Soaplovers

Calling it now, Lizzie is going to be Trashra target if she's gorgeous because she clearly has youth and money on her side.

Lizzie is a former Miss teen Kentucky and Miss Kentucky that competed on both Miss Teen USA and Miss USA. She didn't win, but I've seem pictures of her and she's an attractive plus wasn't a blonde! Plus, she has a degree in Fashion Merchandise and Business.

I had a friend who majored in that and she said it was harder then she would have ever imagined.

I bet they only have two housewives added. I really think Lydia's decision to quit was last minute. It's telling that the show didn't call Gretchen or Alexis to come back so I bet both had burned their bridges with the show.

I think the Dobson's tied Sheila to either Steve or Nick Andropoulis.. but I do think she didn't last too long.

I think Faye would double the toxic levels of the show. I'd rather both her and Brandi had been gotten rid of and the show focus less on manufactured fights and more on organic interactions.

The reason the Dinner Party from Hell, Scary Island, and theresa's table flip were successful was because those things were not manufactured.

As long as Gretchen/Slade stay far away from the RHOC, all is right in the world Still a shame that Lydia quit, she got some good zingers in on Heather.. makes me wish she'd get a few in toward Tamra

Didn't Sheffer have Carolyn Culliton as a co-head-writer his first year or so? That could explain why it was pretty decent

Thanks. I don't like when the casts stay exactly the same. I like when at least one new lady is added to the mix, even if it is just a friend. It helps change the dynamics and keeps things from getting stale and repetitive

I totally agree... I was fearful in season 8 of OC when Alexis was bought back last minute that it would be the same vibe with the same 5 women (i.e Tamra/Gretchen/Heather bullying Alexis with Vicki mooning over Brooks). I think the producers realized that as filming started and added Lydia to the mix. Lydia and her honest retorts were refreshing while her mother Judy was a delightful Tinker Bell Hippie Plus, she did help broker truces between Heather/Alexis and Tamra/Alexis... while finally telling Slade that he was d bag and calling Gretchen a malibu barbie LOL What surprised me was that Tamra and Vicki didn't bully Lydia because she was the new girl like they did with Gretchen, Lynne, Alexis, and Peggy to a lesser extent.

Atlanta kept the same cast, yet new things have been happening to most of them so there wasn't a need to change up. Though I think I would have changed out Kenya with someone new if a cast change was needed. I think season 6 should be Porsha's final season though I'm intrigued with the dynamic that she has with her mother. It's like she was coddled and sheltered by her mother and she ended up marrying someone that did the same thing... just in a more controlling manner. Now that she is divorcing, she has returned to her mother instead of truly striking out on her own. Like Kandi's story this season, Nene's story, and even Cynthia's story.

Btw, do you guys notice that the new season's have had more focus on the housewives within their own families and less in big group settings? I know RHOBH have had two episodes in a row, and I like that better then all the catty big group gatherings.

I think Bravo did add one new woman when there were contract issues with the women. I don't think Luann officially came back on until filming had been going on for like a month or so. Not sure if the new woman will be an official cast member, or a friend. we shall see.

I didn't realize how matronly Ellen was back then, I think the 80s was much better fashion wise for Nancy and Ellen, imho.

When Frank left in September 1981, Jill and Faith became involved in the search for the tomb of Merit Khara (which I probably butchered) involving Spencer Smith and Aristotle Benedict-White. Spencer hired Jill to track down Ari, who was some recluse Egyptologist, in order to offer Ari a job. I believe Spencer knew he was dying and wanted Ari to maintain his legacy. Also, Ari was obsessed with Merhit Khara and Spencer had the tomb in his possession, but didn't want it to be disturbed until after his death or some nonsense like that. Anyway, Ari moved to New York and romanced both the Coleridge sisters, which followed the legend of Merit Khara. This is where the SoapNet episodes ended.

Originally, the Merit Khara story was suppose to play with Frank Ryan in the role of Ari Benedict-White, which is a bit ironic as Gordon Thompson had been hired to play Frank Ryan in the late 1970s but was unable to get working papers.

Carl posted some summaries of 1982 on page 15. Jill is listed mainly as the go-to legal representative. With the return of Kim and Arley, Jill represented Seneca legally when he went after custody of Arley.

When it comes to Frank and Jill, it is important to remember that they were not originally endgame; Frank was suppose to die. In the early episodes, it was mentioned that Jack was a former lover of Jill Coleridge's, but that was a relationship that the show never really played. It's a shame they never had a Mary/Jack/Jill/Frank quad because that would have been glorious. I was never overly fond of Seneca and Jill, but I did love Seneca's role in Nell's final days. Nell's death was probably my favorite storyline in those early episodes.

I had a feeling Jill was just a legal go to throughout most of 1982, but I did fine a summary that Hollis Kirkland was flirting with Jill when he first came to town and wasn't sure if anything was pursued with that. Given how Rae was a spoiler for Jill and Frank, I figured that the show would have Jill be a spoiler for Rae and Hollis... plus add the whole Kim/Arley/Seneca custody fight.. and that would have been a good story to play out in 1982... oh well.

The writer's inability to let the characters evolve and be stuck in a hamster wheel was the first undoing of the show. When Frank was gone from the fall of 1981 till early 1983, did Jill do anything or was she just the friendly go-to?

New OC housewife?

http://www.eonline.com/news/486446/meet-the-new-star-of-real-housewives-of-orange-county

Bless Tamra's big mouth LOL Nice to know she can't keep her mouth shut in person nor on the internet. In this case, I think it's a good thing since Bravo won't say anything.

I think Joyce stated in her blog that she was repeating herself numerous times because she thinks the thoughts in spanish and works to translate them into english when talking.. so she says a point over and over until someone says they understand. She stated looking back she wishes she hadn't stated her point so many times.

While I think Wheeler had passion and wanted to make GL a great product, she didn't have the right instincts to make it happen. It was as if they saw Springfield as some small little town in the mid-west, when it was always established as a decent sized small city. What's funny is that there are some decent suburbs in the Chicago land area with tall buildings, malls, and businesses that could have been used as a model for Springfield (such as Oakbrook/Oakbrook Terrace, Schaumburg, etc).

I know on UK soaps that the EP has story power/vision and that the writers have to utilize that vision, but I always figured up till the late 90s that US soaps had the writers determine the overall story with the EP making sure that the story/ideas fit within budget plus running the financial aspect of the shows.

It seems like ATWT and GL, in the last years of their show, put more of the power for story in the EP's hands instead of the writers. From what I understand, Jill Lorie Hurst was pretty decent but it seemed like Wheeler had final say on all stories.. true? false?

I think the issues come down to writer and show compatiablity. The Dobson's fit better on GL then they did at ATWT. I think P & G had the mistaken impression that GL and ATWT were similiar shows and they weren't.

Marland's writing was different at GL then at ATWT.

What was Marland's greatest strength could also be viewed as a weakness as well. He could balance out several stories at the same time and going at different paces as well.. but if he left a show suddenly, things always fell apart since he created very complex and intricate story threads that very few could carry on if he jumped ship without warning. At GL, he abruptly quit and the show struggled to finish out his complex stories with two different writing teams before they settled on Pam Long.. who promptly started tying up his stories while introducing her stories.

In ATWT's case, Marland suddenly died during routine surgery when stories were in mid-steam.. and his successors couldn't maintain his style.. even though there was an attempt to do so for two to three years.

As I stated before, I think P & G should have done a writer swap in late 1989/1990... and put Marland over at AW (who had a very interesting vibe that I think Marland could have written... he would have had a ball writing for Iris)..maybe put Pam Long at ATWT (she seemed to love community and family.. plus she was good at writing male characters)..

Season 1 of BH was perfection, and season 2 even had some fantastic moments as well. I do admit there seems to be a void where Camille should be.. I certainly know she would have had some interesting views on Carlton LOL.

It seems that is the case. I can't see the Dobson's bringing back a character so immersed in the Hughes family and the whole Nancy and Chris and Grant talking about SF is a total Marland, "Something is coming up," thing. Knowing him I think he probably would have had Nancy see Joyce in a crowd for a second and then dismissing it and Joyce following them around town and back to Oakdale.

An interesting time in ATWT, and really makes me not like the Dobson's any better. There was a lot of potential at this time in updating the show but keeping the core and the Dobson's screwed it all up.

According to a montly summary from December 1979 (when the switch happened).. Joyce was seeking therapy, wrapping christmas gifts for teddy then sent them to Don and Mary.. freaking Mary out, who suspected it was Joyce.

I can't totally dislike the Dobsons, they created James Stenbeck.. plus paired up Tom and Margo.

LOL on those clips again...a LOT of talking and not much happening. I would love to see the credits but it seems so Marland with the people walking in and out and all the phone calls about "dinner," and who is coming. The only thing is I keep expecting them to say, "Where will we go for dinner...I don't know, maybe the Mona Lisa?" Love John slyly bugging Bob, and Kim's total blow off and annoyance with him.

Are they setting up the return of Joyce with Nancy and Chris going to San Francisco, because they keep making a point of saying San Fran over and over again, and with Grant saying, "I use to live there." Was it Marland's idea to bring back Joyce and the Dobson's kept going with it? It seems they werent interested in Don and Mary and completely ignored Nancy and Chris' involvement later on.

I believe that Marland's brief stint went from August/September 1979 till December 1979. So all of the clips being shown were during Marland's brief stint.

From watching the clips, Betsy looked to be positioned as the main teen character. Suzanne Davidson's Betsy reminds me a lot of Lucy Deakin's Lily in the scenes shown. There was one clip of Dee and Betsy having a heart to heart, and I could have envisioned Sierra and Lily having that same talk years later.

It seems to me that Joyce coming back from the dead was in the works so I'm not sure if it was a Marland idea that the Dobson's carried on or not.

For UK soaps, does the EP or the head-writer decide on story content? From reading this message board, it looks as if the EP seems to decide on the story content.

From viewing several months of episodes, I actually think the cast is too large and some paring down is needed. Of course, I'm just an American caught up in the US mindset of downsizing LOL

That's weird - my mother was a fan of hers too. She barely watched ATWT during that time (she was busy) but she would recognize Maggie when she saw photos of her and when she started watching some of the old episodes again she told me she always liked Maggie.

Never really knew why the character ceased to exist after 1985.

I asked my mom last year her thoughts of the show from the late 70s through mid-80s since she was in her 20s at that time, target audience.

Her fav characters were Maggie, Diana McColl, Lisa, Joyce, Natalie (Judith Chapman version), Kim, Tom, Barbara and Bob.

She was bothered when Chris and Nancy were written out while she liked Betsy once Lindsay Frost started playing her. Plus, she thought Mr Big was a stupid story LOL

I always assumed Maggie was a popular character on the show. I know that she was my mom's favorite character during the early 80s.

The new cd is under-whelming to me. It seems like she is in a holding pattern in terms of her artistic pursuits. I thought that 'The Fame' and 'The Fame monster' were great companion cds, but both Born this Way and Artpop seem like rough drafts that were turned in without being edited and proof-read, imho

During Marland's brief stint as head-writer in 1979, does it appear as if Betsy would have been his 'Lily' character had he remained long-term? Plus, I wonder what kind of poor family he would have introduced onto the show in 1979.. and if he would have displaced the Stewart family.

Which producer opted to bring back Liz as the Rover owner again? I think that was a step in the right direction.

A strength of the show is the large canvas of characters that are constantly rotating in and out of the front burner, which I wish US soaps would take note of.

At the same time, the large canvas of characters is also a weakness because i think some characters could be cut and not hurt the overall fabric of the show. I know Stella, Tina, and Stella's mother is leaving.. but what other characters do you think should be cut? I think that annoying red headed girl Fiz (sp?) should be cut.

Plus, I missed some weeks.. but why is the whole family mad at David when his wife Kylie cheated on him with his half-brother? I missed a crucial plot point.. does it have something to do with the car accident?

I agree that one of the strengths of the RH of Orange County was the constant revolving door of housewives. I think viewers will embrace the overhaul especially if it brings two or three new housewives especially if they are snarky and can cut Tamra/Vicki/Heather down to size.

Still bummed Lydia quit cause I think she had some snarky one liners, but I'm hoping for some new blood and some occasional visits from lauri or jeana.

So for long-term viewers, has the show been slowly going back to the show it once was.. or is there still more work to be done?

I've read some other board that has said Eileen's son Todd isn't acting like he used to act, that he is acting out of character... is that true?