Mitch64

I think they are trying to channel the original Billy/Van dynamic..but it doesn't work. Speaking of bored...they have a scene where Alan is ragging on Alex as she is getting ready to go on a date with H.B...(I know..freaky.) Alan suggests this if she wants an older man she should get someone from "their class of people, like Henry." Alex turns around and says, "I would DIE of boredom." This was all kinds of wrong, Henry is a father figure to them so Alan's suggestion is creepy, and Alex dissing Henry over the old windbag H.B. (who I liked but...) annoyed me. She didn't say, "That's disgusting, he practically raised us" she insults him. I still say a recast Mike Bauer would have been a great pairing, especially with Alan back or when Roger comes back. Fletcher is, as always inserted into that plot where he doesn't belong. She wants that, but she would totally have no respect for that person if they let her. Look at Fletch, for all of his bitching all he does is hold her purse and even lives in the mansion for a while.

I always wanted Nola to find that letter (the letter from hell that keeps turning up...) maybe going through Mo's old stuff to donate and finds it in that sweater, and there is ANOTHER face off with Lillian in the Bauer kitchen...."Don't think that I will be driving off any roads anytime soon, I will be around to make your life a living hell from now on!"

I actually liked the "Lifesavers" intro.(maybe because at that time was the last time I felt GL still had life in it...).I just wish they had gone back to "Hold on To Love" and the uncheap scroll of the characters.

The actor himself went on and on about Fletcher's cute "buns" Okay, Jay, we get it, you like your ass!

Hmmm, interesting idea. Rick was motherless through his childhood and early teens ( Holly as Mom..uh no..Rita? "Send the kid off to boardingschool I want to bang my hot rich neighbor") And he lost his two mother figures, Bert and Mo. Maybe an interesting idea was to cast "Lana" (still not sure if that is her name) Reardon, the missing one and Mo's sister. She would be an sexier, sassier version of Mo...and at least we would have an interesting storyline for bit...she comes back to town, everyone wants her with Ed..but she is banging Rick (but no to a Bauer father/son actual triangle..) Agreed, Mindy had it in her to make Rick interesting and provide some conflict..she is cute, sassy, prone to shoot from the hip and make huge mistakes, a bit uppity and bitchy, but actually very loyal and nice and family centered.

I think that Rick, as the last remaining Bauer, should have been that important. He didn't even need to be paired with someone to be the town go to guy, shoulder to cry on , friend when you need one. MOL at his best was warm and charming and did bring some of the Charita vibes. The problem was, he may have been loved by cast and crew, it was obvious the writers didn't feel the same and wrote Rick as a joke/looser. They did try to light a fire under him when they put him with Mel, as they lit one under FrankieD by pairing with beautiful charismatic MK, but MOL and the Mel actress had no chemistry...and Rick does not need "fire" chemistry, he needs a warm everday one but they couldn't generate that. Very true, or at least make them mob adjacent (i.e. Daddy Santos was a small time hood, and Carmen wants a better life for her and her family, and she will do ANYTHING to get that, even using the daughter in law she detests to gain respectability and access to the main families in town.) But the Santos as a full fledged mob outfit, with Carmen in charge and being there for years never worked. But yes, I would prefer them out of the mob. What does this mean? So Rauch/MADD or CBS wanted a mob family on the show, doesn't mean that was something, like the island of douches, ever worked. It was stupid to anyone (again, its a dream episode..okay...not my fave but will let it pass) I don't understand when people say the creativity was there...they didn't have the writers, the producers or the budget to do this. It looked ridiculous. Not sure why Marvel thought it was a good idea to use a failing soap that did not have the demos they wanted, to promote them...seems dumb all around.

Hell loves company!!!!! : ) Grab a seat, the scenes of Buzz trying to save the diner during the 5th Street Fire are coming up!!!! I would have had a strong Latina woman, a first generation citizen, and a lawyer (with a big family) who actually is very active against the Santos family and what they are doing to what I would make, the multi ethnic community from 7th Street on down to the river. Let's say Rick helps out at a clinic one day a week or so, and they meet. Rick and she hit it off, after the required, "I don't like you," part of him not understanding her anger and she annoyed by his white, wealthy privilege. They come to a consensus on hating the Santos family and she softens when she hears that Rick's great grandfather was an immigrant who, when they moved from California to Springfield, settled in that neighborhood, which at the time was heavily German/Irish/Greek (Bauers/Reardons/Coopers.) Eventually drama unfolds where she starts putting the Santos away and finding damning evidence on Danny, which affects Chele, so Rick gets involved. MOL needed a live wire to make Rick interesting (and avoid his mugging...) This character would eventually be very wary of Phillip and the damage that the Spaulding family had to the area and people there also..I always liked that Mel didn't seem to like Phillip but they never developed it or actually her character.

There is no way Ehlers came up with that...(the design of the suit, yes, she had to show off her abs..) but it was Kreizman and Wheeler who came up with that idea, which wasnt even a dream..it was supposed to be real. WTF, even Cleva would think that was stupid. No way did Ehlers or the designer go to Marvel and have a comic made..if they had that power neither one of them would have been on that shinking ship. So weird..they must have made the Santos' Latino as they saw that the Latin audience for soaps was strong...but did they actually think that audience wanted to see a cartoon family of mobsters running around? I think GL, an show that was built around an immigrant German family making it to the upper middle class, would have been perfect to bring in a Latin family and tie them to that core family the Bauers..but as mobsters.It really showed how incredibly dense MADD, Rauch, the net execs were.

And they had to have every woman fall for him to force the audience to prove he was "sexy" I can't ever wash the scene out of my mind where he and Beth.."did something" on Alan's desk, and then they showed Alan eating the croissant they did the deed over.. Brad Cole...I would love to find out who the hell was pushing him.

If I remember correctly both actors played it differently then written. Seb played it as a romantic fixation that he developed by romanticizing Roger's stories about Holly, and Holly played it, as if she was playing him on his "attraction.' An example of actors who overcome the writing again. But damn, why wouldn't Seb have the hots for Holly? Which brings this around to the Sebastian actor was kind of sexy in an ambigous way (there is a scene between he and Josh were Seb is practically flirting with him...) was this a character actor before their time? Agreed, there is no excuse for the outhouse scenes, written, produced, for the characters, and especially for the actors to have to do that!!!!

I never understood how the rape was swept under the rug? And they had Reva marry him...(the guy was an ass from the beginning, remember him calling Harley "terrier" and it was supposed to be oh so cute and masculine) he understood her and accepted her...plot point to keep Cole on our screens. By the way, did they ever resolve WHO poisoned the drinks that was meant for Jefferey but Blake drank (and put her in a coma so they wouldn't have to write or pay for her.) I forgot about that...the baby conceived on the outhouse floor..a true nadir in GL history and proof Wheeler didn't know which way was up. But it did give Van a great scene when Mel had the nerve to threaten her....Van, "I realize you don't know who you are dealing with, so I am giving you the benefit of the doubt, but I advice you to tread lightly" or something like that

Jon giving the creeps was a good thing...when he first came on he was the villain, hurting a young girl, a relative (and yea, sorry, there was a consent issue there.) For a few months he was the villain and it was great...like Reva's sexual ID come to life, with no constraints weaponized to do harm (whatever you say about Reva, her use of sexuality was never intended by her to harm anyone..) It also helped the TP gave off of a vibe that he would f*ck anyone he wanted, no matter the sex, to get what he wanted which was usually to hurt someone. But then he got popular and the press went on and on and Kreizman got a writers boner for him and they had to vanilla the character and the (God I hate the word...Jammi) relationship. But Jon still gave the creeps out despite trying to make him a generic anti hero. He was always going to win, not only at the end of a storyline, but in each scene (you can see the director letting TP get away with his "laugh" to end every scene) and the character quickly became intolerable. If they let him continue to be destructive, have Reva and everyone continue to stand up to him (did Billy ever get to give him a beat down) and even paired Tammy with him to show a truly toxic relationship (this was one time sexual abuse counter would work for both characters,Jons use of it to hurt others and Tammy's low self esteem to accept her attacker and make excuses for him) would have really interesting and I think both actors could have pulled it off. But GL went the cheap boring route. Too bad first couple of months were damn good.

Agreed... both did great and I couldn't stand Ehlers at that point. I think Kim channeled her "grand good humor" that Jerry said about Charita (and whatever one can say about Kimmer, and I have, at her best she does have the same thing...her fragile ego and need to compete just got in the way...) and Ehlers channeled Irna's brittleness and just not taking it attitude..which Ehlers had in spades at that time..it just didn't suit them trying to make Harley the romantic heroine (I always wish Harley had gone back to her tough girl ways after being jilted by everyman. she was with...now Ehlers could play the HELL out of that..) About Vanessa, yes, I think she should have been the end game matriarch..but paired with JVD as patriarch. I would have moved everything to have Ross and Van reunite and be the new tentpoles...Bloss and Mattessa fans be damned. Ross has the gentle warmth that would offset Maeve's icy backbone of steel (I would never want to be on the end of Kim Hughes "kiddo" but I would NEVER, EVER want to feel the quiet wrath of Vanessa, even Reva admits at the end that she is afraid of her!!!)

As far back as 97/98 Kimmer was complaining (Kimmer was always either trying to prop up the latest cheesy Reva story, or when it failed going to the press and complaining about it, or just complaining...) that they were trying to turn her into "Bert Bauer" by even having her tut tut at Cassie for something...(she also said they had 6 characters to fill in as Reva, while not making Reva..Reva) so Kimmer was NEVER interested in that role. She wanted to be the Slut of Springfield forever, and that was not going to work, nor was Reva a matriarch. So I do feel sorry for Wheeler in that she was stuck with the "star" of the show aging and getting heavier, but still wanting to cling to the past, and getting more desperate about it each day. P & G , Rauch and MADD created that monster by pushing Kim as the star of the show and kept feeding it and Kimmers ego over the years so Wheeler was left with an older, fatter star who didn't want to face reality, and she had no one to back her up. The one thing I will give Wheeler is that she rose to the challenge by putting Reva more in a support role and making her the most likeable she had been in years. I also give credit to Kimmer as she started playing Reva much like herself..getting older, getting cranky, getting tired, getting sick of having to compete..which is exactley what Reva should have been then (I will ignore marrying that black hole Jeffie and getting a ridiculous miracle pregancy..) They offered Ellen Parker the Bert role but she turned them down. I actually thought did a great job on playing Charita...she gave her that warm sense of humor that Charita played through everything (I think Bert was my fave matriarch as you know she could knock down a brown drink and tell a hilarious story) But I think I thought that episode was really good, despite Wheeler trying to use it to justify incest Jammi.

Back in preschool days ATWT must have been on at 12:30. My Mom LOVED ATWT (she stopped watching when "they got rid of the old people" and Wagner quit for a time) and she loved to hate Lisa..."Let's see what THAT Lisa is up today!" (cementing my love of bad girls with a heart who stirred [!@#$%^&*] up..) I ate lunch at Noon and 12:30 was "nap" time though I never slept, she would rock me while watching "her show" or "world turns." So my earliest memories are Nancy, Chris and Grandpa sitting and discussing events and the voices of Wagner, Hastings and Fulton immediately brought back feeling comfortable well into the last day of ATWT. My earliest memory of actually watching soaps on my own is Dark Shadows, I was so jealous of that David kid who got to live in a house with vampires, ghosts, portals, and vengeful sexy witches!!!

I take it they weren't having sleep overs at each other's house and giggling about boys? I can't imagine that anyone thought the two of them would be friends. Both are strong women with distinct visions, and both tend to favor men over other women. Its too bad, Long's heartfelt work with JFP's production work would have been great. Those clips of the Company redo with Reva acting "wild" again. You can tell that something is going on behind the scenes as Kimmer is very stiff, and not playing those scenes with a bit of desperation as she would normally do...Reva upset and trying to bravado her way out of it. I love that Reva has one sip of her drink and Abby is all concerned. As ridiculous as it is to have cute Twink J. making over middle aged Reva, it would have been a fun if they had a one nighter, while Buzz and Josh are having a pissing match over her the younger even prettier then Josh guy is going at it. Plus, the fun of having Nola and Reva having it out over it. Yes, the Josh Days guy has much better chemistry with Brown and they are sexy together. Too bad he wasn't cast as another character then, or later on just bring him back after Quint leaves. Maybe chief of police and Nola always getting in his way.

That is the problem with soaps, they don't consider or they just try to get rid of their individual styles. Long was great with GL, a community soap (especially her first tenure..all the families were in play and had their own characteristics..) but not fit at all for SB (have no clue for OLTL but her style did not seem "ABCish") I would have loved to see what she could have done on ATWT. I do think she would have respected the core famiies...though it was a lot more of an uptight colder show then free wheeling GL. Re Grillo..I remember a talk show where he totally bitched (in a supposedly good humored way) about his exwife being a drain..and this was the mother of his kids. He always seems like most of the parts he plays, an oily creep (who is about 5'8.) They did have chemistry..and it would have been interesting if it showed Cassie bringing out his good side while he brought out more of her bad side (LW was born to play a bitch) It would have been more interesting if Reva and Josh and others were totally against it, and Cassie tells them to go to hell and it drives a wedge in things. The perfect time to start this would have been after Reva pulled the plug on Prince Dickie...and both Eddie and Cassie go after her. It would have been interesting, dark and hot, for a short term.

I know she was in HW, but too bad ATWT did move heaven and earth to bring her back as Natalie, instead of that woman they recast, Granted the storyline sucked but the Dobsons would have kept her on when they came back to rejigger things and hopefully a good storyline with John or James.

Big Billy? Definately better in the sack than pretty boy Josh. He is funny, doesn't take him self too seriously and can damn well keep you WARM on a cold midwestern night! I also think that Billy would satisfy Reva's sex drive better, i.e. just fun sex, then out for pizza and beer, where Josh would satisfy the "romance" and wooing and worshiping thing Reva needed. Josh says, "How was I, did I satisfy you?" where Billy slaps you on the ass and says, "Damn you're as good as always!" I remember that Oprah and as much as Kimmer and Reva annoys me with the "Look at ME" and airtime hogging, she was OUR annoying air hog! I remember thinking, "Oprah, you do know you have Reva Shayne Lewis on, a woman who can suck a golf ball through a garden hose and go bear hunting with a stick, while you have brittle skinny Lucci..who cares about her!"

That's funny, the only time I like post resurrection Reva, was during Wheeler (though I do agree she was inept.) I would have taken a page out of MADD and Rauchie and just sent Reva to heaven...(for good this time) and watched what an over 40 heavy woman could get after that. Reva became just what she needed to be at that point, support, a unique character, and one of the last touch stones for the audience on GL. But I wouldn't have played her game.

The younger actors especially had nothing but nice things to say about Beverlee, acknowledging she was a force to be reckoned with. She would take them under her wings and out to dinner in an interview she gives a funny story about Derwin taking HER out to dinner, and it was usually the other way around. You could see that come out in Alex...she was always softer with the younger people, which I thought was cool and totally Alex, the woman who lost her son, twice, dealing with young people. Yea, MG looked GREAT and was still sexy..(hell, I loved the Stalker storyline as she got out of Rauch's pastel suits to slink around in leather!)

Zimmer was sex on a stick her first three years on the show, and after she had her babies you can see her aging and gaining weight...something we all do as we age...and not being quite the hottest thing in town despite the writing...(thought Long was getting away from that by having Reva mature a bit and giving her stories about her kid, etc.) It doesnt get full blown until she returns from the dead (funny that McTavish spits on MG for getting older and makes fun of Lucci's ego when Zimmer was not hot stuff when she returned and had an ego to match Lucci) and goes full forces when Rauch returned. Zimmer was an attractive woman, but she was not the hotttest thing in town when you had Beth Chamberline and Laura Wright there. I have no doubt that Zimmer was intimidated by matching RN up with LW...and as someone pointed out, LW is a savy woman and she knew that Kimmer would unleash her frau dogs on her and go to the press behind everyone's back to drop "news" about LW. Zimmer was famous for doing things like that, acting buddy buddy with an actor but doing the same with a reporter and dropping gossip about the other actors, but acting like she cared about the actor (example, when Marj got dropped Zimmer talked to the press about where poor Marj was devastated as where was she going to find a job at "her age"..) And yes, Zimmer's fans and some dumb press thought she was a straight shooter, because she would do the same thing, drop [!@#$%^&*] about an actor or somethign going on in the show that wasnt advantageous to her, but it was all in for herself, unlike Bev who used her clout to help the other, especially younger actors, I never liked Zimmer because of that. I do think the Rauch/Zimmer relationship is interesting. He totally hated any woman who wasnt' "hot" and she was well past the hot time, so I can only think that Kim knew which side her bread was buttered and kissed a*ss like crazy, and narked on all the other actors, as he ate that stuff up. Toxic and its really screwed the show over in the long run .

That was a huge part of it, but I also think Zimmer had the mindset of "This is how the industry works, babe, learn to deal with it. I had to get through it, you do too." And as discussed, Zimmer does tend to like and respect men more, so she could think, "Oh, its just a guy thing, tell him to go to hell" and not think through the implications that while she could tell people to go to hell, a younger/less established actress could not. Not saying her view was right.

Agreed, but it just seems that there was an understanding or contract that Maeve would return after her break (I think it was a hip replacement???) You could tell that Rauch was not invested in Van or her pairing even before the Mattessas went wacko over the "no bedroom sex scene." Also she was older and he was older, so there was that element.

I think they got along fine, but were totally different. Maeve was a "working actress" and was not tied up in being a star. Kimmer had an ego and a work ethic and insatiable need for attention to go along with it (I always wonder how families deal with an individual like that) and Maeve, just wanted to do good work and writer her poetry. I think Maeve may have resented that with the arrival of Reva and Alex she lost a lot of story, but I don't think she held it against the actresses. Regarding Rauch, she was going to sue for sexual harrassement, PG then made the move of Maeve to GL. I think she had an agreement to come back to GL in 97 or neither of them would have probably agreed to it. Kimmer loved Rauch cause he kissed her ass and made her the end all of GL, and well, its not like he was going to sexually harrass ES on OLTL, even if she was not a woman who would have burned his a** on that!