Planet Soap

Bad moves by well well-regarded writers: Who wrote the Viki Sloan affair on OLTL? Michael Malone? I didn't like that Viki betrayed Clint who stood by her through all the Niki drama. Correct me if I'm wrong, but didn't Viki know Sloan was dying before their sexual affair? Why betray your husband and marry a dying man, only to end up alone in the end? I could excuse the affair plot if Clint hadn't been back burnered t until Jerry Ver Dorn assumed the role. It kind of reminds me of how GH's Tony Jones was back burnered after the Carly affair. Good points.

Yikes. Once again, the YouTube comment section under classic videos proves its not a total barometer of soap fans perception. Everyone seems to adore that couple there. Regardless, The scenes of Nikki trying to frame Natalie into thinking she had DID were a little silly.

Did we not like Ben lol?

I think Malone was a good writer (in his first run) and I enjoyed the '95 DID story. I get that the writers wanted to make the origin of Viki's disease more medically accurate. I agree however, with your frustration about the destruction of Victor Lord Sr, and the retcon of Dorian's role in his murder. What was even more stupid was Victor being alive in 2003. Did Maline write that? Then the seed of doubt in 2008 with Dorian questioning if that was Victor in '03? How many times can you rewrite history. Agreed. Nikki pushing Ben out of a window and gaslighting Natalie was dumb. Agreed. Killing Rex was dumb. I never understood why Kate kept pining after Philip with little mention of Rex, even though Rex's significantly better husband. Speaking of the questionable racial dynamics between Jill and Mamie, I think this is the latest clip I've ever seen of Marguerite Ray. I presume this is when John had yet another medical episode, This time from Victor taking over his company.

I have been fascinated by Vanessa Prentiss after learning about her from during the 1980 episode that aired during covid repeats. In the bad moves by well regarded writers thread, The racial dynamic between Jill and Mamie was heavily discussed.This is the latest clip I've seen of her original actress Marguerite Ray. I presume this is after John had the (stroke?) when Victor took over Jabot?

Brooke/Decon was great stuff! One of my favorite storylines in the show's history, and 2002 Mark the last decent quality year for B&B. I always wondered why Y&R seemed particularly good from about '88 to '01 Now I realize that lines up with Ed Scott's tenure on the show. Good move by bad writer/EP: GH, The Metro Court Hostage Crisis. I'm not sure if goza wrote this, but it happened under the 10 year of Jill Farren Phelps, One of the greatest action storylines in soap history. Inspired by 24, it was riveting, and scary. Of course the bad writer (or EP) showed their head again by killing off Alan.

Based solely on looks, Nina Arvesen could have replaced Brenda Epperson as Ashley instead of Sherry Shattuck. Arveson eerily resembles Nicole Brown Simpson.

Yikes. I meant to type "(under Ron Carlivati?)" Wasn't sure if he was the one one who wrote it but thank you for giving me the answer.

I can see that. From the 90s Malone days onward Nikki Smith became more of a cartoon, especially in 2001 under Gary Tomlin. I never understood what Nikki Smith's actual motivation was after the '90s. I know some of you loath it but I liked the Tess story (under Con Carlivati). Tess had an actual motivation, sperate love in Nash and stuff to do other than being a random cartoon who wanted to live free. Bad move by (William J Bell?) killing Cassie. So much storyline and Bill was invested in this child only for her to get killed off in a storyline that did not advance the show in any way. I'm glad that she was brought back as Mariah as stupid as that story was.

It is amazing how Erica Kane when from the star of the show --she literally had the biggest picture in the photo album openings-- to a diminished character after (correct me if I'm wrong) 2000? Why would this show do this? Some say it's because she got old. Similarly, Viki stopped being the center of OLTL after her DID story ended in 1996. But (again, correct me if I'm wrong) I feel like Viki was still more centralized than Erica. Agreed. She's an iconic character and I don't care to see the show without her.

Agreed. Luke raped Laura. It was wrong. They should have never wrote that in the plot to begin with. But since they did, the only answer was to acknowledge that the rape happened, and after working through things Laura decided to forgive Luke. Simplest way. Any attempt to try to reframe it as a seduction, or retcon history is wrong. When exactly did they start trying to call it a seduction? From scenes I've watched it was always acknowledged as a rape. Does anyone have a scene they can share? Interesting, I never thought of Rick/Blade as the andwer to posessed Marlena. I'm more think of Vicki's DID and her acting evil and out of character was a more direct comparison. 1995, what a year for divas going off the edge! Erica Kane on drugs, Marlena possessed, Viki had DID! As demeaning as sperm gate was for the leading women of Y&R it was well crafted. It spanned from 1999-2004, soaps today cannot write long-term overarching plots effectively. And the trigger for the whole thing was Victor divorcing Diane to be with Nikki after the Veronica shooting. Amazing.

I agree. Or they have avoided the whole scenario to begin with. Again Luke and Laura should have happened, the rape should NOT have. Were they thinking because L&L had feelings for each other the audience would have accepted this more than a woman falling in love with a random rapist off the street??? IDK.

I think her actual name was Mamie. Another poster stated that she was named after Bell's housekeeper. White people such as First Lady Mamie Eisenhower also had the nickname Mamie as her real name was Mary. Regardless naming a black person Mamie is a no-go because of its similarity to "mammy". Jill's abuse to Mamie felt racist, but in all fairness she was just as abusive to Esther. Even Katherine spoke to Esther like a child.

Exactly! One thing I liked about old school Y&R is that even if the substance wasn't hot, the decoration was so it distracted you from that. I see teases that Jordan and Ian Ward will have some scenes together. I didn't care for Ian's character at all, but I'm curious to see what he can do in tandem with Jordan. I'd especially like to see those two veterans acting together.

Wow! Good observation. They really didn't give Erica a child (that made it to term) until 18 years into her run! Very problematic. I liked when Veronica Redd took over. She gave the character more backbone especially against Jill. Yeah. Brad took over by 1996, that story aired in 2001.

Ultimately I think the expansion to 30 minutes was damaging to the genre. The fact that Another World agreed to be a 90-minute scripted series 5 days a week is insane. I like 30 minutes because there's less filler in an episode, it keeps you from having to expand the cast massively to fill the hour, and the writers only have to pen out half the dialogue.

But I question where GH would be today without Luke and Laura. I think the rape should not have happened, but the pairing should have. It amazes me how badly Genie is treated despite being one of the most popular actresses in Daytime. Why was there so little regard by Monty and other regimes for the person who helped define supercouples and soar GH into pop culture? Tony was not the whole show. The AJ paternity and Heather Webber stories helped elevate GH as well. At least today Laura finally has somewhat of a matriarch status.

We all revere scribes like Agnes Nixon, Bill Bell, Douglas Marland and Irna Phillips, and Executive Producers like Gloria Monty. Are there any story lines, tropes, or actions that they took that you did not like??

Victor Newman lived at the ranch until his divorce from Nikki? He lived in the Penthouse in the 90s during his marriages to Ashley, Hope and Diane. He then moved back into the ranch sometime between Joshua Landers' murder and around his and Nikki's 2002 remarriage. Loved the Penthouse set! Has Nikki ever not lived at the Ranch since she first wed Victor? What a way for Jack to stick it to Victor! Sleeping with his ex wife in presumably the same bedroom Victor had and raising Victor's kid in his house!

Wow! I never paid attention to the weekends thing!

I agree with NLG's decision but I also find her constant political commentary and virtue signaling to be irritating.

Agreed. Building off of what you said, I find GH, as bad as it is, to be easier to sit through than Y&R (or B&B). Things actually happen on GH, and we get storyline variety. I like that stories aren't just romance and corporate like Y&R. We get mob, medical, business, spy, police, and syfy all in one soap lol. Too bad its just bad it's written with too many characters.

IMO, Brooke should be remorseful for sleeping with Bill, Deacon, Nick and Hope's boyfriend because they were in relationships with her family members. In those specific instances, being proud in a Samantha Jones way would complicate the children always forgiving her trope. Last I can recall was Brooke sleeping with Bill while he was married to her sister Katie...then getting pregnant at 50, trying to pass Eric (her "true love's" dad) off as the father, then miscarrying.

??? I never meant to imply that I had to explain to you what the Guza era of GH did. I was actually agreeing with most of what you said. I tagged your comment not to explain to you what happened with GH back then, but to piggyback off of what you said.

Yup! Once I saw Guza and Ron Carlivati listed I went ... Uh oh! Hopefully JFP doesn't touch this show. And hopefully BTG is nothing like the current CBS soaps' quality. Guza helped destroy GH, and eroded characters like Luke. Yes GH temporarily got its life back around the 50th anniversary under Ron and Frank, but it's remained crappy since 2015ish. Poorly crafted storylines, overloaded cast, harshly bright lighting, lightning paced scenes and stunt casting. I enjoyed Guza/Phelps GH growing up, but grew to dislike it after watching Riche's GH. Now after years of Valentini I like Guza/Phelps' era again, lol. It was better written, acted and more exciting. I wish network executives could look at message boards like these filled with analytical soap critics, before making writer and storyline decisions. Instead they appear to rely on easily impressed fandoms that will accept anything, as a barometer of show quality....not to sound snobby.