Soaplovers

I have to think that Andre/Ashley is just something the writers are keeping simmering on the backburner as a way to continue Derek's slow descent to the dark side... while Andres true story will now be his new marriage/dynamic with Dani, plus whatever secret he's hiding in his past. Is there anything you all think might have been tweaked/changed due to audience response... or is the show filmed/written so far ahead that such corrections aren't a thing anymore. I have to think that Andre/Ashley was so heavily built up, and then quickly changed to Ashley going back to Derek and Andre/Dani getting married. Plus, I think the Hayley's true persona was always to come out, but I think they realized that they didn't leave enough clues hence that one episode where the whole thing was explained. And I'm noticing more Vanessa/Dani friendship scenes as well as more Hayley/Caroline scenes (which truthfully should have been more of a thing because the shift in how Hayley really views Caroline would have had more impact)

The only time I was ever invested in Ashley was during her part in the Hayley story.. and naturally the show had to ruin it by involving buzz kill Naomi, who basically stopped the Ashley being on to Hayley thread by stupidly believing Hayley's tall tale. Right now, I think Derek is veering into grey territory because he is probably keeping his progress a secret until he's sure he can walk... but I have a feeling that once he realizes Ashley is only with him due to not being able to walk, the motivation will shift.... only thing is that Derek would need to keep Jacob quiet. Hayley mentioned previously that Joey was almost her mark and that she knows about the whole murder situation due to cousin Randy and probably eavesdropping on conversations... so I have a feeling that Hayley/Joey will eventually cross paths. Since Joey has had good rapport with Vanessa, Bill, Dani, SPS, and Nicole... I am interested to see his rapport with Hayley (if the two cross paths).

I believe that Empire Valley was supposed to be 'the community of the future/tomorrow'... where it was supposed to be vast and environmentally green housing development... and I think whatever story was supposed to be originally done was never made clear since the showrunners of season 6 were probably building the foundation with the intention of making it the season 7 arc once the baby arc was resolved. When Paulson took over, he was smart to limit the scope of the Empire Valley story, since he didn't start the story, he couldn't very well steer it in the way it was supposed to go. I think Gary blowing it up was probably the wisest story move ever.. and Eric getting sick after the fact was just symbolic of how toxic the story was and how it was making viewers sick with confusion and boredom. In terms of male eye candy on the show, I would have to say from a purely artistic point of view.. I would say Kenny was the best looking in a classic male way. Now from a point of view of 'sexy'.... I don't think any of the men wet my whistle though I did enjoy seeing Mac's hairy chest from a purely artistic standpoint.

With Halloween around the corner, what better time than to do my annual rewatch of one of the most unique of KL episodes 'Three Sisters'. On the surface, this episode is random and sticks out like a sore thumb... but if you have an analytical mind... you can see that the episode serves as a template for several characters and foreshadows some major plots and character reactions down the line. So I'll start with the obvious: 1) Foreshadows Val's mental break, her unfulfilled need for being a mother, and never being believed/listened to by everyone. As we know, Val had been deprived of the chance to be a mother to her daughter Lucy due to Gary not being man enough to stand up to JR, her mother Lillimae's selfishness at not helping her daughter, and JR being a powerful person that didn't think Val was fit to be a mother. We also saw during the episode the women all worried about Val's mental state and not believing that there were any real ghosts until Abby officially shows proof that the ghosts exists. As we saw in the future.. Val's proclamation that her babies were alive and that Jill tried to kill her were ignored and she was deemed emotionally unfit even though she was proven to be correct both times.. just as what happened in this case. 2) Ginger As we came to see, Ginger was almost like the 'spare'... only used if the other women were already occupied. As @Khanhas stated... Ginger's role seemed to be made null and void once the show decided to make Val one of the female characters since they filled basically the same niche. This episode really highlights this with Ginger feeling the same over-whelming sadness at missing her baby the second she came in the house, being drawn to the little girls room just like Val, and sensing right away that there was a spooky presence. When Abby asked why the spirits didn't go after her, Laura stated that Ginger's mother instincts were being fulfilled, while Val's weren't. Without realizing it, the writers really highlighted how much Ginger's role was already filled by Val and they didn't think to try to remedy that. 3) Lillimae This was her redemption episode, where she finally stepped up was able to save Val when she had failed to do so before when Lucy was a baby. It helped Val/Lillimae continue to heal their relationship and helped it become a strong element on the show during the peak years. 4) Laura and Karen Both seemed to share the same function... and I'll be honest that I didn't think Karen was needed in the episode other than providing the transportation. Laura's function as a real estate person made the episode possible, and her ability to stay calm and provide some good sarcastic humor was valuable. 5) Abby She was the outsider that also was smart enough to research the property, played a few pranks on the women, be brave to stand up to the creepy caretaker, and was the one to validate Val's claims that the ghosts really did exist. Just like she was the one to bring Val to her babies when everyone else kept her out of the loop.

I would love if someone asked Pam Long how she came up the name of Reva since it's an Indian name originally.. while Roxanne (Roxie) and Russell (Rusty) were probably due to name popularity back in the 50s/early 60s.

The one thing I will say Marland/Long got right about Tulsa.. was that oil was a major industry. In terms of names, I would assume that in Oklahoma.. it would be names that were Scottish, Irish, or English... or even religious origin names.. especially during the 20th century. Oddy, the names Wanda, Billy, and Patricia (Trish) were popular names in the state Oklahoma in the 20th century.

I think that's why the Dobson's struggled with writing Nancy because the dna/make up of that character wasn't this warm and fussy matriarch that Bert was. Even in Bert's more interfering days, the actress had such spirit and passion in her delivery that when she softened with age.. it was organic. Nancy, on the other hand, was someone that kept things close to her vest and was slow to warm to people. The initial conflict when the show debuted was her troubling relationship with her daughter Penny because of the belief that Nancy preferred her other daughter Susan to Penny. Her behavior, which was driven by grief came across as preferring her deceased daughter over the daughter that was alive. And I gathered Nancy/Chris came from different backgrounds with Chris being raised on a farm while Nancy was probably raised in a middle class family that lived in town. Mentions were made of Nancy's disdain for his family.. especially Edith.. while it took time for Nancy to warm to Chris's dad. The only way I bought Nancy softening during the Marland era was because her partner/rock of 50+ years Chris was no longer there so she had to adjust and take on some of his traits (since Chris tended to be the more affectionate of the two). I think the route they took with Nancy post-Dan/Mac was the realistic route with her still having friends, active at the hospital, being supportive/mentor to the younger women, even having Rose's dad as male companionship/friendship.

While I did love the Southern Gothic vibes of the Josh/Reva story... I think Long also failed to understand that Oklahoma, like South Dakota, didn't have the whole southern gothic vibe whatsoever. @KhanIt sounds as though Oklahoma and South Dakota had similarities in regards to Native Americans, servants, etc. I would have also told Ms Long that if she were insisted on doing her thing with the Lewis family.. I would have stated that they would have most likely had a ranch with cattle/livestock being the main source of their money.. and that the family needed to have more grit/edge to them.. because living in the West and the harsh realities of the vast land. I also would have said that Reva and her family would have needed to be at least part Native American.. with the whole obstacle being that Reva being part Native American was the barrier for Josh not going with Reva (my part Lakota great grandmother had those same issues when marrying a fully white man back in the 1920s/1930s). While Long probably would have listened and been open to doing those ideas... I doubt P & G would have.

Some good backstory on Vanessa and her relationship with her twins... she seems closer to Donnell while distant from Deanna. With all these mentions of Deanna, I have a feeling that maybe she's been cast.. but no mention of said casting until close to the time she debuts on the soap. @Taoboi And Derek even got a good line about Jacob being honest with Naomi and it blowing up in his face... and his shell shocked look for once was warranted and a good acting choice LOL

Some good backstory on Vanessa and her relationship with her twins... she seems closer to Donnell while distant from Deanna. With all these mentions of Deanna, I have a feeling that maybe she's been cast.. but no mention of said casting until close to the time she debuts on the soap. @Taoboi And Derek even got a good line about Jacob being honest with Naomi and it blowing up in his face.

From what I recall, the actress that played Hayley mentioned she played the younger version of a character played by Debbi Morgan. So I have my heart set on Ms. Morgan playing Hayley's mom.. perhaps a con artist just like her daughter (like the movie Heartbreaker that starred Ms. Weaver and Jennifer Love Hewitt). It's a shame that Victoria Rowell wasn't playing Pamela instead of Cady... she could have done the transatlantic accent, etc. Dani vs Joey... promising.

My mom was from South Dakota and no way she would ever consider herself raised in the mid-west. She had more of a Western vibe since western South Dakota had a more western vibe vs eastern South Dakota. @KhanPam Long hails from Alabama so it makes sense. Beverlee Mckinsey was from Oklahoma, was she not? She had a slight accent, but it wasn't southern country twang whatsoever.

\ Next week with SPS and Hayley interacting again will be interesting since SPS was able to sense a fellow con artist despite Hayley playing innocent the last time the two interacted. Jacob is too good for Naomi. Vanessa is now trying to be a good mother, but sometimes it comes too little too late. Dani being inserted in yet another story.... yawn.

The Season 8 theme does sound like it was remixed on a Casio keyboard because it was the mid 80s and let's remix everything on synchs and Casio keyboards LOL I do laugh at the prospect of Morgan joining Knots Landing because she would totally be a fish out of water. Morgan just doesn't have the suburban mom vibe that Lee, Van ark, Constance, nor Mills (yes Donna Mills) had. It's a shame Paper Dolls didn't take off because she was the best part of that prime time where she played a character that sounded somewhat like Morgan herself (Morgan grew up in Texas, came to NYC and reinvented herself... and her character in Paper Dolls appeared to have grown up in Wisconsin and reinvented herself in NYC as a modeling agency owner).

I always found Hayley a walking contradiction with her unique fashion choices, decorating choices, her always being at 'work' yet never actually doing any work, and alternating between being dense and being insightful. I should have been tipped off when she always seemed the most insightful anytime Bill was acting deceitful (i.e. his motives for having Tomas join that reform group at the law firm, being nice to a client's wife in order to trip her up so he'd win his case, etc)... and when she was able to play on the emotions of the one defendant accusing the company of sexual harassment. Those scenes were when the actress really connected with the material vs the 'woe is me' routine. I agree seeing Bill and Dani getting close as gotten to her and she's become sloppy. It would be a shame if all of her hard work unravels because of those pesky emotions lol I know the hottie by name of Mr Vaughn is joining the show.. and I wonder if perhaps he's connected to one of Hayley's former marks (in addition to whomever he will be paired with).. or if he'll end up being one of her former marks.

No shade, but the whole Tomas situation that happened in this episode really highlights why I think a man needs to write those scripts.. not a woman. I'm having trouble believing that Hayley was some mastermind con-artist with the amount of mistakes she's making with this latest mark (Bill). Honey... take the money and run... and leave him crying that he got played in the same way that he played Dani. Women need to learn to reign in those emotions if they want to be con artists LOL Other than the Hayley/Bill/Randy/Caroline scenes... today was total filler.

When watching the first episodes that the Dobson's wrote for ATWT, the quality was ok... but the lighting/energy was just so old and stale compared to the freshness of the ABC soaps and Guiding Light/Y & R, I noticed by summer 1980 that there was a bit more life to the show with the introduction of Cricket and Margo with Margo eventually becoming the third wheel to Barbara/James while Cricket served as an early rival to Betsy (with Kim being a bit judgmental toward Cricket in the summer 1980 episodes I watched). I could see why Don/Mary were eventually written off.. and Joyce kept on a bit longer since she was the only spark plug the show had pre-1980 though she's much more muted in the Dobson era episodes. I can also see early on that the Dobson's seemed more drawn to writing for the Stewarts with Dee and Annie having focus along with David and Ellen plus Betsy.. while the Hughes family didn't seem to get as much focus other than Bob.

RHOSLC: - Brittani scene with her daughter was so realistic, and it was so sad that her wise beyond her years daughter had to grow up knowing her mother put the latest man of the hour ahead of her and her sibling. - Lorelei Gilmore wannabe (Bronwyn)... I had no idea about the identity theft situation, and it does explain why I get a sketchy vibe about her. Still she's way easier to watch and listen to in comparison to that horrid creature called Monica (who deserved to be belted in the face by Lisa Barlow) - I am curious why every season since season 4 has been a gang up on Lisa Barlow... did something happen behind the scenes, or has Lisa changed so much that she's alienated her fellow housewives? - Angie/Mary have some cracks in the friendship... but no friendship is perfect 24/7 so as long as they communicate with one another.. all should be well. Wife Swap: Real Housewife Edition - Angie K was a good spot staying for a few days off the grid and I liked that her rules were more about blowing off steam and taking a 'vacation' from the non grid life... even the wife she swapped with admitted there were days she would cry living off the grid. - Mary made a funny cameo and she was so sweet with Elecktra so at the time this was filmed.. she and Angie K were in a good position. - The wife's first guess on who she would swap with was.... drum roll please..... Lisa Barlow. Which proves SLC and Lisa Barlow go well together (and I do love her Wendy's commercials).

I think that last thirty to thirty five episodes looked to have been written after the show had debuted and also I think Guza was shifting the story threads he was in charge of to a certain place for Tracy T to pick up. Guza's last episode credited (150) ended with a bang with the reveal of Randy/Hayley's connection and her true feelings for her loving hubby.. and Tract T's first episode involved the explanation for Hayley's about face. It was probably the best way to hand off the reigns of their tales to their replacement. I'm not sure how MVJ and her co-head-writer handle the duties of being co head-writers. I'm sure it varies based on the duo and their relationship to one another. To me, I think Guza was responsible for the Joey/Vanessa/Doug story, and possibly had the idea to tie Hayley to Randy.. and maybe came up with the idea of the men covering up the Vernon/Martin attack and murder. Those elements seem very Guza coded, and I'll be interested to see how his replacement will pick up those threads going forward. With that said, I still don't get the whole Naomi/Jacob pregnancy scare.. except to show that the two are polar opposites and that maybe opposites don't attract long term. I also wonder if Andre/Ashley are truly done. I'm thinking it's back burnered for the forseeable future since the Andre/Dani surprise marriage has a lot of mileage.. plus whatever backstory he has that involves him not wanting to have his photo taken (which could help explain why he was drawn to vanilla Ashley since she doesn't seem to be a social media person).

My guess is that he's hiding from someone/something that happened before he came to town though if he was that bashful about not having his picture being taken... he probably shouldn't be drinking to the point where he gets married in a chapel to someone well known and having that splashed on social media. Andre is what my late mom would describe as 'cute, but dumb'. I also laugh at the lack of planning Randy and Hayley are doing... . I hope the texting is being done on a burner phone and that the bartender is in on their plot. This is why you never deviate from what worked in the past. This sudden last minute shift in her usual plan is what will be Hayley's undoing. Also, Randy could have said he was using the name Sammy because he was in hiding from Joey. Vanessa would have backed up that story since she knew he was laying and would have made Dani more likely to believe him. Lastly.... I still think Pamela puts on that accent and persona as a cover for the real her. Back in the Edge of Night era, there was a female character that came on in the early 80s that appeared to be a high pitched voice and appeared to be a bimbo.. but turned out that she was the brains behind an organization and had a lower pitched voice. Perhaps Pamela goes back to her place, takes off the wig and reveals her real voice. Would be a nice twist down the line.

I think because she didn't have much of it, I don't think any significant harm will come to her... but I have a feeling that the blood sample that was drawn might come into play down the line.

On the one hand, i can view Nicole's decision partly based on how she watched her sister Dani continually accept being cheated on and ultimately dumped by her husband for a younger woman. So when Ted's infidelity came out, she was more upset with being lied to than anything else... but then when he slept with her again, she said 'Yeah... I'm not going to be my sister and be a doormat'. However, all that is thrown out the window with the way she was advising her daughter Kat... whose boyfriend cheated on her with her half-sister. I do think Nicole is an interesting character that seems to hold herself up to a higher standard of conduct/behavior.. yet encourages her daughter to give the boyfriend that cheated on her a second chance.

If Ted and Nicole had that push/pull type of connection then it wouldn't any different than the whole Bill/Dani dynamic. Having Ted/Nicole end their marriage, which seemed built on a flimsy house of cards, is probably best and seeing how the two function post divorce. Nicole had her interactions with Carlton and perhaps another future male character while Ted has had a few nice interactions with June that could grow into a nice friendship/casual dating situationship. I remember back when B & B started that there were instances where Stephanie Forrester was taking calls.. and viewers were led to believe that she was doing something romantic behind Eric's back and it eventually was revealed that she was nursing their long believed dead daughter Angela (which turned out to be an imposter).... so I'm assuming that whomever Vernon was talking to today isn't an affair.. but perhaps something else that is non romantic based (he has been shown taking calls and leaving suddenly so I have a feeling more will be revealed). I think the main reason why the last thirty to forty episodes seemed to be cooking was because the writers were starting to gear up for the end of the initial 200 episode pick up.. and I'm sure there was a plan in place if they didn't get an additional pick up. Also, I think Guza was nearing the end of his initial contract with BTG and he decided to move some plots to the next stage so that his replacement Tracy T would be able to pick up the threads and help plan the next stages of the story. I truly think that she'll handle the more detailed planning of the story with MVJ giving final approval. Mona bible thumping is another point against her.. and considering she's not married, not in a relationship, nor has a child... Nicole nor any other married/divorce person shouldn't listen to her.

I think the Articulate story was meant to give some backstory/focus on Anita.. to show that she wasn't the influential person she made herself out to be, and also to provide a sort of karma to Anita by way of SPS. And I think the Martin/Smitty situation was too quickly resolved with the two getting back together without solving any of the issues that put them in the situations they were in. Although it is realistic that people break up/reunite.. rinse/lather/repeat (ala Brittani and Jared on RHOSLC), but it can get annoying after awhile. Also I was venturing onto Threads/Instragram.. and peeps were wondering/gossiping about Hayley and debating on what is coming next and how excited they were. Most were also anti-Naomi and thought Jacob is a saint to put up with her LOL Power of social media

I think they should have Izaiah be an actual ladies man and just test him out with all the women... with it up in the air who his end game is.