Ok Casey, I just read about it and Bill Clinton did not say that!!! An aide close to him said Bill believes Barack thinks like that. Still a little jacked up, but Bill did not say it. I'm so torn though because on one hand I think Hillary and Bill's loyalty comes with a price, but at the same time, I just dont trust the Clinton's. But in the tradition of keeping an argument with you going, Hillary for the Supreme Court!!

That's the way they are spinning it? Oh ok. Bill believes Barack thinks that way? Alright.

Who's seat on the Supreme Court is she going to get? Who is going to die in the next four years, assuming Obama is elected.

Ok now you show me. I asked for Obama's outline, not a recording of his entire speech. I've already seen it. Still vague comments, which I will admit sound great, but are backed up with no validity

Edited August 30, 200817 yr by Casey008

http://dyn.politico.com/printstory.cfm?uui...819911AC1196C5A

Bill Clinton believes the Democratic nominee, far from practicing a unifying, transformational brand of politics, has the political instincts of “a Chicago thug,” one longtime associate said. Clinton has told people that Obama allowed surrogates to try to suppress Hispanic turnout in the Nevada caucuses, and played “the race card” in reverse against the Clintons in South Carolina and other states.

So says an associate. Bill didn't come out and say it, we're supposed to believe this anonymous longtime associate? Yeah, ok. I don't doubt that he didn't say it, but don't say he was quoted, when in fact, there is no proof that he said it.

Edited August 30, 200817 yr by Ryan

Jay, don't do this.

The Republican machine can only come up with this BS because they can't cover for the fact that McCain has screwed up his campaign.

And......what do people think Mitt Romney and Tim Pawlenty are calling John McCain right now?

That's the way they are spinning it? Oh ok. Bill believes Barack thinks that way? Alright.

Who's seat on the Supreme Court is she going to get? Who is going to die in the next four years, assuming Obama is elected.

Ok now you show me. I asked for Obama's outline, not a recording of his entire speech. I've already seen it. Still vague comments, which I will admit sound great, but are backed up with no validity

Listen to the speech. He has made it clear. The fact that you are acting like what he said in that speech is vague shows me that you didnt listen to it, probably because you were so bitter because Obama is going to give Mccain a whoopin come November, so me telling you would be a waste of my writing. Wait until he wins the election for the validity.

Edited August 30, 200817 yr by Dr. Jay S.W.

Listen to the speech. He has made it clear. The fact that you are acting like what he said in that speech is vague shows me that you didnt listen to it, probably because you were so bitter because Obama is going to give Mccain a whoopin come November, so me telling you would be a waste of my writing. Wait until he wins the election for the validity.

You cant do it can you? You make yet another Obama supporter that fails to convey Obama's plan.

McClatchy Washington Bureau

Posted on Fri, Aug. 29, 2008

Announcement stuns, splits Alaska political world

Sean Cockerham and Wesley Loy | Anchorage Daily News

last updated: August 30, 2008 10:07:16 AM

John McCain's choice of Alaska Gov. Sarah Palin as his vice presidential running mate stunned and divided Alaska political leaders today. Supporters said she was a shrewd choice, but others argued Palin has no business being a heartbeat away from the presidency.

"I think it's very easy to underestimate Sarah Palin," said John Binkley, a former state legislator who lost to her in the 2006 Republican primary for governor.

Binkley said Palin has guts and an innate ability to connect with voters. He said the choice of Palin lets the McCain campaign refocus on its theme of change, which he said it's been drifting away from.

Binkley dismissed doubts she isn't ready.

"Many people said that about her in terms of being governor, and I think she's done an excellent job," Binkley said.

The reaction wasn't so rosy elsewhere. State Senate President Lyda Green said she thought it was a joke when someone called her at 6 a.m. to tell her the news.

"She's not prepared to be governor. How can she be prepared to be vice president or president? said Green, a Republican from Palin's hometown of Wasilla. "Look at what she's done to this state. What would she do to the nation?"

Green, who has feuded with Palin, brought up the big oil tax increase Palin pushed through last year. She also pointed to the award of a $500 million state subsidy to a Canadian firm to pursue a natural gas pipeline that's far from guaranteed.

House Speaker John Harris, a Republican from Valdez, was also astonished at the news. He didn't want to get into the issue of her qualifications.

"She's old enough," Harris said. "She's a U.S. citizen."

Democrats helped give Palin her victories on oil taxes and the natural gas pipeline deal, over opposition from some Republicans in the Legislature.

But Democrats had little love for her today. Anchorage Democratic Sen. Hollis French said it's a huge mistake by McCain and "reflects very, very badly on his judgment."

Alaska Democratic Party chairwoman Patti Higgins, attending her party's national convention in Denver, said she was shocked to hear the news this morning.

"In this very competitive election for them to go pick somebody who is ... under a cloud of suspicion, who is under investigation for abuse of power. It just sounds like a pretty slow start to me," Higgins said.

The state Legislature is investigating whether Palin and her staff broke state law by pressuring the public safety department to fire a state trooper who was in a custody battle with her sister.

"We need a vice president who can step in if, God forbid, something happened to John McCain," Higgins said. "I don't think she's someone who is ready for that 3 a.m. phone call."

The Republican Party of Alaska said it's 100 percent behind Palin -- despite the battles she's had with state party chairman Randy Ruedrich.

"She brings her voice of new energy and change," party spokesman McHugh Pierre said. "And she knows Alaska."

Ruedrich was not giving interviews today. Palin's complaints against Ruedrich before she became governor led to the state fining him on ethics charges.

McCain noted approvingly in introducing Palin today that "she's fought oil companies and party bosses."

Palin and Alaska Republican Sen. Ted Stevens were at odds in the past as well.

The governor last year called on Stevens to explain why he was being investigated in the federal probe that has since led to his indictment on failure to disclose gifts

But they've appeared closer lately, and Stevens put out a statement saying that "it's a great day for the nation and Alaskans."

"Gov. Palin has proven herself as a bright, energetic leader for our state and will bring the same energy to the vice presidency. She will serve our country with distinction - the first Alaskan and first woman on the Republican ticket. I share in the pride of all Alaskans," Stevens said in the statement.

North Pole Republican Sen. Gene Therriault, who leads the minority caucus in the state Senate, said Palin has executive experience and he thinks she's ready for the job.

"I think it's a great opportunity for the state of Alaska," Therriault said. "For us to get our message out in what the satae has to offer to the nation."

Alaska Attorney General Talis Colberg, a Palin appointee, said McCain's announcement left him with "a mixed set of emotions, kind of an odd sense of Alaska nationalism or pride."

"This is like watching a moon landing or something. It's just something you don't expect to see very often. It's wonderful." He continued: "It was an emotional thing to see the governor walk out with her family and I say, wow, I work for her."

Palin likely will be spending much time campaigning outside of Alaska. Lt. Gov. Sean Parnell also is preoccupied with campaigning for Alaska's lone U.S. House seat.

Colberg would become governor if Palin and Parnell both are elected and leave their current positions.

Now i could just harp on this one statement, but I love that this article was balanced. It showed people who A) Are supportive and proud and Showed people who disagree with the decision.

I applaud John McCain for him choosing a woman, but the guy whose big criticism of Obama was his "lack of experience," ended up choosing someone who has "less experience" than Obama. If he was going to choose a woman as his VP, he could have chosen Sen. Kay Bailey Hutchison

Jay, I heard the speech. He did spell out his agenda......

Unlike John McCain, who hasn't decided which side of the fence he sits on to tell us his plans.

Edited August 30, 200817 yr by Roman

You cant do it can you? You make yet another Obama supporter that fails to convey Obama's plan.

No. I make yet another Obama supporter who would rather not waste his breath, well his writing in this case. Casey, I am telling you to watch the Speech, go on Youtube, etc. because it's there. I'm just not going to fall into this trap and play this game with you. I already know my canidate has got it in November. You don't, which is why your acting like this. That, or your a Republican.

No. I make yet another Obama supporter who would rather not waste his breath, well his writing in this case. Casey, I am telling you to watch the Speech, go on Youtube, etc. because it's there. I'm just not going to fall into this trap and play this game with you. I already know my canidate has got it in November. You don't, which is why your acting like this. That, or your a Republican.

I HAVE watched the speech. Ok...I'm not trying to trap you. Funny you would use those words. I am grasping at any substance that Obama displays. I heard none in the speech. I am hearing none from you. Please enlighten my deaf ears.

How do you know your candidate has it in November? Please give me specifics.

You sound more like a boy in a school yard sticking out his toungue than an informed voter.

I know the specifics of McCain's plans. I would find it very intriguing to hear what specifics of Obama's plan are motivating his average supporter. I have not been asked what McCain's plans are. If I were I would have no fear of being "trapped" or trying to explain.

Edited August 30, 200817 yr by Casey008

I HAVE watched the speech. Ok...I'm not trying to trap you. Funny you would use those words. I am grasping at any substance that Obama displays. I heard none in the speech. I am hearing none from you. Please enlightened my deaf ears.

How do you know your candidate has it in November? Please give me specifics.

You sound more like a boy in a school yard sticking out his toungue than an informed voter.

I know the specifics of McCain's plans. I would find it very intriguing to hear what is motivating the average Obama supporter. I have not been asked what McCain's plans are. If I were I would have no fear of trying to explain.

Noope I wont do it. You know damn well Obama has made himself clear on this war, his plans for health care, foreign oil, education cost, equal pay for woman. I keep up. If you want details, go find them, because I wont get into it with you. Trust me, the reason im not going into details here isn't me, it's you.

No. I make yet another Obama supporter who would rather not waste his breath, well his writing in this case. Casey, I am telling you to watch the Speech, go on Youtube, etc. because it's there. I'm just not going to fall into this trap and play this game with you. I already know my canidate has got it in November. You don't, which is why your acting like this. That, or your a Republican.

And you see, for all the talk of Obama's lack of plans......

No one has posted McCain's plans.

Just funny to me.

These pages of back and forth "debating" is what I find funny. I haven't been this entertained with a series of posts since the old Ericakane4life drama of a year and a half ago! But I need to work all of this out in long form... both sides here present compelling points for me to ponder (except the personal attacks on individual candidates, I disregard those because I feel all of the candidates are truly nice people)...

I'm breaking this down for my own edification in the most simplistic form the qualifications (not a full list, btw):

EXPERIENCE:

McCain - Longtime politician (seasoned and experienced)

Obama - 20 months in the Senate (liberal)

Palin - About 20 months Governor of Alaska (conservative)

Biden - Longtime politician (season and experienced)

HEALTH ISSUES:

McCain - History of Cancer

Obama - N/A

Palin - N/A

Biden - History of Brain Aneuryisms

IDEOLOGY:

McCain - Moderate or Conservative (Depends on what crowd is gathered)

Obama - Moderate to Liberal (Depends on what crowd is gathered)

Palin - Conservative (No crowds yet, but record is clear)

Biden - Liberal (No crowds yet, but record is clear)

The race for the White House basically comes down to idealogy, as far as I can tell. Because the two veteran politicians in the batch could both succumb in a flash, leaving less experienced individuals without someone to lean on. Of course, there is always a well-appointed cabinet for the President to rely upon... which really makes the health issues and experience issues DOA.

So, what ideology do you want reflected in US Supreme Court picks? That is what is at stake, as far as I can tell. Obama's religion, McCain's age, Biden's mouth, and Palin's children make for foolish debate, in my opinion. It's all about a conservative or liberal agenda. But even with SCOTUS picks, Congress weighs in heavily and can vote yes or no or simply remain deadlocked, advancing no agenda at all.

OMG, it all seems so damn pointless now. LOL!! Crap, politics are pointless... soaps suck these days...

<<SIGHS>> I'm so depressed. Oh well... I've got other things to think about... after all, I'll be married in less than a month!

Brian

Edited August 30, 200817 yr by wostwebmaster

Noope I wont do it. You know damn well Obama has made himself clear on this war, his plans for health care, foreign oil, education cost, equal pay for woman. I keep up. If you want details, go find them, because I wont get into it with you. Trust me, the reason im not going into details here isn't me, it's you.

I have heard what he plans to do. I have watched the speech, as I have mentioned several times. My question is HOW? I have kept up religiously to his plans. I want to know how informed his voters are.

How is he going to fund universal healthcare? How is he going to ensure equal pay for women? Other posters have said he will NOT raise taxes. Obama has said nothing about a reduction in spending. So, again, HOW is all of this going to be done?

I have been asking this since the night of his speech in this thread. I said earlier that I would vote for him if he gave a clear reasoning of how he is going to accomplish all of this.

I can honestly say that I am still undecided in this election. If Obama could deliver his means of accomplishing all of this as well as he speaks about what needs to be changed. Then I could possibly be swayed to vote for him. I have almost come to the point of begging for more info. I cant get it.

For those who asked, here are some specifics from Obama's speech. Specifics that he laid out during his speech. Obama laid out more than 29 plans he has for America, and I echo Jay when I say if you want to know what his plans are, you can listen to the speech. But to make things a little easier, here is are some of his plans.

Economy

Obama has pledged to attack the weak economy with another stimulus plan to follow the $168 billion package of tax rebates for individuals and tax breaks for businesses that Congress passed last February. Obama's stimulus would include tax rebates, aid to state and local governments and increased spending for infrastructure projects. He would also increase spending in other areas such as alternative energy programs.

Taxes

Retain President Bush's tax cuts for families making less than $250,000 a year and provide more relief to the squeezed middle class by creating new tax breaks for lower-income families; extend the current "patch" that keeps the Alternative Minimum Tax, designed to make sure the wealthy pay their fair share of taxes, from hitting more middle-class families; exempt seniors making less than $50,000 per year from paying income taxes, expand the tax credit for college and provide incentives to encourage savings, and help pay for child care and pay mortgage expenses.

Energy

A short-term rebate of $1,000 per couple to help with rising energy costs; release of up to 70 million barrels of oil from the Strategic Petroleum Reserve, and investment of $15 billion a year over the next decade to encourage renewable energy, clean-coal technology and electric cars.

Health Care

Obama would increase the number of people with health insurance by having the government subsidize the cost of coverage for low- and middle-income families. To help pay for that expense, Obama would increase taxes for those families earning more than $250,000. He also would require employers not offering health coverage to pay a percentage of their payroll toward a national health plan. And he would mandate that children have health insurance, and expand who can participate in Medicaid and the State Children's Health Insurance Program.

Foriegn Policy

Obama says he would engage both allies and adversaries to repair the U.S. image abroad and regain leverage and leadership that he says Bush squandered. He says he will marshal international pressure against Iran, boost U.S. efforts against extremists along the Afghanistan-Pakistan border and get a faster and firmer start on Middle East peacemaking.

Defense

Pull all U.S. combat forces out of Iraq within 16 months, send more combat troops to Afghanistan and provide better care for wounded troops and veterans.

Education

An $18 billion plan that would encourage, but not mandate, universal pre-kindergarten; teacher pay raises tied to, although not based solely on, test scores; an overhaul of President Bush's No Child Left Behind law to better measure student progress, make room for non-core subjects like music and art and be less punitive toward failing schools, and a tax credit to pay up to $4,000 of college costs for students who perform 100 hours of community service a year. Obama would pay for his plan by ending corporate tax deductions for CEO pay and delaying NASA's moon and Mars missions.

For those who asked, here are some specifics from Obama's speech. Specifics that he laid out during his speech. Obama laid out more than 29 plans he has for America, and I echo Jay when I say if you want to know what his plans are, you can listen to the speech. But to make things a little easier, here is are some of his plans.

Economy

Obama has pledged to attack the weak economy with another stimulus plan to follow the $168 billion package of tax rebates for individuals and tax breaks for businesses that Congress passed last February. Obama's stimulus would include tax rebates, aid to state and local governments and increased spending for infrastructure projects. He would also increase spending in other areas such as alternative energy programs.

Taxes

Retain President Bush's tax cuts for families making less than $250,000 a year and provide more relief to the squeezed middle class by creating new tax breaks for lower-income families; extend the current "patch" that keeps the Alternative Minimum Tax, designed to make sure the wealthy pay their fair share of taxes, from hitting more middle-class families; exempt seniors making less than $50,000 per year from paying income taxes, expand the tax credit for college and provide incentives to encourage savings, and help pay for child care and pay mortgage expenses.

Energy

A short-term rebate of $1,000 per couple to help with rising energy costs; release of up to 70 million barrels of oil from the Strategic Petroleum Reserve, and investment of $15 billion a year over the next decade to encourage renewable energy, clean-coal technology and electric cars.

Health Care

Obama would increase the number of people with health insurance by having the government subsidize the cost of coverage for low- and middle-income families. To help pay for that expense, Obama would increase taxes for those families earning more than $250,000. He also would require employers not offering health coverage to pay a percentage of their payroll toward a national health plan. And he would mandate that children have health insurance, and expand who can participate in Medicaid and the State Children's Health Insurance Program.

Foriegn Policy

Obama says he would engage both allies and adversaries to repair the U.S. image abroad and regain leverage and leadership that he says Bush squandered. He says he will marshal international pressure against Iran, boost U.S. efforts against extremists along the Afghanistan-Pakistan border and get a faster and firmer start on Middle East peacemaking.

Defense

Pull all U.S. combat forces out of Iraq within 16 months, send more combat troops to Afghanistan and provide better care for wounded troops and veterans.

Education

An $18 billion plan that would encourage, but not mandate, universal pre-kindergarten; teacher pay raises tied to, although not based solely on, test scores; an overhaul of President Bush's No Child Left Behind law to better measure student progress, make room for non-core subjects like music and art and be less punitive toward failing schools, and a tax credit to pay up to $4,000 of college costs for students who perform 100 hours of community service a year. Obama would pay for his plan by ending corporate tax deductions for CEO pay and delaying NASA's moon and Mars missions.

Well Ryan, you're a better person than I.