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12 hours ago, cassadine1991 said:

People (especially the soap media) still bitch about them even now, especially when it comes to Howarth and Easton on GH. Funny and very hypocritical of Giddens now especially since his new show is online.

Not so much hypocritical as adaptable.  I can recall a time when big name movie actors looked down on headlining TV shows. Now we've got will smith headlining Netflix originals. 

Count me as one who thinks it's more about legitimatacy. Online equates to low budget and less legitimate as stated above. 

However, these complaints were from years ago before technology made watching online shows almost indescernable from those that are on cable or network tv. Most cable boxes allows for watching YouTube, Netflix, Hulu, etc the same way we watch CBS and HBO. And for someone like me who typically watch almost everything on TV via On Demand, its even less discernable.  

I think that opinion for soaps going online has probably changed with the times. 

6 minutes ago, KMan101 said:

 

I've been touting the online thing too. It's their best option at surviving. But no one seems to be jumping on it. AMC/OLTL were a few years too early in their jump (which sounds odd to say, I know, but 2013 was ages ago in the scheme of technology and how people were embracing it; GL would have been even earlier and likely cancelled again - just a hunch).

 

It's a shame PP bit off more than they could chew and that ABC were such asses about it all. They should have been working together.

 

I also think you answered your own question on why soap fans (not really on here) were/are hesitant for the jump to online. "Web soap" and "online show" were almost dirty words. I don't know. There was just a massive resistance. I think it's a case of people being set in their ways and seeing things a certain way.

 

Many also don't have the luxury of high speed internet or even computer access. TV, free over the air, is always going to be what people want.

 

But there's so much advantage to streaming. I'm glad to see it coming so far and streaming on the TV has brought a lot of people around. There's quite a few jumping to streaming, DirecTVNow, YoutubeTV, etc. Lots of this wasn't available just five years ago.

 

There was a stigma attached to something being broadcast online. Most people just don't like going out of their comfort zone. We as a society (not all of us, of course) prefer what we know to what we don't so people hedge off. Then they come around when it becomes more "mainstream popular".

 

I think the reaction to AMC/OLTL going online, say, this year, would be different than 5 years ago, and seven years ago when they were cancelled (can you believe it's been that long already?). Some were bitter and didn't want to follow them online. No one's ever going to be 100% satisfied, especially a soap fan

+1

Exactly this! The stigma no longer exist. 

I

On 1/31/2018 at 7:55 PM, Khan said:

Edith Wharton meets "Downton Abbey."

When I read the article, I immediately thought "The House of Mirth" and "The Custom of the Country". 

Though I'm realizing I prefer the grittier side of this time period (crime drama) to the goings on of the Four Hundred. 

Im enjoying Empire again. 

The show really needs to stop stalling this Cookie and Lucious reunion. 

Cookie is 47. I guess that's bout right but I thought she was younger. Her heart attack was good story. It was sweet to see everyone coddling her. Her son's were just sitting on the bed looking at her. She and Hakeem have come a long way. 

I binge watched so I don't know of this was discussed but Andres girlfriend being an hallucination was a twist worthy of Bernard being a host on Westworld. Brilliant! 

I do love Grace but Boo Boo Kitty has outlived her use. Had they actually married her off to Angelo and made them a couple to be reckoned with, I'd hsve been happy. But it was too little too late. 

I find myself wondering why Forrest Whittaker is some acclsined actor. As terrible in this as he was in Black Panther. Eddie and his ex wives would be far more interesting with a for more engaging actor.

I thought cookiesomma was dead. You can't go wrong with Alfre Woodard, though. So looking forward to that. 

14 hours ago, KMan101 said:

 

His new 'thing' is "Jackting" lol

 

YAY! And this season got upped to 16 episodes! Although I'd kind of have preferred they kept it shorter but as long as the quality is there ...

I'm sure that'll be just as amusing. But I wanted the nostalgia. 

Anybody watch season 2?

Ralph Angel is one more beautiful manchild. I can't stand his tantrums but love his acceptance of Blue. He talks all that big talk about the farm and then comes crawling back. And Charley just allows it without throwing it in his face. She's a far better woman than me. 

Micah's recounting of his arrest was haunting. The cops terrorize people like that every day. Evil. 

I'm loving Nova's arc this season. She's met a man with friends in high places. She's too scared of selling out that she's limiting herself. Purity is all well and good but she needs to be prepared to continue to not have resources she needs to make a a bigger impact. She's cutting off her nose go spite her face. That he's gorgeous, educated, driven, and totally enamored of her should seal the deal. That's a power couple in the making. 

Remy is sweet but I can feel Charley and Davis reuniting in the future. 

I'm super excited by this. 

JustJack was one of my favorite characters ever! 

15 minutes ago, xtr said:

 

I think that Andre latched onto Nessa, because she was really just the first woman around after he lost Rhonda. I think he mostly wanted companionship and was trying to cope with grieving Rhonda. I wish he would have met Juliana (or someone else first) and then that relationship could have blossomed into something serious and real. . I don't like the darker turn he's taken and I think his interaction with Shine has a lot to do with that. There's something very gangster-like with the way that Andre is acting these days. He's always been manipulative and sneaky but he is doing some really dark stuff this season. Like witnessing a shooting (Juliana's husband Rafael) and setting other people up to be beat/maybe killed (Angelo, Lil Romeo's character Gram). I wish he wasn't participating in these types of things. Heck, I don't think that any Lyon son should be doing stuff like this. I expect this stuff from Cookie/Lucious at times,  but I feel like the boys should be kept out of it. I am glad that Jamal isn't doing these things and that Cookie is also trying to Hakeem away from these activities as well.

 

Also I enjoyed the scene when the DuBois family was facing off with the Lyons family at the table. I wonder who exactly all of the relatives sitting at the table were. I don't like them being involved with taking Bella and believe they could have been kept on the show without them doing that. I would have liked for them to have been innocent of that and Cookie and Angelo eventually  become more amicable with each other. I wish she wouldn't have broken up with him so abruptly.  I would have liked to have seen her more conflicted in regards to her feelings for him, in addition to dealing with her feelings about Lucious. I wish she would have accepted his proposal and attempted to try and build a life with him. She still could have sparred with Julianna while planning a wedding with Angelo and before probably eventually reuniting with Lucious. Maybe Julianna will eventually start seeing Angelo or something. 

 

I think that Lucious knows that Cookie has feelings for him, but he's just playing with her right now. I don't care to see that, especially knowing that she broke up with another good man for him. I would rather just see the writers put Cookie/Lucious back together and let them be a ride-or die couple long-term than to see Cookie break up with more good men. Maybe eventually they will do that next season or by season 5. They are already trying to speed up the divorce with Anika. Maybe that will facilitate a longer term Cookie/Lucious reunion.

I think Andre wanted someone to take Rhonda's place as his conspirator and caregiver. I was proud of Nessa when she told him she was not going to take care of him in that way and that he needed to learn to do it on his own. That was very adult of her. I think Andre's darker turn is more due to his mental illness that any company he keeps. I do like it because he is far more interesting. However, it makes me somewhat uncomfortable since I think he is sick. Now, if he wasn't sick, it does make sense for him to be more like Cookie and Lucious because he is the oldest and spent much of his formative years in the same environment as his parents.

I enjoyed that Lyons versus Dubois scenes as well. There were four Dubois at the table. One was snoop's investment banker. I can't remember his first name. He is Angelo's cousin. Another great prospect for a love interest for Anika. I wanted to know who the you lady was though. I am a sucker for romance and nothing more than one between people from rival families. Andre has it in him to seduce a woman. Either he or Anika need to be planted in the Dubois family.

I understand what you mean about the Dubois. I would have liked to see them use more above board even if unethical methods. Kidnapping a child just seems beneath them. But writing wise, I get why they have been sullied. How do you redeem a big bad? You give him/her/them an even bigger bad to take down. Writing 101.

Lucious is most definitely playing games with Cookie. He is paying her back for Angelo. She doesn't deserve that. But they are being played as star crossed lovers at this point. On she is ready, he is not. When he I ready, she is not.

1 hour ago, xtr said:

 

I think that that Julianna is a good adversary for Cookie. She is sexy and beautiful and she can definitely hold her own against Cookie. Much better than Anika could IMHO.I would rather see Andre with Julianna than with Nessa. I don't care for him and Nessa. Nessa seems too "young" for him and I don't think she can fully handle him. I think he's too much man for her, lol. I thought that Trai did a really good job in his scene with Anika, and I don't feel sorry for Anika. I think he should have confronted her a while ago and she should pay in some way for killing his family. Even if it was just Andre trying to get her thrown in jail for pushing Rhonda. I hope that Bella is returned safely but I would like to see Anika get punished in some way. (Beyond being upset that Bella was taken).

 

I like the Dubois family but am disappointed that they had a hand in Bella being taken away. I wish they would have been above that. For a bit there I thought that Andre was behind it, which would have made sense, though would have hurt his relationship with his family. They could have also have had Tariq behind it. I wouldn't have minded a storyline where an on-the-run Tariq calls CPS about Bella and the Lyons fight to get her back. I would have liked if Angelo would have tried to help Cookie find her because he loves Cookie. 

 

Also, I don't like the way that they have been writing Cookie the last few episodes. I think she's coming across as weak with the way she dumped Angelo and is now pining over Lucious, while he continues to do whatever he wants to do. I wish they would have let her and Angelo be happy for a while and actually get engaged. They could have had them working together (along with Lucious) to find Bella. Then sometime next season they could have planned their wedding, only to possibly have it be interrupted in a dramatic fashion. (Or actually have them go through with it.) I don't like how Cookie is not allowed to be happy for very long with good men that love her. (Malcolm/Angelo). While Lucious continues to do whatever he wants to do with whoever. 

I like the innocence and sweetness of Nessa and Andre. He needs some lightness shone on the darkness he battles. It worked for me. You're right about Anika and cookie. Anika has an innocence about her that just makes her seem like she's not  Cookie's contemporary. I think they struggle to find a reason to keep her on the show. But that's a different conversation. 

I really want to build up the Dubois family. I'd love for Juliana to marry into that family. Her or Anika. 

I loved Cookie and Angelo. I wanted them to last longer too. I don't mind Cookie showing she wants lucious. It's been made obvious that he'd do anything to be with her. So I don't think she looks pathetic for pining for him. 

I'm really loving season 3. It's about as good as season 1 IMO. The addition if the dibois adds something to the show. I'm digging that old money vs New money battle. However, I'm not sure I buy that Lyons  don't have similar connections to get a child out of CPS or with the tire chief. I felt like these were things Lucious would have been able to do himself based on past stories 

Juliana is very sexy. Nia Long is gorgeous and plays a vamp/vixen to perfection. This is the first time I've seen her play a darker/scheming character. It's fun. 

I liked Nessa and Andre. I thought he was sincere with her. I was a bit disappointed to find out he wasn't. Assuming it's not his illness making him behave this way with her. It was surprising how easily Cookie accepted he was trying to murder Lucious. You'd think she'd have him committed after that.  Trai Byers is a star. That scene with Andre confronting Anika was menacing and scary.  It could have easily gone into cheesy but he made that work. It was really a big screen level performance from him. Well done. I still say killing Rhonda was the best thing for his character. 

Hakeem still annoys the mess out of me. That is all.

Jamal is still a singing saint. I'm over him. 

It's nice to see Lucious isn't invincible. He was becoming a cartoon villain. The Dubois were needed to make him the protagonist again versus being a thorn in his family's side who is also omniscient, omnipresent, omnipotent. 

Demos were terrible. 

It needed cancelling. 

I'm enjoying Greenleaf. 

Despite my liking Grace, I think Merle Dandridge is a weak link on the show. 

1 hour ago, YRBB said:

 

Just heard about this! SO sad, but at least I still have the second half of the season to watch.

Watch it slowly to savor it. Lol

The show won't be back until 2018 and I'm just sick about it. 

Andre is GONE! He needs help. Everyone is too focused on Jamal to see it. 

They did the lucious and Anika thing. What a disappointment! 

Angelo is Ted Kennedy. 

And it's getting to the point that Lucious is omnipotent, omnipresent, and omniscient. In other words, he's God. He was a far more interesting and compelling character when he didn't come out on top at the end of every episode. It's ridiculous. 

Long live Tikeem! 

It's been a long time since Empire was this compelling. The writers are finally hitting the proper tone that resulted in the ratings from the first season. I cried watching the show and I haven't done that since season 1. 

Phylicia Rashad was brilliant as Diane Dubois. Her wardrobe and diction were perfect. It was made even better when she code switched at the end talking about her grandfather and great grandfather. knowing that Angelo is her only child add stakes to his life. I really hope the show doesn't kill Angelo on some of Lucious' bullshit. He and Cookie are great together. Lucious deserves to lose Cookie and have to earn her back. That history on why she clings to him tells us that. 

Speaking of the history. That was needed to explain why cookie deals with Lucious and was willing to forgive all he had done. She gave up everything for him more than once. first with her father then her freedom. And this bastard lucious tried to keep the company from her when she got out. In retrospect, lucious looks even worse.  

I was loving Nessa until she decided to make Andre choose between her and Cookie. you don't make a man choose between you and his momma. she lost me there. I'm beginning to think that Nessa is just a spoiled princess type. it's all about her all the time. I've got my eye on her. 

Bella is one cute baby. 

I do not want to see Anika with Lucious. Been there, done that. No. 

Have they cast the lead yet? I'm sure she will not be black.

Edited to add: Went looking and found they cast Janina Gavankar. Isn't this similar to what happened with POI. Fired Taraji to hire an Indian or Middle Eastern woman. 

This show is a masterpiece. I haven't loved a show like this since my beloved Spartacus was cancelled. 

So, "what door". "Doesn't look like anything to me."  The twist of twists and my heart broke. 

On 11/18/2016 at 0:28 AM, xtr said:

 I was hoping that Rhonda would be alive. I had thought they would have both women survive but show one hanging over the ledge before she got rescued.( I think that the aftermath of Rhonda's death has been rushed but I am okay with Andre and Nessa)

 

I actually think that Anika is getting to the point to where she doesn't serve much of a purpose. Hardly anyone really cares about her or Bella. Lucious and her seem to be the only ones that really cares about Bella. Hakeem hasn't been shown visiting Bella often and doesn't talk about her much. I don't think Andre or even Jamal have ever been shown holding her. I believe Cookie visited her once or twice. None of them seem that interested in her.  I wish they wouldn't have made Anika become pregnant with Hakeem's baby. He really doesn't seem like he's ready to be a father.

 

I think it's kind of telling that Anika's baby ended up being a girl instead of a boy. If the baby was a male heir I feel like more people would pay attention to the child. I feel like making the baby a girl may have been done to lessen the child's importance to the family.

 

I also hope Anika doesn't end back up with Lucious. I could actually see her getting with Shine. They are interacting more and he seems to like her.

 

Also, I really like Angelo too. He's different in a good way. I think he's also sexy and I like how he treats Cookie. I would like to see him and her last a while. I think that if this were a daytime soap they would get a shot to be together for a while. But this show doesn't really let Cookie have a romantic relationship with a good man (or even Lucious since she's been out of prison) for a significant amount of time. I wish that would change with Angelo. Also, I have noticed (unless I missed it) that she hasn't been shown kissing him on the lips yet. She is always dodging kisses from him. I think that is deliberate on the part of the show.

 

I also like Jamal's counselor friend who is helping him with his PTSD. I think he is kind of sexy in a serious straight forward type of way. But I do not like trifling D-Major, lol.

 

I can't see Anika with Shine. I'd think she'd have some standards. although, for story purposes to give Cookie and Lucious a rival couple, I can see why the show would go there. I agree that Anika seems pointless. It's a shame because Grace is a gem. 

You're right about Cookie kissing Angelo. in the last episode, she says she lives him. I'm thinking the point of them not having sex is to show that their relationship is true and pure. I really hope I'm right and it's not for her to turn back to lucious "unsoiled". 

You're also correct about the baby being  a girl lessening her importance. the show even played the beat when they had Lucious upset about Anika lying to him about the sex of the baby. It's interesting that Lucious seems to care more about Bella than Cookie. Do you think there is a possibility of a rewrite with someone unrelated being her father instead of Hakeem? 

15 hours ago, MoTheGreat said:

I  figure Tiana  was  lying on that  guy because he diss her. This the best  acting that girl ever did.  But, I wonder did Andre talk to her before Lucious  went to her.

I don't think Tiana lied. I think Gram said those things and Andre used it. 

And I agree, the actress has improved alot. 

14 hours ago, Nothin'ButAttitude said:

Last night was a good episode but as others have said, this show is moving at the speed of light. At lot of these plot lines could be played out for years. 

 

This is where a good, out of work soap writer would come into play. 

 

Lee seriously needs to get an ex-writer from soaps just to help with pacing. They skip over so many potential beats by going at a rapid pace. 

Lee just hired Charles Pratt, Jr to run and write his new show Star. I fear who he'd pick if he hired someone else with a soap background. 

Star is definitely DOA. I never liked the premise anyway. then you add chuck pratt. nope! 

13 hours ago, Vanguardian said:

This show is usually painfully predictable, but something happened last night that I didn't see coming. It seems that Jamal's potential love interests know each other. I loved that reveal because it was a good soapy move. I look forward to learning the exact relationship between those two.

They know each other? I missed that  

1 hour ago, MoTheGreat said:

Once again this is moving too fast. Andre didn't suppose to reveal to Nessa until after they been together for 5 years.

You know, I didn't get why he'd trust her with such a secret so soon. but I'm  going to assume it was a test of sorts. either way, I'm digging it. Andre's sexy factor has multiplied exponentially. I just hope it's not the results of being off his meds. 

I binge watched the first 5 episodes of the season last night. And I loved it. It finally feels like the show I liked last season. Good and the bad. LOL. Cookie is less of a caricature. Lucious is still evil but has soft moments, which are very much needed so that he won't look a total sociopath.

I agree about the complaints about Rhonda and how fast they moved on. I liked Rhonda but realized the need to get rid of her. Andre was kinda boxed in being married to her. Now he is single and there are far more possibilities with his character. I am enjoying the reboot for him. He needed and has gotten far more focus this season cause of it. One of the biggest changes is now he and Hakeem can fight over women, which is a soap staple. I am sure the show would have loved to have Jamal and Hakeem do this. I noticed last night that their on air fight focused mainly on Jamal and Hakeem when Hakeem's anger was about Andre taking Hakeem's "girl". So if they could, they would. But alas, Jamal is gay. So they have no choice but to use Andre in this role. I can also see them killing Rhonda for the female demos, specifically for black women. He's is the hottest guy on the show. Fantasies must be fulfilled. And I like Nessa. She has a young Cookie vibe going. But I doubt she lasts past this season.

Angelo Dubois is a great character. I appreciate the show giving viewers another side of wealthy blackness. It is subculture that I could see some young black people might not know much about.  I grew up in rural south. One of the poorest counties in this country and I had no clue until one day when I was in college I purchased "Our Kind of People" by Lawrence Otis Graham from the bookstore  with my book stipend scholarship money. It was eye opening. So the Oaks Bluffs, Jack and Jill references were spot on. It'd be interesting to see Lucious' power collide with Angelo's power. I just do not want Angelo ruined and destroyed for Lucious to look like "the man".

I feel an Anika and Lucious hook up coming. DO! NOT! WANT! Angelo could have been a child hood boyfriend of hers that she reconnects with after the inevitable Cookie and Lucious reunion. She can convince him to fund her music dreams. He can be written to agree because of his vendetta with Lucious. If the Lyons must have a rival family then the Dubois are it.

The same thing I loved about Greenleaf, I'm loving about Queen Sugar. It's visually beautiful, tightly scripted with rich dialogue, poignantly acted, and full of southern black culture. Bravo! 

Maevis tried calling Grace several times at the end of the episode but was ignored. 

Jacob isn't paying toward anything himself. Lol. I get why he allowed it. He's a dad feeling his way after making mistakes with his family. And Zora is a teenage girl so indulges her crazy cause he doesn't want to screw it up and mess her up to have her be another Faith. 

I think Bishop is angry with GiGi cause she wouldn't allow him the moment he asked for. It's one thing to have her stepping on the toes of everyone else. It's something else altogether to have her stepping on his. 

I thought it was sad that GiGi achieved her goal in making Mac pay but had to pay a heavy price. Her life is in shambles now. Although realistic, I don't like it since Mac deserved everything he got. Including that bullet.