Alrighty then.....

No I dont think it's a stretch. Anything can be used as a weapon in the place of a gun. Box cutters, a plane, and as jack said, a car. What will liberals want to ban once guns are out of the picture?

OK. 3000+ people were killed on 9/11 from a box cutter. Right. The Democratic party does not want to ban ALL guns. Here's his policy. It sounds like common sense to me. Is there something you disagree with here? Or see anywhere where all guns will be taken away from Americans?

Address Gun Violence in Cities: As president, Barack Obama would repeal the Tiahrt Amendment, which restricts the ability of local law enforcement to access important gun trace information, and give police officers across the nation the tools they need to solve gun crimes and fight the illegal arms trade. Obama and Biden also favor commonsense measures that respect the Second Amendment rights of gun owners, while keeping guns away from children and from criminals who shouldn't have them. They support closing the gun show loophole and making guns in this country childproof. They also support making the expired federal Assault Weapons Ban permanent, as such weapons belong on foreign battlefields and not on our streets.

Seems pretty complex to me....what were you referring when you said "it doesn't seem that hard"?

It doesn't seem all that complex to me. That's it. I could probably fill out an application and in 90 days have my concealed weapons permit. Several of my single mom co-workers took a gun class and were presented the paper work right there! Now IA with you in it's complexity if the person applying for the permit is a felon. You're right then. It's complicated for them.

Do you think taxing the rich is a self-centered view? It wont impact you...so it's ok. How is my stance any different? You seem to have no problem with Obama's tax plan.

I don't have a problem with Obama's tax plan, you're right. That's why I'm voting for him. And no, I don't think taxing the rich is self-centered at all. The money isn't going into MY pockets, Casey! The rich have been given a bit of a free ride under 8 years of GWB's policies IMO and there should be some leveling of the playing field. That includes the rich that got huge tax cuts under GWB while the poor and middle class received relatively nothing.

I believe in the separation of church and state. I feel religious groups shouldn't try to use political clout to push some of the moral issues on which they tend to focus. You can stand before a congregation of people and preach Bilblical principles and it is up to each of those individuals to either heed or ignore. You're telling them their souls are at stake.....they get to decide what to do.

The most essential quality any Christian is supposed to have is Love. Love does not mean that you understand what a person does or that you accept what a person does. It means that you love the person despite what you don't grasp or may never believe in.

I think one of the conflicts the religious right may be experiencing on the issue of homosexuality is the idea that if you embrace a homosexual then you embrace his/her lifestyle which is not so. It's a matter of being able to see that a person is a human being even if you never understand or accept homosexuality. At least that's how I see it. And I know someone can come along and say doesn't this apply to pedophiles, etc. Well yes.....the sight of one is going to disgust me because I despise what that person does....am I obligated to love that person anyway?......yes.....do I?.....I can't answer that one.....but even though this is a total cop out.....that's why I'm not Jesus......I'm working on being a better person.

I think this is right on the money.

I do not support any intrusion into the personal lives of Americans in any case. I have said this many times. I have said that I dont agree with that aspect of the Republican party. (except for abortion).

I have said the government should treat all classes (tax brackets) the same. I think all American's social lives should be off limits.

Yet you are supporting McCain. Hmmm.

I find this to be contradictory to what you have said in the past. That was my question. How can you justify strong government involvement with people's wallets, but not their bedroom?

You are being equally contradictory in supporting a party that intrudes into people's bedrooms just because of fiscal matters. Hmmm.

If everyone in the land started out with the same opportunities, same amount of money, land, etc. and some did extremely well and were being asked to take care of the ones who didn't then I'd understand riding that argument to death, but that isn't the case. People are paying for the paths that their ancestors either chose or were forced into. It's not fair.....Life is not fair.....see my point about the Indians....now if they whine about the land people are going to say that it wasn't us that took your land or it's in the past or get over it....so then....

IA. Does the welfare system need some work? Definitely yes. But there but for the Grace of God it could be any of us down on their luck. That's all I have to say on the matter.

First they say McCain can't use a computer. Then when it's pointed out he doesn't email because of his damaged arms, they show that he can use a computer and cell phones, rendering the ad by Obama a lie any way you look at it. Ridiculous.

And McCain is telling the truth in all his ads, right? Riiiiiight!

http://www.crooksandliars.com/2008/09/17/c...n-campaign-lie/

CNN Demolishes Every McCain Campaign Lie

That's exactly what Sarah Palin said in her interview with Charlie Gibson..

She can say whatever she wants so that people aren't scared off. But if she were President, I somehow doubt she'd be so understanding.

If you use the excuse that people kill people, then why should there be any regulations? Why not hand out rocket launchers down on the corner? After all, it's a person that pulls the trigger. The slippery slope argument is just a scare tactic and wouldn't ever materialize. If you think there won't be a line drawn for weapons on the liberal side, then I should assume that there's no line for extremely dangerous weapons on the Republican side? Using that people kill people argument.

Lol at the picture of McCain behind the wheel holding a cell phone. I'm going to assume that car was stationary, lol.

Edited September 17, 200817 yr by bandbfan

And McCain is telling the truth in all his ads, right? Riiiiiight!

Help me out here....wasn't the knock on the ad that it says that McCain doesn't know how to use the Internet and the excuse was that he cannot go on the Internet because he cannot use a computer due to his injuries? So now that it's proven that his injuries are not preventing him from using the cell phone with it's liitle buttons....how does that negate that he doesn't use the Internet?

Personally I didn't even get why his injuries were used as an excuse since there is a lot of software that is geared towards the disabled and giving them accessiblity but if we want to go on the premise that his injury prevents his being net savvy.....his defenders are obviously not telling the truth.

As I said the other day, I only post with the amen chorus but I will say that those older people can't use the internet themselves won't take offense to Obama's ad on McCain. It would be offensive if Obama were saying that old people can't adapt to technology because they're old......McCain hasn't held himself out to be the representative of senior citizens.....even if he is one.....and he's not trying to make himself appear to be one.....even though we can clearly see he is....so saying he's behind the times is not a knock on the elderly......it's a knock on him.

I believe many of the elderly who are willingly "behind the times" will see it as a jab at McCain's age.

What is Obama saying then? McCain can't adapt to technology, because....?

The assumption from the ad is that McCain's age is the main factor (because no specific explanation for McCain's technological weakness is given)..In our culture, it's common knowledge that the elderly are not computer savy...not a smart group to poke fun at during a campaign.

No other group votes with more passion or dependability than seniors!

Whether that was the intention or not (much like the "lipstick" comment), many will take offense.

Edited September 17, 200817 yr by Casey008

She can say whatever she wants so that people aren't scared off. But if she were President, I somehow doubt she'd be so understanding.

If you use the excuse that people kill people, then why should there be any regulations? Why not hand out rocket launchers down on the corner? After all, it's a person that pulls the trigger. The slippery slope argument is just a scare tactic and wouldn't ever materialize.

Lol at the picture of McCain behind the wheel holding a cell phone. I'm going to assume that car was stationary, lol.

mmmmmm hmmmmmm. I'm gonna keep my rocket launcher in my car while I'm at work just in case I need it. You never know when you're gonna have to launch somebody's ass to the moon.

Help me out here....wasn't the knock on the ad that it says that McCain doesn't know how to use the Internet and the excuse was that he cannot go on the Internet because he cannot use a computer due to his injuries? So now that it's proven that his injuries are not preventing him from using the cell phone with it's liitle buttons....how does that negate that he doesn't use the Internet?

Personally I didn't even get why his injuries were used as an excuse since there is a lot of software that is geared towards the disabled and giving them accessiblity but if we want to go on the premise that his injury prevents his being net savvy.....his defenders are obviously not telling the truth.

You rock, Wales. We just bought a touch-screen computer (like an iPod). You never have to use the keypad. And then there are speach recognition sofware applications as well.

Alrighty then.....

OK. 3000+ people were killed on 9/11 from a box cutter. Right. The Democratic party does not want to ban ALL guns. Here's his policy. It sounds like common sense to me. Is there something you disagree with here? Or see anywhere where all guns will be taken away from Americans?

3,000 people were killed on 9/11 and not once was a gun fired. I hope you see my point...people will find a way to harm..with or without a gun.

I don't believe I ever said that all Democrats want to ban all guns.

Yeah, the Obama/Biden stance seems to be very "middle of the road".

It doesn't seem all that complex to me. That's it. I could probably fill out an application and in 90 days have my concealed weapons permit. Several of my single mom co-workers took a gun class and were presented the paper work right there! Now IA with you in it's complexity if the person applying for the permit is a felon. You're right then. It's complicated for them.

So you would be able to prove under a testing situation that you can handle a gun sufficiently? That was another requirement under FL law.

I don't think taxing the rich is self-centered at all. The money isn't going into MY pockets, Casey!

I guess we will have to agree to disagree on this.

I guess you haven't heard about Obama's plan for another refund coming from the top income earners, to every American.

Yet you are supporting McCain. Hmmm.

How do you feel McCain will intrude on the personal lives of Americans?

You are being equally contradictory in supporting a party that intrudes into people's bedrooms just because of fiscal matters. Hmmm..

I've already stated, several times, that I do not agree with the Republicans on most social issues (except abortion). I am not going to let that keep me from voting for McCain, because I side with McCain on almost every issue.

And McCain is telling the truth in all his ads, right? Riiiiiight!

I've asked this a few times now, and no one has responded.

In which ad do you feel McCain is lying?

Edited September 17, 200817 yr by Casey008

Issue - Equal Pay for Equal Work

Obama's position :

Combat Employment Discrimination

Obama and Biden will work to overturn the Supreme Court's recent ruling that curtails racial minorities' and women's ability to challenge pay discrimination. They will also pass the Fair Pay Act to ensure that women receive equal pay for equal work and the Employment Non-Discrimination Act to prohibit discrimination based on sexual orientation or gender identity or expression.

In all honesty, I have to admit ignorance on the ruling from the Supreme Court. This is just unbelieveable.

What are y'alls thoughts on his policy statement?

Help me out here....wasn't the knock on the ad that it says that McCain doesn't know how to use the Internet and the excuse was that he cannot go on the Internet because he cannot use a computer due to his injuries? So now that it's proven that his injuries are not preventing him from using the cell phone with it's liitle buttons....how does that negate that he doesn't use the Internet?

Personally I didn't even get why his injuries were used as an excuse since there is a lot of software that is geared towards the disabled and giving them accessiblity but if we want to go on the premise that his injury prevents his being net savvy.....his defenders are obviously not telling the truth.

His injuries were never mentioned in the Obama ad.

The McCain camp later responded by saying, He doesn't email often because of his injuries.

Edited September 17, 200817 yr by Casey008

Obama's Tax 'Rebate' Plan

Obama's refund plan from his own website.

Looks like it will be going into your pockets.

Issue - Equal Pay for Equal Work

Obama's position :

In all honesty, I have to admit ignorance on the ruling from the Supreme Court. This is just unbelieveable.

What are y'alls thoughts on his policy statement?

I don't know the wording of the policy to be able to point out any flaws it may have but the general premise of fair pay is a wonderful idea.

In reference to a prior post that mentioned that Donna Brazille thinks Obama needs catchier ad.....I agree with her but I don't agree that McCain has those types of ads that stick with you. Realistically the media hammers his ads to death by pointing out the falsehoods or the silliness or whatever else so of course they get more traction that way. If I were working on an Obama ad I would clip Yes We Can because I think it's powerful with voices in union.

Since people want him to talk about race he should say there's only one race that matters....the human race...we are one people and together we can.....

3,000 people were killed on 9/11 and not once was a gun fired. I hope you see my point...people will find a way to harm..with or without a gun.

There again, though, is an instance of banning weapons. There's a reason that guns weren't used.

OK. I'll bite again.

3,000 people were killed on 9/11 and not once was a gun fired. I hope you see my point...people will find a way to harm..with or without a gun.

The entire context of this attack is out of the ordinary in everyday life, but I'm going along with it. Guns have not been allowed on planes for years. If you could bring a firearm onto a plane, you better believe that the terrorists would not have used box cutters.

The simple fact of the matter, Casey, is that guns will always kill more people simply because you don't have to be right up on someone's ass to use them. For other kinds of weapons, you do (for the most part). The interstate killings in DC years ago happened because the guys had a gun and they fired them at innocent people from far away. They would have never been able to yeild that kind of attack with a knife.

I don't believe I ever said that all Democrats want to ban all guns.

Yes, you never said that. But the implication you have been posting here is that if Democrats are in charge, guns are gone. That's why you vote Repubs.

So you would be able to prove under a testing situation that you can handle a gun sufficiently? That was another requirement under FL law.

I'm sure I could. I'm sure alot of people could. Do you know what comprises this test? All you have to do is take a gun safety class.

How do you feel McCain will intrude on the personal lives of Americans?

Um. Because he's a Republican. Do I have to say why again? Really? A little something about the Constitution change GWB and the majority have been pushing the last 8 years. I concede that you say McCain voted against that. Fine. What makes you think that the Evangelistic Wing of the Republican Party won't have him towing the line?

I've asked this a few times now, and no one has responded.

In which ad do you feel McCain is lying?

Not true. The lying McCain ads have been called out on this very thread by me and others.

Roman just posted something on that very subject.

http://www.crooksandliars.com/2008/09/17/c...n-campaign-lie/

Obama's Tax 'Rebate' Plan

Obama's refund plan from his own website.

Looks like it will be going into your pockets.

I have read the tax plan from Obama's website and we have discussed that extensively here Casey. I like the plan and I think I have argued sufficiently as to why I have come to that conclusion.

Secondly, your Republican Prez GWB has twice now sent tax payers rebate checks. I assume though that they were OK since they didn't come from the "pockets of the rich". Did you receive your checks? Did you cash them or send them back to the government with a note attached saying "Thanks, but no thanks"??

In reference to a prior post that mentioned that Donna Brazille thinks Obama needs catchier ad.....I agree with her but I don't agree that McCain has those types of ads that stick with you. Realistically the media hammers his ads to death by pointing out the falsehoods or the silliness or whatever else so of course they get more traction that way. If I were working on an Obama ad I would clip Yes We Can because I think it's powerful with voices in union.

Since people want him to talk about race he should say there's only one race that matters....the human race...we are one people and together we can.....

That's an idea. My partner and I saw his new ad last night while watching TV. Nothing flashy, just Mr. Obama speaking to the camera about his economic policies. For us, it was very effective and he came across as someone that cares about this country very much. He's very charasmatic and should play to that strength.