DramatistDreamer

I never had any preconceived notions about Henry's sexuality, tbh.  Hey, I'd lived in NYC and knew guys who were heterosexual, metrosexual, bi-sexual and polyamorous.  In the arts, I'd realized that identity was not as cut and dried as others made it.  I was open to see different aspects of masculinity from the ones that had been dramatized on T.V. in the past.  The problem for me with how Henry was written was that he was all over the place. No consistency, nothing to really hold onto.  He was written as a utilitarian character and the problem was when they tried to write him into a kind of leading man.  This didn't work for me.

I thought that Henry had a kind of chemistry with Katie (early on) and Vienna.  I don't know why but I didn't get much of that with his pairing with Barbara.  To me, it seemed a bit contrived and the Henry as Stenbeck's son bit seemed to be yet another attempt to tie these two characters together somehow by happenstance. 

Maybe the problems started for me when the show decided to parade TD around as his female cousin.  I really couldn't take the Henry character seriously as anyone's love interest or ideal after that. 

Maybe I'm just too picky and I know it's a soap but ATWT had always been more grounded in its storylines  and how it wrote it's characterizations(it wasn't Passions, a soap I tried to watch and knew it wasn't for me) and in the last several years, it appeared to have become completely unmoored in how characters and storylines were written.

Audiences can accept new directions for a character or a storyline if it is grounded in logic.  Even in the worlds of science fiction, the characters and stories must be grounded in some type of logic.  In other words, there are "rules".  To me, it just seemed as if logic went completely out the window within the last decade of the show.  Characterizations went bats*t crazy and very little was grounded in actual logic.

Call me old school, I care not, but to me, from a Aristotelian dramatic prospective, the storylines were just not well-written.  They lacked depth, consistency, cohesion and were mostly unmoored from logic.  I'd loved to hear an opposing perspective that specifically addresses how any of these specific storylines and characterizations in the last several years were well written.  Or even defensible.

8 minutes ago, DRW50 said:

The sad thing is by Barbara standards I don't even feel like it was a huge comedown - she had more than her share of questionable or bland pairings and periods (Brian, John, Gavin) before even getting into what Sheffer did to her.

 

Now that was stupid. Absolute garbage. 

Yeah, I was comparing the past overall, not just Barbara's pairings.  I think CZ is a real trooper and I'm not saying her opinion is invalid but but I'm not sure why people are giving an actor's opinions ultimate sway on what makes a story great.  They don't write the story. 

Havin Gunnar return to announce that he slayed James once and for all would alone, have made a return worth it.  Also, if it could happen right before Barbara was set to walk down the aisle with Henry, you generate some intrigue.  Henry and Barbara's disco twirl just didn't do it for me, in terms of interest. 

She is beautiful, I've seen their wedding pictures as well as several of her appearances at his matches.  The camera definitely loves her!

No offense, but from what I've gleaned of most soap actors, they don't really care about service the overall narrative of the show.  They want big drama or big fun, lots of lines and screentime for their characters.  It may be good for them but it's often fatal for the shows that they're on.  ATWT in it's last years is one such cautionary tale.

Babs and Henry were pushed as this exciting couple and no doubt there were aspects that CZ loved, like the younger man dumping the beautiful young woman (Vienna) for the older women and the ode to Dancing With the Stars but had Benjamin Henrickson still been alive, there is no writer worth her salt who would prefer Henry and Barbara to Barbara and Hal. 

The show didn't have a lot of options for pairings at that point and the show didn't have a lot of options for much surprises either-- Henry and Barbara offered a compromise solution to both those issues.  CZ is talented enough to sell it and TD can be serviceable, at times, so the show took one of the few options they had left to offer the 'happy ending' option.  Let's face it though, compared to what the show had been able to accomplish in the past, this compromise pairing was a comedown.

Vienna could be annoying, at times but she had usually had some vitality to her character.  That was all stripped away in order to make Barbara and Henry serviceable.

As a writer, this option definitely would not have been my choice.

3 minutes ago, P.J. said:

I was more annoyed they made Henry James' illegitimate son, tbh. 

That was also so stupid!

Both parts of the Korean peninsula seem to be making the most progress of all of these summit meetings.

Two Koreas agree on family reunion in August #nhk_world_news https://t.co/OthRbakkzl

— NHK WORLD News (@NHKWORLD_News) June 22, 2018

1 hour ago, DRW50 said:

 

He actually said that? No wonder the writing for her was so suffocating.

 

I would have wanted a bang for Barbara too, but compared to the way she and the other vets were showcased (or not showcased), I was pleased enough. If Hal had still been alive (Benjamin Hendrickson too of course) I would have wanted them back together.

 

I haven't really seen a lot of Barbara and Gunnar together so I can't judge their relationship.

The good thing about the Gunnar character is that he basically disappeared with the assumption that he later died.  There was no jumping out of airplanes or something that the viewer would have to suspend disbelief to make his return plausible because no one ever truly found out what happened to him.  Any good writer worth her salt could make it happen, especially is the groundwork is laid (without a reveal) at least a good nine months before his return. 

And written well and effectively, the payoff of having Gunnar declare that after discovering James' role in his circumstances (and having a final confrontation with James where Gunnar ultimately 'puts down' James for good), he rid everyone (especially Barbara) of the menace (the irony would be that she informs Gunnar that she hasn't been afraid of James for years as she's no longer the frightened woman she used to be).

Sadly. Benjamin Hendrickson died years before the show's end, so I would not have recast Hal.  The part of the story where everyone mourned his loss- I would not touch that in any re-writing of the show's final years.  There are plenty of other things about the show that I would absolutely have written away but this wouldn't be one of those things.

Although, I usually dislike the concept of a 'Sliding Doors' storytelling device where you have an alternative reality, if I had the chance, I would apply some variation of it to go back in time in the show's timeline and re-write some things out of existence.  Some of the stories in the last decade were so atrocious and contrived that it could be done quite seamlessly, if done carefully.

58 minutes ago, Soapsuds said:

I saw that and was going to ask a question but passed...LOL. His character wasn't my favorite and I still hate that he ended up with Babs.

OMG, yes to this!  I've been rewriting/undoing so many ATWT storylines in my mind and this is one of them.  I would've have written them as not making it to the altar--I would have written an alive Gunnar show up, reminiscent of when Duncan showed up at Shannon's wedding to Brian McColl.  Gunnar could say "Hello Barbara" similar to how James said it when he showed up from "the dead".

1 hour ago, Soapsuds said:

I asked/talked to Roger about it and here's what he told me:

 

Music rights was a driving factor behind the DVD effort being scrapped at the time. I have worked with the company since all that on some other projects related to digitizing the P&G archive but there was no discussion of releasing DVDs, just digitizing for the sake of ensuring the history was preserved.

 

When the DVD project ended, multiple record companies were really scrutinizing use of their music in many areas because record sales were down and they wanted $$. P&G didn't have great records, not only of old actor contracts but contracts that supposedly gave them the rights to music, even for the one day use at the time. Music

before the late 90s was embedded on the same track as the character audio so there was no extracting it out and replacing it. So several of the episodes I wanted to use were never going to work (Roger Thorpe "Enough is Enough" Hall of Mirrors, for example). I did my best to capture the characters and stories people wanted to see,

while not always being able to choose the exact episode that many of us probably would have preferred.

 

The current regime at P&G has been open to preserving history, and understanding how important their shows were to people and how they chronicled parts of America over time. But the last I heard, which was fairly recently, they still weren't interested in another DVD project. They are so far away from having the archive digitized, but my hope is that one day the process will be completed and episodes can be available on sites like Amazon for purchase.

There are several episodes of ATWT from the 80s that having singing (Lyla for example) but not tracks by recording artists.  If you group some of the episodes by some of the big storylines like the Tad Channing murder mystery, I don't remember much music by popular recording artists being used during those episodes.

There are a good number of episodes from '86 and '87 that use muted instrumental music in the music (e.g. an organ instrumental version of Billy Ocean's Suddenly with no vocals at all). 

I think 1988 would be a huge problem in terms of recorded music because there are scenes in Lisa's club, The Cellar where you can hear a lot of very popular music blaring in certain scenes.  1988 was a writer's strike year, so I would be willing to forgo that year, LOL.

I understand how that episode from GL would be a problem because the music is threaded all through the scene and it is LOUD!

It may come down to being able to sort through episodes and that would take a LOT of manpower.  Years ago, I also communicated with Roger Newcomb through the WLS blog and at that time, it sounded as if they had a small band of people working on the project.  It sounded difficult to sustain.

This may not be comparable but it sounds like they need experts, like the people who do film restoration and again, I'm not sure how much value PGP really places on these soaps to bring in digital experts and film restoration people.

UCLA is a film school but having attended a famous art school on the East Coast (that also had a film school) you'd be surprised how academic institutions can allow certain items to sit and rot unless there is some deep-pocketed alumni steps in and renovate and refurbish. The school will spend its resources to maintain more 'high priority' areas  and neglect other areas unless some group raises the issue.  UCLA may not know/care about what they regard as some canceled soaps and game shows vs. some early films by John Cassevettes, for example.

Definitely not a "Be Best" moment.

boarding the plane this morning, @FLOTUS wore a @ZARA jacket, olive military style -- but it was printed on the back with the phrase "I don't really care. Do U?" An unfortunate sartorial decision ...

— Kate Bennett (@KateBennett_DC) June 21, 2018

Someone in that Trump cabal is being honest for once.  I definitely believe that Melania simply doesn't care.

Congress can be wishy-washy but at least there's Mueller and this man-

We are now representing whistleblowers within ICE, outside contractors, etc. They have reached out to us to provide us with info as to what is really going on. We are going to blow this wide open and take the info to the American people so they can decide what happens next.

— Michael Avenatti (@MichaelAvenatti) June 21, 2018

It's a shame that more people don't watch PBS.  The NewsHour is really the only TV news that I watch, (otherwise I just read the news). 

The NewsHour would be the type of program that goes in-depth, spends at least 10 minutes on a story in a town or small city to see the socio-economic and cultural factors when weighing them against the local politics.  Then they would revisit the town or city later on for a follow-up. 

I can't abide by most network & cable news that only seem to operate within soundbytes.

9 hours ago, All My Shadows said:

Roger Newcomb of We Love Soaps used to post here frequently and was heavily involved in the production of the DVDs. There was a separate thread for discussion of the releases, but I can’t renember if he ever shared why they stopped.

I remember those times. 

Even though he offered some details on the challenges of digitization, he was pretty vague on other details, perhaps he didn't know much about the particulars of the other aspects. 

Those two guys are likely to have more information, especially the specific aspects of dealing with PGP, as well as building the streaming platform.

10 hours ago, SoapDope said:

Someone needs to contact them and point them in the direction of the UCLA  film library and get those 1971 & 1973 shows on DVD. 

Who would that be though?  Actually, IMO, one person wouldn't be effective.  It would have to be a sustained team effort, supported by multitudes.

Although, if I were an alumni of UCLA and a ATWT fan or a fan who lived in the vicinity of UCLA, I would certainly try to pay a visit to the archives and ask the archivist what is being done (or not) to preserve/restore these videos.

I used to work with the New York Public Library for the Performing Arts and had to deal with people wanting access to the archives. 

There is usually a permission request process, an acceptance (we rarely rejected written/oral requests), then a date and time is set to go on-site to view the archives.

If there is a fan near the UCLA film library or an alumni/fan, I would suggest they start there.  Even better if a team takes this on, as it would seem to be a lot for one person.

I may have to duck and hide for saying this but I don't think the effort to save ATWT/GL was nearly as cohesive as the one to try to save AMC/OLTL.  Okay, I'll run and hide now, lol.

Another similarity between Bibi Netanyahu and Trump has been that it appears that others around them will fall before they do.

Israeli prosecutors charge Sara Netanyahu, the prime minister's wife, with a series of crimes including fraud and breach of trust. https://t.co/tV9TGvdlBm

— The Associated Press (@AP) June 21, 2018

There's been a lot posted lately, so I'm not sure whether this has been posted.

ICE Spokesman Resigns, Saying He Could No Longer Spread Falsehoods for Trump Administration

For all the public murmurings about people wanting the show back (or some part of the show/episodes), I honestly doubt that anyone really wants to launch a concerted effort to try to get more episodes issued and no wonder because it seems so daunting.

A quick search and I encountered some information on the company that SoapClassics worked with for digitization of the videos. 

I may be wrong but two men, Mark Yates and Richard Keatinge seemed to be the ones in charge of the SoapClassics/Broadway Video Digital media effort.  I think one of them (perhaps both) are on LinkedIn but I don't think either one is still with B'way Video Digital anymore. 

I'm sort of curious as to how they did it (work out an agreement w/ P&G to allow them to distribute the DVD sets) and why they were unable to continue digitizing more videos.

Were there ever any podcasts interviews with these guys?  Surely, someone in the vaunted soap media must've had these guys as guests on their podcast, right?

WSJ scoop: Federal authorities have subpoenaed the publisher of the National Enquirer for records related to its $150K payment to a former Playboy model for the rights to her story alleging an affair w/Trump, as part of the broader Cohen investigation.https://t.co/JDNfaPhg1M

— Rebecca Ballhaus (@rebeccaballhaus) June 20, 2018

12 hours ago, DRW50 said:

Big upset in Miami-Dade, giving Democrats control of the county board of commissioners.

 

http://www.miamiherald.com/news/politics-government/election/article213376864.html

It's about time, Florida but I'll truly be impressed when Rubio gets tossed out for someone with a heart, conscience and a spine.

There should be a picture of Nielsen in the dictionary by the definition of oblivious.  Who goes to a Mexican restaurant after trying to 'sell' the notion of forced separation of families only to send children from Central American countries to internment camps?

If she had gone to a Mexican-American owned restaurant, surely they would've spit in her food.

Part one of a video of @mdc_dsa @DC_IWW and others shouting DHS Secretary Nielsen out of a restaurant. She doesn’t need to be kidnapping #immigrantchildren to deserve this treatment. Don’t give the regime a moment of rest. #KeepFamilesTogether pic.twitter.com/B3RfraOk1E

— Smash Racism DC (@SmashRacismDC) June 20, 2018

This is hilarious.  

the side by side of Blue during this interlude is so funny. sis was embarrassed! pic.twitter.com/VsJZJkmR2Y

— julia (@letitbeglorious) June 19, 2018

Lest we forget, what has been going on in Italy over the last several years in regards to the open hostility shown to migrants and ethnic minorities, is as bad as ever, if not worse.

Italian Minister Moves to Count and Expel Roma, Drawing Outrage

Now that there will be a vacancy on the UN Human Rights Council, apparently Russia wants a chair.  You cannot make this stuff up.

White House deputy Chief of Staff Joe Hagin has ties to a sex cult??!  Apparently his resignation comes on the heels of a BuzzFeed story that reported this.

You Tube doesn't even have episodes from half of the Toms uploaded on the site.

With #TrumpTariffs market selloff, the Dow has wiped out all its gains in 2018. https://t.co/TjSKtYUvbq pic.twitter.com/SnG7NhrLpg

— Jim Roberts (@nycjim) June 19, 2018

Okay, this is not meant to be funny but...

Good start to the afternoon at the Queen's Club. Locked in a completely enclosed and sweltering toilet for 10 minutes. Thanks to the staff who came to my rescue...

— Stuart Fraser (@stu_fraser) June 19, 2018

Somehow I doubt the Breitbarts and the Daily Callers of the world would be circulating this news item.