was a mistake to kill off Kristin so fast. She could have driven story for years. Since they did kill her off, they should have had baby Christopher to really be J.R.'s and have Bobby and Pam keep the secret for years. Maybe have little Christopher start to exhibit devious tendencies as he started to grow up. 

I also thought at the time that it would have been more compelling had Christopher actually been JR's but somehow he was still being raised by Pam and Bobby. 

I'm home today and have Three's Company on in the background and there's a few Dallas "crossovers." George Petrie (Harv Smithfield) just appeared on an episode and now John Reilly who was on Dallas (1982-83) a few months prior is on an episode of Three's Company (1983-84) playing a Dr. Kenderson, a character with the same name appears on Dallas (1984-85) the following season. 

1 hour ago, Chris 2 said:

These days, Victoria says that she told Lorimar when she signed her two-year contract extension in 1985 that she wouldn’t sign another. But her colleagues say (and some trades reported at the time) that she was negotiating for another extension in 1987.

Patrick Duffy got a huge salary increase to return in 1986. Victoria, by some accounts, wanted salary parity with Duffy to sign another contract (she deserved it by the way). She also wanted to sign just a one-year deal. Lorimar didn’t want to pay her the same salary as Duffy and wanted a two year commitment. TV Guide at the time reported that when negotiations broke down with Principal, they had to quickly rewrite scripts to take out the Pam character. So they were expecting her to sign, and that’s why Pam’s exit is so clumsy.

Lorimar also initially announced that they had dropped Principal. She was furious about that and got her lawyers involved and forced the studio to retract this. She also said they took her parking space away during her final weeks there as retaliation. Later on, she refused to allow the studio to use her image on the show or in clips (during Sue Ellen’s movie storyline, for example).

Larry Hagman had dinner with her a year after she left to convince her to return but she declined. She wouldn’t even come back for a handful of episodes to resolve Pam’s storyline. That’s why Pam was recast for one episode.

She as willing to return for the series finale if it wrapped up the story of Pam, but wasn’t interested in the fantasy storyline. She turned down the JR Returns movie. I’m not sure if she was asked to do War of the Ewings. Accounts differ whether she was even asked to do the TNT revival, but when the show started teasing Pam’s return, she released a statement saying that she was not going to do a “desperate reappearance” and that as far as she was concerned, Pam died in her car crash. 

The studio produced a in-studio mini reunion with Duffy, Gray, Charlene Tilton and Steve Kanaly for the 40th anniversary DVDs. Principal didn’t appear on camera but did call in. She seemed to enjoy reminiscing and had some laughs with Duffy. She also posts reminiscences on instagram. She says she’s proud of the show. I just don’t think she wanted to be part of its long decline.

I guess it's just my silly hope that somehow these cast members got along, but I'm sure it's like working any other job and some personalities mesh and others don't. 

4 hours ago, Soapsuds said:

Dallas problem and lower ratings towards the end of the season was the result of Jenna trial. I kind of liked Mitch returning. It's too bad it was rushed.

What do you think about the trial wasn't resonating with the viewers? 

14 minutes ago, kalbir said:

I refer to the week of April 21, 1985 as pivotal in CBS primetime history because it was the first time that Murder, She Wrote finished ahead of Dallas. 

Here's what happened on the soaps and the two rookie hits that week.

The Cosby Show was a repeat on April 18.

Murder, She Wrote - Funeral at Fifty-Mile (season 1 finale): At a Wyoming rancher's grave, a man shocks mourners -- including the deceased's daughter -- by claiming to be the true heir. This episode was also the season high.

Dallas - The Ewing Connection: J.R. presents Jack's deal to Bobby and Ray. Lucy and her ex-husband Mitch meet. John Ross is rushed to the hospital for appendicitis.

Falcon Crest - The Decline...: Angela alienates the Giobertis by offering Maggie the post of acting publisher of The New Globe. Lorraine and Emma search for Lance.

A repeat of The Cosby Show scored a number 1 finish? 

There were many great parts to this season of Dallas, but the Lucy stuff just seemed unnecessary. There were other ways to send her off.

Hi @Soapsuds would you be able to post the ratings for the week including September 27, 1983? Thank you! 

4 hours ago, SoapDope said:

Not only did Dallas screw it up, we got Patrick Duffy and Larry Hagman to thank. Patrick insisted Bobby be killed off on camera. They asked him are you sure " Yes, I have no intention of ever coming back".....then Larry pissed and moaned that he didn't have his playmate he could cut up with and wanted things back to the boys club behind the scenes that he was accustomed to. 

I wish they had told Patrick " Sorry, we have moved on and you should to. Good luck finding work".....I think Larry threatened to quit the show and that's why they catered to his demands. Victoria/Pam/the show became a laughing stock after that and she eventually walked away because of the decline of the writing and the show. 

 

Can you elaborate on the Victoria becoming a laughing stock.

Also, it seems like Victoria wanted nothing to do with the show post her departure. Did something else happen behind the scenes? What's her relationship like with the cast? 

P&G seem to have its soaps on opposite ends...AW, ATWT, GL, SFT at the top and EON and FR,FP sunk at the bottom. 

16 hours ago, te. said:

I've always said that there's two ways to end the series - either with JR getting everything he thinks he wants - ie Ewing Oil and dominance in business, but his personal life ends up wrecked because of it and ultimately ends up alone on top. Or he loses Ewing Oil, but finds personal happiness. But he can't have both. 

I feel like that's where they were headed with the Dream season. It seemed like JR was finally realizing he wanted a family with Sue Ellen and John Ross. Of course, Sue Ellen after the explosion would have been a real test to JR's motives. Upon it being a dream, they were right back to the end of season 8 and there was no way they would rehash JR coming to the same realization. 

3 hours ago, te. said:

Well, you know, except for all those times he tried to literally destroy Gary, Bobby and their wives.

Haha. Well yes, I'm not sure why he disliked Gary so much. But he was fiercely protective of his mother and she was pretty much the only one he respected. Then of course his son. The Dream Season did start to build this more tender side of JR - one who truly loved his family even Sue Ellen, but that all disappeared. 

There were many things wrong with JR...

I believe he truly loved Sue Ellen, but he just couldn't be faithful. I hated how he pushed the bottle on her and used it against her. I thought that was absolutely disgusting. However, there are many times where you did see honest love between the two. He unfortunately expected too much from Sue Ellen and wanted her to accept his infidelity and sit by and play the role of loving wife.

Cliff and Afton were great, only because Afton called Cliff on his [!@#$%^&*]. I truly loved the way Afton's character evolved in the series. Cliff used Afton and while he may have eventually developed feelings for her, he never gave her what she wanted or needed because he was always so consumed by his feud with the Ewings. He also threw her sleeping with some guy (can't recall the name) in her face even though it was Cliff's idea. Cliff was selfish and always thought of himself and was entirely consumed by his hatred for the Ewings. Same with Jamie. He completely used her and married to use for his advantage. 

JR was a ruthless business man and he had many flaws. I feel like his relationship with Bobby was tense, because he believed he should run Ewing Oil alone. He knew that he wasn't Jocks favorite and going into those oil fields and running the business were his way of getting his father's love and acceptance. That's why he fought so hard for it. 

5 hours ago, Khan said:

Frankly, @GLATWT88, I don't think J.R. cared, because there was no way to exploit it financially. 

The only things that mattered to J.R. Ewing were Ewing Oil and John Ross.  Everything else was inconsequential.

Now, if John Ross had come out of the closet, that would've been another matter, because his homosexuality would have threatened J.R.'s ability to pass onto the family legacy someday to his grandchildren.

It would have been an interesting dynamic to explore.

When I think of that The Movie Villain/The Actual Villain meme - I always see JR as the series villain, but Cliff as the actual villain.

JR is blindly motivated by his love for Ewing Oil and what it means to his family. Sure, he does some questionable and awful things but at his core he really does care about his family. Meanwhile, Cliff seems willing to screw anyone over if it means defeating JR. 

5 hours ago, Soapsuds said:

@GLATWT88

https://dallasdecoder.com/2012/05/07/critique-dallas-episode-26-royal-marriage/

Wow, thank you! I love this and I have to say I agree. I was really surprised by the manner Kit's coming out was handled. 

Watching Dallas, I was surprised by how well Kit's homosexuality was treated on the show. Considering it was done in 1979, it was handled with care and reality. No character, not even JR if I remember correctly, was disgusted by Kit's sexuality. Kit also comes to this realization that he needs to live honestly for himself and be who he is. No getting help or needing fixing. 

However, there were no other gay characters after that. I'm sure the AIDS outbreak didn't help towards queer representation, but I will say that Dallas did a good job.

2 minutes ago, Soapsuds said:

Victoria's center photo is iconic.

 I'm sure in retrospect it is. However, I've been here waiting for seasons to see her center photo updated and have realized it's not going to happen. 

Of the long running cast, did Victoria Principal have the fewest changes to her center photo in the opening credits. Her center photo was the same from season 3-10. I'm sure Steve Kanaly and Ken had more. 

16 minutes ago, DRW50 said:

I think the rights issues and the Bill Cosby issues are a big factor.

I imagine that being quite difficult.

I don't know if I would want it to move into a more serious drama and tone like Bel Air, but I feel like Bel Air has done such a great job of maintaining the integrity of the original but making it its own. 

It would also be easy to integrate veteran cast into the college setting while blending in a new cast. 

I'm surprised this hasn't been reboot or a re-imagined like Bel Air. 

I'm curious to get your opinions on season 10 - 14.

I started off really enjoying season 9, but struggled to finish it and that could have been due to many factors. I do have a lot going on now, but for some reason when I did have time, I just couldn't finish an episode or would watch bits and would finish later. 

So far I'm enjoying season 10. But I've just started and I don't know much about the later seasons. Am I in for a bit of disappointment. 

It's obvious that Melissa played Teresa, and since Teresa can't express herself well she always ends up looking bad. Now, I'm not saying that Teresa is innocent in this whole decade long mess, but I do feel like Melissa has gotten the good edit and she's definitely played the victim well. Production knew about the Melissa cheating allegations prior to the season, because Laura was speaking to anyone that would listen that includes both cast and production. Producers knew that they would run with this story and clearly so did the entire cast. We all know that cameramen aren't just set loose to film these women without a storyline or plan. However, they needed to bring the story onto the show "authentically" and since Marge wouldn't bring it up as that would get blood on her hands, production had Teresa and Jen do it by speaking to Laura.

Louie and Teresa had given Joe the heads up, considering his wife cheating on him was going to be the story. Danielle was always going to reveal the secret and it was obvious by the way Melissa and Rachel were pushing her so hard to spill at Dolores' party. Meanwhile, Melissa and Marge are no fools and they knew they needed to plot to save themselves and what better way than using Teresa as a scapegoat. By saying Teresa was doing this to ruin a family, the heat was taken off Marge who was the culprit all along for spreading the rumor and Melissa could weaken the validity of the rumors because why wouldn't Teresa who she's been feuding with for a decade and doesn't want to make her whole wedding about her want to ruin her marriage. You can see the shock in Teresa's expression when Melissa once again beat her to the punch and made her out to be the bad guy. Unfortunately, Teresa can't just spill and break fourth wall, but she also doesn't know how to fight back with words. 

1 minute ago, Soapsuds said:

I'm up to the episode where Pam runs out the clinic after seeing Mr Swanson. They scene was always so hilarious to me. 

It would make sense that Katherine would hire someone to kill Naldo and frame Jenna. That would remove her from Bobby life. I could also see Katherine as the person responsible for Pam's goose chase of Mark. Especially with the way the season ended.

I would love to see how these stories would be approached with a modern touch. I feel that a lot of great moments that should have appeared on camera happened off camera and im not sure if that was due to budget or as a means to push story along. There were several times I remember feeling that certain moments in season 7 and 8 should have happened on camera that were just told to us or fast forwarded. 

43 minutes ago, Soapsuds said:

The previous week Dallas had an 18.6 rating placing 15th for the week. The season finale jumped to a 24.9 rating and placed 3rd.

I wonder if Duffy's return helped keep ratings from sliding in season 10 like the other soaps. While I believe season 9 finished 6th for the season and Season 10 finished 11th, overall ratings were pretty similar for both seasons. The slip from 6 to 11 had more to do with other shows gaining in popularity rather than Dallas having a significant dip.

I do wonder if the departures in season 10 caused the drop in season 11. 

I haven't watched the earlier seasons in some time, but after reading through the thread, I'm trying to recall if only the miniseries or if season 2 was self contained episodes. 

21 minutes ago, Soapsuds said:

People knew already. It was all over the news near the end of the season. All fans knew is he was returning in the season finale. That's why the show got a huge jump in the ratings and their highest of the season.

The previous week Dallas had an 18.6 rating placing 15th for the week. The season finale jumped to a 24.9 rating and placed 3rd.

Btw did we ever find out who was behind Pam's wild goose chase of Mark? Was it Mark or JR? In the dream season Mark mentions being in that clinic Pam went to in Hong Kong.

Also in the dream season it's revealed that Katherine was responsible for Naldo death.

The season before there was no mention of Katherine being responsible.

As for Jamie she was killed three times on the show...lol

I am curious what would've happen to Sue Ellen after the explosion.

Season 8,  JR calls in a favor and gets someone to convince Pam that Mark is in the Caribbean. He flies her out to some clinic where a doctor or fraud was paid off to lie to Pam that Mark was originally at the clinic, but the facility/doctors couldn't help him so he went elsewhere. She ends up going to another clinic in the Caribbean and speaks with another doctor. I believe the person hired by JR eventult tells Pam the truth when she returns to Dallas. Meanwhile, this second legit doctor she met in the Caribbean while in a conference with doctors in Texas shared Pam's story with a doctor who believes he knows someone fitting Mark's description checked into a clinic in Hong Kong. My understanding is that Mark caught wind that Pam was on his trail and he wasn't ready for her to find him so he paid off some guy to scam Pam into thinking he could sneak her into the hospital to see  Mark but it turns out to be someone else. My understanding was that this was meant to dissuade Pam from continuing her search.

Yeh, Naldo's death is interesting. I'm trying to recall what the motive would have been to kill Naldo and not Jenna.