This is the Presidential Campaign Thread.

Barack Obama Vs. John McCain.

Edited November 6, 200817 yr by Toups

Sounds like to me what may have been said was the Democrats were there for everything else BUT hearing what Obama had to say.

My intention was not this broad sweeping generalization that you have stated above...I said that some may have been there to see Sheryl Crow..or whomever...I have no way of knowing...it was just an opinion...

My intention was not this broad sweeping generalization that you have stated above...I said that some may have been there to see Sheryl Crow..or whomever...I have no way of knowing...it was just an opinion...

Well, I thank you for clearing that up for me.

And for the HRC voters:

http://blogs.abcnews.com/politicalradar/20...clinton-hi.html

Bill Clinton: Hillary Never Wanted to be Obama's VP

Well, I thank you for clearing that up for me.

No prob bob.

http://voices.washingtonpost.com/the-trail..._with_bush.html

McCain 'Uncomfortable' with Bush Rescue Plan

I can kind of see how a Democrat might we've been dealt this hand.....let's try to fix it and in the process let's take advantage of the fact that it furthers our case.

Wales, this might seem hypocritical coming from me...as this is a personal question...But I cannot help but ask..

Do you include yourself as a Dem now? By saying (we've)..? I know you've said in the past that you do not affiliate yourself with any political party...Sorry if this is too personal, but I am really just wondering..

I did not intend to make a big deal about Palin's crowd until you posted a comment mocking my enjoyment. You said I was swaying from the issues and it almost made you laugh.

This was what you posted:

Wow! 60,000! Good for her...That almost matches Obama's acceptance speech/concert!

and this was my response:

This almost made me laugh. I guess you just can't help yourself....I thought you were all about issues but now you're happy that your candidate can draw a crowd...yay she's a celebrity now.

Now if you can't take a joke or you didn't get that I was joking then I understand that.

I feel that I should be able to jab Obama at any chance I see fit. Again, Wales, please do not try to point out my personal approach to commenting as if it is at your discrestion as to what I can or can't do.

I don't not attempt to pick apart the manner in which you comment, only the points and opinions that you convey. I try to leave personal habits out of the conversation.

You are you and I am me. I said I felt you had some contempt for the Democrats. I don't see the problem with that. I didn't know it was an issue for you but now that you've said you find it personal then I understand. It's kind of like you labeling me a liberal and whatever else you said about me when you first started posting in this thread. I questioned your labeling me but I didn't jump all over you for labeling me or tell you it was being too personal or anything. I don't have a bunch of rules for people.

I didn't tell you what I can or cannot say but if you don't like the way I post then it makes it difficult to post with you because I don't do the egg shell thing real well. It almost sounds as if I've been saying horrible things to you and telling you off. It takes away all the fun.

My point was that both parties take and accept any positive advantage that comes their way...it matters not if it is good or bad for the country as a whole...

Market decaying...good for Democrats in this election...bad for the country...

Racism in this election...good for Republicans...bad for the country..

Hope this clears up my intended message...

What you were saying was never unclear. The problem wasn't you....it was me and how much of it I see as a correlated.

The difference in them to me is that the Democrats quite by chance are in a position to make a bad situation for the country somewhat beneficial for their party. The Republicans, however, would be feeding into an ugly, divisive thing for the country and making it beneficial for them.

One party would be using a situation to try to make things better (even if you don't agree with their methods, you might agree that their intent is to make things better). Exactly what would Repblicans be trying to make better by exploiting racism? BTW, this is a rhetorical question.

Wales, this might seem hypocritical coming from me...as this is a personal question...But I cannot help but ask..

Do you include yourself as a Dem now? By saying (we've)..? I know you've said in the past that you do not affiliate yourself with any political party...Sorry if this is too personal, but I am really just wondering..

If I find something too personal then I'll say so....so no it's not. I meant that Democrats in leadership might say "we've" blah blah. I'm still not interested in joining a party. The Democrats fit into my view on the diversity of the nation and are good on some other issues but not enough that I want to cross that bridge.

Obama vows deep cuts in spending

By MIKE GLOVER – 1 hour ago

GREEN BAY, Wis. (AP) — Democratic presidential nominee Barack Obama moved to claim the mantle of fiscal responsibility in a roiling economy, vowing on Monday to slash federal spending on contractors by 10 percent and saving $40 billion.

Urging members of his own party to be just as fiscally tough as the most conservative Republicans, Obama said the $700 billion economic bailout plan proposed by the Bush administration and congressional leaders is forcing a renewed look at federal spending.

As president, Obama said he would create a White House team headed by a chief performance officer to monitor the efficiency of government spending.

"I am not a Democrat who believes that we can or should defend every government program just because it's there," Obama said at a rally in Green Bay. "We will fire government managers who aren't getting results, we will cut funding for programs that are wasting your money and we will use technology and lessons from the private sector to improve efficiency across every level of government."

"The only way we can do all this without leaving our children with an even larger debt is if Washington starts taking responsibility for every dime that it spends," he said.

Obama focused tightly on the economy in recent days, and he has urged Democrats and Republicans to join forces to approve a bailout of the troubled financial industry that not only saves the industry but protects taxpayers.

"We are here because an ethic of irresponsibility has swept through our government, leaving politicians with the belief they can waste billions and billions of your money on no-bid contracts for friends and contributors, slip pork projects into bills during the dead of night and spend billions on corporate tax breaks we can't afford and old programs we don't need," said Obama.

He linked the turmoil that's rocked Wall Street to federal spending he said has soared out of control, laying the blame at the feet of Republican policies he argued that rival John McCain is certain to continue.

President Bush ran for office on a platform of efficiency in government, Obama said, noting that Bush instead has presided over a mushrooming federal budget and deficits. Under Bush, spending on contractors has more than doubled, from $203 billion in 2000 to $412 billion in 2006.

"We cannot give a blank check to Washington with no oversight and accountability, when no oversight and accountability is what got us into this mess in the first place," said Obama. He warned that even as the government moves to bail out the financial sector there are signs that special interests are looking to profit.

Obama said he's spent the last two years running for president on a promise of change, and he mocked McCain's argument he can bring change to Washington.

"This whole change thing must be catching on," said Obama. "I've noticed that John McCain is trying to steal my signs. He trying to make up for 26 years in 26 hours. Who do you think has been running the government for the last eight years?"

He accused McCain of "an election-year conversion" that's brought change into his rhetoric.

"After 26 years of being part of this Washington culture, all that he has changed is his slogan for the fall campaign," said Obama.

McCain spokesman Tucker Bounds quickly dismissed Obama's speech as lacking substance. "After first promising a plan to address this economic crisis, all Barack Obama delivered for hardworking Americans was political attacks and a total lack of leadership," Bounds said.

Obama warned that the election is hard fought because special interests are fighting hard to keep their place at the table.

"It won't be easy, the kind of change we're looking for is never easy," said Obama. "What we are up against is a very powerful entrenched status quo in Washington who will say anything and do anything and fight with everything they've got to keep things just the way they are."

Obama spoke to 6,000 people in an arena in a state that trends Democratic, and where Obama badly needs a win.

I did not intend to make a big deal about Palin's crowd until you posted a comment mocking my enjoyment. You said I was swaying from the issues and it almost made you laugh.

This was what you posted:

and this was my response:

Now if you can't take a joke or you didn't get that I was joking then I understand that.

Understandable.

You are you and I am me. I said I felt you had some contempt for the Democrats. I don't see the problem with that. I didn't know it was an issue for you but now that you've said you find it personal then I understand. It's kind of like you labeling me a liberal and whatever else you said about me when you first started posting in this thread. I questioned your labeling me but I didn't jump all over you for labeling me or tell you it was being too personal or anything. I don't have a bunch of rules for people.

I didn't tell you what I can or cannot say but if you don't like the way I post then it makes it difficult to post with you because I don't do the egg shell thing real well. It almost sounds as if I've been saying horrible things to you and telling you off. It takes away all the fun.

I don't mind if you want to label me an Obama jabber...I was just hoping that we could move past the personal labels...like you wanted in the past..I've grown with this thread and I am still learning what is acceptable and not acceptable...I just thought it was an unwritten rule to not call someone out for their personal habits or approach..Or at least that was the impression that I got and was trying to abide by. I can start to point out personal characteristics of the other posters again, if that is the direction that everyone wants to go.

IA..we should keep it as fun as possible.!

What you were saying was never unclear. The problem wasn't you....it was me and how much of it I see as a correlated.

The difference in them to me is that the Democrats quite by chance are in a position to make a bad situation for the country somewhat beneficial for their party. The Republicans, however, would be feeding into an ugly, divisive thing for the country and making it beneficial for them.

One party would be using a situation to try to make things better (even if you don't agree with their methods, you might agree that their intent is to make things better). Exactly what would Repblicans be trying to make better by exploiting racism? BTW, this is a rhetorical question.

I see what you are saying that the free market and racism are not the same thing...I was just using these two examples as microcosms of a problem (within both parties) that occur on a much larger scale.

Edited September 22, 200817 yr by Casey008

If I find something too personal then I'll say so....so no it's not. I meant that Democrats in leadership might say "we've" blah blah. I'm still not interested in joining a party. The Democrats fit into my view on the diversity of the nation and are good on some other issues but not enough that I want to cross that bridge.

Ok so I will label you now as a "middle of the roader"....j/k

You are an American with opinions..no other labels..

Ok so I will label you now as a "middle of the roader"....j/k

You are an American with opinions..no other labels..

Good enough because for the first time in my adult life...I'm proud to be an American

I'm just a legend in my own mind.

Oh and on the adoption note, I just want to add that sometimes it's hard to get adopted.....I'm still trying but I keep being told that I'm too old and they want babies.

Edited September 22, 200817 yr by Wales2004

Obama vows deep cuts in spending

By MIKE GLOVER – 1 hour ago

GREEN BAY, Wis. (AP) — Democratic presidential nominee Barack Obama moved to claim the mantle of fiscal responsibility in a roiling economy, vowing on Monday to slash federal spending on contractors by 10 percent and saving $40 billion.

Urging members of his own party to be just as fiscally tough as the most conservative Republicans, Obama said the $700 billion economic bailout plan proposed by the Bush administration and congressional leaders is forcing a renewed look at federal spending.

As president, Obama said he would create a White House team headed by a chief performance officer to monitor the efficiency of government spending.

"I am not a Democrat who believes that we can or should defend every government program just because it's there," Obama said at a rally in Green Bay. "We will fire government managers who aren't getting results, we will cut funding for programs that are wasting your money and we will use technology and lessons from the private sector to improve efficiency across every level of government."

"The only way we can do all this without leaving our children with an even larger debt is if Washington starts taking responsibility for every dime that it spends," he said.

Obama focused tightly on the economy in recent days, and he has urged Democrats and Republicans to join forces to approve a bailout of the troubled financial industry that not only saves the industry but protects taxpayers.

"We are here because an ethic of irresponsibility has swept through our government, leaving politicians with the belief they can waste billions and billions of your money on no-bid contracts for friends and contributors, slip pork projects into bills during the dead of night and spend billions on corporate tax breaks we can't afford and old programs we don't need," said Obama.

He linked the turmoil that's rocked Wall Street to federal spending he said has soared out of control, laying the blame at the feet of Republican policies he argued that rival John McCain is certain to continue.

President Bush ran for office on a platform of efficiency in government, Obama said, noting that Bush instead has presided over a mushrooming federal budget and deficits. Under Bush, spending on contractors has more than doubled, from $203 billion in 2000 to $412 billion in 2006.

"We cannot give a blank check to Washington with no oversight and accountability, when no oversight and accountability is what got us into this mess in the first place," said Obama. He warned that even as the government moves to bail out the financial sector there are signs that special interests are looking to profit.

Obama said he's spent the last two years running for president on a promise of change, and he mocked McCain's argument he can bring change to Washington.

"This whole change thing must be catching on," said Obama. "I've noticed that John McCain is trying to steal my signs. He trying to make up for 26 years in 26 hours. Who do you think has been running the government for the last eight years?"

He accused McCain of "an election-year conversion" that's brought change into his rhetoric.

"After 26 years of being part of this Washington culture, all that he has changed is his slogan for the fall campaign," said Obama.

McCain spokesman Tucker Bounds quickly dismissed Obama's speech as lacking substance. "After first promising a plan to address this economic crisis, all Barack Obama delivered for hardworking Americans was political attacks and a total lack of leadership," Bounds said.

Obama warned that the election is hard fought because special interests are fighting hard to keep their place at the table.

"It won't be easy, the kind of change we're looking for is never easy," said Obama. "What we are up against is a very powerful entrenched status quo in Washington who will say anything and do anything and fight with everything they've got to keep things just the way they are."

Obama spoke to 6,000 people in an arena in a state that trends Democratic, and where Obama badly needs a win.

I truly hope that whoever is elected does reduce spending...that is needed far more than anything else IMO..It is needed before tax cuts, tax increases, or universal healthcare.

But, I must say that I think spending should be reduced in other areas before military operations. I think the war would be the easiest measure to reduce spending, but I do not want to see the safety of our country put at risk in order to balance the budget..

I know that sounds picky, but I think it can be accomplished!

Edited September 22, 200817 yr by Casey008

Good enough because for the first time in my adult life...I'm proud to be an American

Thanks Michelle!

Oh and on the adoption note, I just want to add that sometimes it's hard to get adopted.....I'm still trying but I keep being told that I'm too old and they want babies.

I would adopt you, but it would be too much of a house divided!

BOTH PARTIES maybe to blame.

CNN Poll: Republicans blamed for financial crisis, Obama gains

Posted: 04:03 PM ET

From CNN Deputy Political Director Paul Steinhauser

The nation's economic woes appear to be taking a toll on McCain.

WASHINGTON (CNN) – A new CNN/Opinion Research Corporation Poll suggests that by a 2-to-1 margin, Americans blame Republicans over Democrats for the financial crisis that has swept across the country the past few weeks — one factor that may have contributed to an apparent increase in Barack Obama’s edge over John McCain in the race for the White House.

In the new survey, released Monday afternoon, 47 percent of registered voters questioned say Republicans are more responsible for the problems currently facing financial institutions and the stock market, with 24 percent saying Democrats are more responsible. One in five of those polled blame both parties equally, and 8 percent say neither party is to blame.

The poll also indicates that more Americans think Obama, the Democratic presidential nominee, would do a better job handling an economic crisis than McCain, the Republican presidential nominee. Forty-nine percent of those questioned say Obama would display good judgment in an economic crisis, 6 points higher than the number who said the same about McCain. And Obama has a 10 point lead over McCain on the question of who would better handle the economy overall.

These numbers appear to be affecting the battle for the presidency. Fifty-one percent of registered voters are backing Obama, who now holds a 5 point edge over McCain, at 46 percent. McCain and Obama were tied at 48 percent apiece in the previous CNN/Opinion Research Corporation survey. Obama's advantage, while growing, is still within the poll's sampling error of plus or minus 3 percentage points.

Where did Obama make his gains?

"In two core McCain constituencies: Men, who now narrowly favor Obama. And seniors, who have also flipped from McCain to Obama," says CNN Senior Political Analyst Bill Schneider.

When including only those people most likely to vote, the results are pretty much the same: Among likely voters, Obama has a 4 point lead, 51 percent to 47 percent.

The new CNN poll of polls also shows Obama with a similar advantage — 49 percent for Obama to 44 percent for John McCain.

"The economy has always been considered John McCain's Achilles’ heel, and the CNN poll of polls started to show an Obama edge in the middle of last week — just as the financial crisis began to hit home for many Americans," said CNN Polling Director Keating Holland.

The poll also expands to include third party candidates. When included in the results, Obama has the backing of 48 percent of likely voters, three points ahead of McCain at 45 percent. Independent Ralph Nader has the support of 4 percent of those polled, with Libertarian candidate Bob Barr and Green Party candidate Cynthia McKinney each at one percent.

A couple of other factors in the survey appear to be contributing to Obama's slight rise and McCain's slight drop in the polls. Fifty-three percent of those questioned say McCain, if elected, will mostly carry out the policies of President George W. Bush, who remains extremely unpopular with most Americans. That's up 3 points from our previous poll.

The survey also indicates Obama's recaptured the advantage on "change": Just after the Republican convention, Obama's lead had shrunk to 8 points when voters were asked which candidate would be more likely to bring change. It's now up to 14 points in the new poll.

Another factor could be McCain's running mate, Alaska Governor Sarah Palin. Thirty-five percent of those questioned have an unfavorable opinion of her, up 8 points from our previous survey. And two-thirds believe she and her husband should testify in the Alaska investigation into her firing of a state official.

"Change has always been Obama's strong suit, but McCain and Palin clearly made inroads into that issue during the GOP convention," said Holland. "Palin, in particular, was seen as an agent of change when she made her first appearance on the national stage. That may be changing now."

The poll also sheds more light on how Americans feel about the financial crisis. Twenty-two percent say they are scared about the crisis, with two-thirds concerned. Eleven percent say they are not worried.

Most Americans think that the programs to deal with the financial crisis currently being worked on by Congress and the Bush administration will be unfair to U.S. Taxpayers — but they think those programs will ultimately help the economy.

In general, six in ten believe that federal government should step in and address the financial crisis; 37 percent say the government should stay out. But when it comes to last week's bailouts, support slips to 55 percent — and given the concerns about how future programs will affect taxpayers, it conceivable that public support for the plans that Congress and the administration are working on could fall even lower.

The survey comes out just four days before McCain and Obama face off in the first of three presidential debates. Will the debates make a difference? Probably, since the poll finds that 14 percent of Americans say they haven't made up their minds yet.

The CNN/Opinion Research Corporation poll was conducted Friday through Sunday, and included interviews of 1,020 Americans, including 909 registered voters and 697 likely voters

Palin accuses 'Obama-Biden Democrats' of spreading 'lies'

Posted: 03:15 PM ET

From CNN's Emily Sherman

Palin accused 'Obama-Biden Democrats,' of attacking her family Monday.

(CNN)— Governor Sarah Palin accused “Obama-Biden Democrats,” of launching a series of unfair attacks against she and her family in a fundraising email sent to supporters Monday.

“Friends, in the course of a few weeks, the Obama-Biden Democrats have launched attack after attack on me, my family and John McCain,” Palin writes in the email. “They’re desperate to win and they’ll no doubt launch these attacks against other reformers on our ticket.”

Earlier this month, the McCain campaign said its $47 million fundraising record for the month of August was due in large part to the addition of the Alaska governor to the ticket. Her presence on the campaign trail has also translated into larger crowds at campaign events throughout the country.

Palin said Obama and Biden have a “large financial advantage,” urging supporters that a contribution of any size will help stop the spread of “lies” and “misinformation” coming from Democrats.

“We must stop them,” Palin writes, “…before they turn these shameful tactics on others we support.”