Not to be controversial or against the grain, but since when was lying to get laid rape? If a guy tells me his yin-yang is 7 inches, but is really 4 when he has sex with me, is that rape? If a guy tells me he's a stockbroker, but is really a carpet salesman, is that rape?

What Jon did to Tammy, IMO, does not constitute rape. She consented, albeit, under false pretenses. But she still consented. Jon didn't force her into anything. Is it his fault she consented?

Well, put it this way... you show this episode to feminist groups and CBS gets deluged with letters and e-mail. Not that I agree with that angle, but Jon/Tammy are not Luke and Laura. My biggest problem with Jammy has been the rape issue, not the fact that they're cousins. As much as I like DK's writing, he missed the boat big time by not having Jonathan backpedal and realize what he did was wrong. It's too late now, because the show's moved forward story-wise.

Oh, and I miss the raging Jonathan when he's with Tammy. Forget all this talk about 7 inches or 4... when Jammy are together, you might as well cut Jonathan's you-know-what off.

As much as I like DK's writing, he missed the boat big time by not having Jonathan backpedal and realize what he did was wrong. It's too late now, because the show's moved forward story-wise.

Umm..wasn't that what Jonathan's first ITL was all about? While I do think they shouldn't have wrapped it up in one episode, they didn't have Jonathan completely ignore his mistakes.

Oh, and I miss the raging Jonathan when he's with Tammy. Forget all this talk about 7 inches or 4... when Jammy are together, you might as well cut Jonathan's you-know-what off.

Ehh..that's the way I feel when he's with Lizzie. Since when did Jonathan tolerate or attempt to be nice to people he doesn't really like? And after watching today's ITL (which I actually loved), I definitely could say the same thing happens when Jon's in scenes with Reva.

Hey SJ... ya, I guess you could say Alfred forced him to confront his mistakes in that ITL, but I just thought it was glossed over and they really didn't do his revelation justice. It wasn't like Roger/Holly, where they got so much mileage out of the story.

I much prefer the raging Jonathan over what's on screen now, but as long as Tom is still acting on GL that's fine with me. It will be a HUGE loss when he exits the canvas.

Yeah, they also semi-dealt with what Jonathan did to Tammy in their first barn scenes together..when they both admitted they had feelings for each other. Definitely agree more should have been done but I guess all that time Jonathan spent either hooking up with Dinah or taunting Tammy or telling her to stay the hell away from him was a hint to viewers about how deep inside, Jonathan knew he didn't deserve Tammy after all the [!@#$%^&*] he put her through.

Speaking of raging Jonathan, I loved his scenes with Remy today. I thought it was great seeing Jonathan go all JB and acting so smug about the fact that Tammy will do anything for him to seeing him wanting to hurt Remy for making threats..partly because Remy was being an upfront ass and partly because he knew that Remy was speaking the truth. That's the Jonathan I love.