EricMontreal22

Yes. One of the episodes--I think Hannah found him? Or was it Steffi?--is on youtube. She's in that 1988 episode online where the new Lily is flirting with Jack... Man I wish I could see the pilot--I used to have it saved from WOST but never got around to watching it and don't seem to have it anymore...

The late 80s till 91 or 92 were really a mess, from what I can tell. The city became too corporate and big, lost the campus and small town feel entirely, etc.

I'll have to check youtube--he DOES have the Marland look, for sure. WOST had at least one episode with Trisha and Steve--I liked them from it, I also liked her with psycho Jeff (though having her go off air with him out of the institution and her amnesiac was kinda as odd exit...) There was another episode with AVa and Paul when he was in a wheelchair, which was an interesting match I thought. Dinah Lee and Trucker actually... weren't bad. But it wasn't Trucker and Trisha.

HAHA poor Tony. How long was he on ATWT? I think he pretty much gave up on acting and is living in some small city as a carpenter or something random now... It woulda been great if they coulda ended up with him and Trisha reunited--but Noelle leaving the show hurt that a lot.

When I started watching I DID get him mixed up with Clay. I suppose seeing his children, he was a bit too young, but it never crossed my mind... And you're right about their cast... I dunno, I sorta think maybe nothing would have helped raise Loving's ratings (except doing as Agnes wanted and sandwiching it between her other shows). Because often it was very good--and it had a strong cast, but did lack stability in every sense of the word.

So randolph was the original Clay/Alex? I always thought he was second for some reason... I agree it's nice to see they tried with Loving. That last one seems almost like a huge advertisement BEGGING people to tune in (and to be fair to ABC, throughout the 90s, despite the damaging quick turnaround of EPs and HWs, it's obvious by who they hired, and what they've said, that ABC *was* trying to bring people to Loving. I mean compare the situation now where AMC has had the same crap EP for 8 or 9 years now, which is I think longer than anyone except when Agnes was EP in the 70s! The OLTL piece you posted from the same issue, about Gottlieb shows the same enthusiasm).

That's fantastic--and going to take me a while to print and read. I have to admit, while he exemplifies the kind of "soap stud" I often find embarassing and am not usually drawn to--as a yougn teen I *loved* Trucker. Not a great actor, but I found him beyond handsome and also an exceedingly likeable character (and Trisha/Trucker were prob the closest Loving got to a true super couple who would get SOD time, etc--even if Ava and Alex and others came close)

She was GREAT in the murder mystery--the revelation is of course one of the great female soap scenes I think--but I thinmk you're right. I haven't seen much from the 80s (only what's online) but could it have been when she returned after a year or two in 1991?

Oh I meant which actress--I think it's Roya Megnot as Ava, but can't quite tell (LOL I know, I know--) and was wondering if it could be the briefly used first Ava, Patty Lotz. Even with what Gwyn became, it's a testament to the actress that she was an immediate favorite of mine.

I don't think these Loving promos from 1984 have been posted here yet--I just found them, though they'd been up for a year. Which Ava is that in the first one? and one from 88 which seems to continue the Jack/Lily story from that 1987 episode that's online

Isn't it also that he liked using theatre talent that didn't always wanna stick around on a soap for very long?

Why specifically? I think I can guess, but am curious...

That's true, even if you do a lot to change a soap, it's different coming in with a foundation.

Loved reading the opinion piece at the end. It sounds like the show wasn't very well liked... Lack of plot sometimes was a problem of Lemay's I take it, but you'd think by then he would know how to structure a soap better? The implied lack of feeling for the characters doesn't sound like Lemay though... I find all this fascinating.

I believe that the four shows were Ma Perkins, Helen Trent, Young Dr Malone and Happiness... I have a book on radio serials I can check on the weekend.

I've mentioned that when I was a teen I was really into the old radio soaps--I listened to those 50 or so consecutive Guiding Light episodes, as well as some 30s ones and various others. Besides Guiding Light, the show I found the most interesting was definitely Right to Happiness--its spin off of course (though I believe Irna handed over the writing job quite early on). I think it was one of the bigger hits too, and of course ran till the bitter end of the radio soap era, I wonder why they never did try to transition it, as a companion to GL on TV or something. Carl I think 4 or so soaps all left the airwaves at the same time (in 1960?) Right was one of them, but I can't remember the others (Yougn Dr Malone? Road of Life? Which of course both did try out on TV but I believe with different storylines)

Bad Romance has been my fave of her singles, and it was one of the few videos that worked (I liked Paparazzi too). While I like that she still does over the top videos when few others do, I do kinda get the criticsm ever since Alejandro--and now--that the video concepts seem to have next to nothing to do with the song. Although that's always been part of Gaga's shtick (and to be fair it's worked brilliantly for her commercially)--"outrageous" image, with pretty conventional catchy pop/dance. I agree that the opening, as repellent as parts of it are is the best part of the video--it seems to set up something, that isn't fulfilled with the rest (though I like the skeleton bit for some reason--I'm pretty tired of Gaga's always the same choreography though which is just kinda a mess). Oddly I was just rewatching for the first time in years, the Tales of the City miniseries with a friend which opens with the Vertigo theme as well... I do lik e the song--cliche as it is--and I guess I would have been annoyed with a video that was set at a gay pride parade or something more expected, but... This may sound defensive, but I don't think Gaga *is* trying to be sexy--I know in Vanity Fair (though maybe *she* was being defensive) she has said she's never trying to sell herself as a sex object, even when she wears next to nothing. I actually kinda appreciate that in a world where nearly every female popstar(and male, for that matter)'s main goal is to look as sexy as possible. *That* is one area where she does differ from Madonna.

I've long been interested in this... I found a few interesting New York Times articles on it, that I can try to post but thats it... (Of course they didn't like it much...) Wish something from it was online

The video starts off interestingly--even if using Herrmann's Vertigo has been done before--and then kinda goes nowhere fast. She also needs a new choreographer. I don't mind long videos though--they will ofen just play the edit anyway... I do agree with Adam though--with the sorry state of videos right now, when even Madonna could care less, I like that she at least tries... Oh and Little Boots:

Shrug. I see that as exactly why it's all an act. She sees herself (pretentiously I admit) as a creation, like Bowie saw himself in the 70s, etc. I've never heard her actually say it's a direct reflection of who she is, but rather of who her influences have been and what she thinks the world (again pretentious) "needs". I enjoy her because nothing is genuine about her. I guess that doesn't make me one of her monsters, but I don't see any of the messages she rants on about as BAD, so it doesn't bug me. I see a lot of people get really worked up (people who dislike her) by all this though, which is exactly what she wants. She does sing the important part on Ellen, but I agree actually. I'm sick of people covering pop songs on youtube and being heralded as the Next Great Thing, particularly when they're not so cute little kids that Ellen loves. But I guess that makes me evil and grumpy

I'm mixed on it. I dunno though the Gaga is fake argument/criticism makes me laugh cuz IMHo that's her whole shtick--it's ALL show, an act, and that's what appeal she has for me. Pop music should be like that IMHO--a show.

HURTS' new video/single. I've liked them from the start, but I admit the film geek in me loves that this video is a take on Cocteau's Orphee. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fbRPFDG4Ais

I've heard one radio episode--it's interesting in many ways it seemed like Irna actually created the show to take over the relitious element from Guiding Light as that had been phased out. It also seemed like it could have been, like GL the rare radio soap that would have a long life on TV--until they sold the show.

Loving really got a poor deal I think--we've said this before, but... Back when I started watching cuz of the AMC cross overs, I think I found out from a TINY piece in SOD. As it was SOD next to never said much at all about Loving it seems (except for the brief synopsis section). Here in Canada it was the ONLY soap at the time that wasn't simulcast or carried at a different time on a Canadian station, and I remember even talking at one point to a friend of my mom's who was soap opera obsessed--she had watched the P&G soaps and AMC and Y&R since the 70s, and was aware of all the others, and she had simply never ever heard of it. Even with the brief push given to The City it never really felt like ABC had their hearts in it (wehich brings us back to them canceling the City after only 18 months--well 13 or 14 months really before it was decided--why go through all this trouble to try somethign genuinely new, and then give it such a brief chance, especially knowing that soaps take usually a year to find their footing even in a traditional model?) I honestly remember a TON of a lot more promotion for PC--but wouldn't The City, with its new 'look" and Morgan Fairchild have deserved even more a primetime opener?

That is fantastic! it's the kind of thing I've seen countless times for AMC, or OLTL or other shows I watch, but never for Loving. Thanks!