titan1978

I honestly think JFP just didn’t like women standing up to her, or asking questions, or demanding parity with the men. Wendy Riche is who all the extended leaves happened under. The only thing with Jill was she wanted to be gone the same time Geary was for his summer vacation, which was allowed, but she had to give more notice than he did, which pissed her off. Jill told her no, and then told her she was going to enforce her contract to deny it. Genie, like a lot of the bigger soap names back then had her own out clauses, and threatened to quit. She has said that JFP basically fired her. In the end the story was disrupted anyway and had to be changed. She said in her exit interview that she had fought hard for parity in their contracts, including the same pay, time off, etc. And that he wasn’t required to give the same length in notice for time off. This was before he was gone every quarter btw, which he negotiated in the 2000’s. He had a noticeable annual vacation and was usually gone several weeks and pre-taped. Now her maternity leave was ridiculous. And they did give her a first out filming schedule, which ruffled feathers and isolated Laura. But I also know that it touched a real nerve with her about ABC treating her differently or as expendable, and I get that even with the other issues on her part. Another post bashing JFP from me lol. But the damage in her wake, especially with strong women is just too hard to ignore. I also think she doesn’t like featuring women that are not thin or fit her definition of beauty, and Genie has struggled with her weight repeatedly. Reminds me a bit of Ellen Parker in that way. To me the issue shouldn’t have even blown up the way it did, and that rests on Jill’s inability to manage talent. She drove off Genie, Amber Tamblyn, Sarah Brown, and wouldn’t work with Vanessa in 2002. None of these women were as difficult or prone to throwing fits like Maurice and Geary. Plenty of stories of them acting out, yelling, kicking trash cans, etc. Steve Burton refusing to play love stories, nasty to scene partners. These men get away with being so awful and she listened to their demands.

I think about how sad his ending was often. Heartbreaking. If there are addiction issues, and BB’s legal filings allude to them, it could end up the best for her no longer being able to hide. Doesn’t mean she deserves no privacy, because she does. But this being so public might help break down her own delusions to herself about these issues and covering. Secrets are terrible when dealing with addiction. There is no hiding this. The length of time for housing instability was kind of shocking.

Same. Not shocked, but genuinely sad for the whole situation.

Sad to read, but not shocking. That last social media post was very strange, and her return to the show was clearly truncated after that extended leave. IIRC she told Maurice Benard she was bipolar on her State of Mind episode. I hope she gets the help she needs. She also spoke about the medical issues with her brain, which was troubling, but she may also not be a reliable narrator. I am glad for their family that Brandon seems to be stable and he clearly is concerned for KS as well as their child. Thank you for posting @ranger1rg I don’t follow TMZ.

What happened with Trina/Spencer was ridiculous! They had fans and were both actively engaged promoting the show and their storyline, yet the show sidelined them repeatedly. They did the same thing with Emma and Gio. Joss always in story, Joss always in a romance (well except now lol), etc, and wasting the rest of the young cast. I only think we see as much of them as we do now because he doesn’t have a pet to push in their age range.

Her never ending maternity leave! She also left like three times around that pregnancy. First one was when the whole family was gone for several weeks when they faked Laura’s death and found Lesley alive, end of 96-early 97. Then she left again after being back for a couple of months, and Laura/Lesley, and Lulu were all gone. She came back for a few weeks for whatever that faberge egg reveal was, looked very pregnant, and was gone until the Ball. There were rumors she was supposed to come back earlier for the Nikolas was shot story. But her return was pretty great during the ball. Bob Guza liked to write for Laura until he didn’t. He took her pitch and created Nikolas. When he came back in late 1997 and was interviewed he said he was willing to do anything to get Genie to return from maternity leave. When he came back in 2002 one of the big stories they wanted to do was whatever the original Rick story was. I don’t know if he was just fed up with stories being interrupted by her exits, or if it was mostly Jill that kept Genie from coming back. Even Geary wanted her back up to the conclusion of her second JFP era return, which is when he really settled into miserable Luke that hated having a family talk and laid the groundwork for morphing Luke into Bill. And part of that was both of them were frustrated by what they considered a corny bait and switch on them with that second wedding from her first JFP return. I have been on a real tear about JFP the last few weeks lol. Time to meditate or something.

He usually did a good job with those exits. They either just faded away, or they left town after a round of heartfelt goodbyes. You could tell they thought about the impact down the line. Phillip’s death set up Nina for years of stories, and kind of grew up that younger set of characters because of the tragedy.

He still writes and directs, according to IMBD he has a Netflix deal to create projects. That season of Night Shift was different than GH. It reminded me a little bit of Labine’s run. Like Ron Carlivati you could tell he was a fan of the 80’s GH, especially Robert. But he wanted to tell richer, deeper stories with those characters and RC wanted to tell superficial stuff with them.

Garin Wolf, like Jean Passanante, might have been really good as part of a writing team in the right role. But neither one of them should have gotten the top spot. As much as I love Patrick Mulcahey, I think he also should not have ever been a solo HW or at the top of the ticket without a pure idea person there as his equal, which Korte is not. But PM at least knows how to make a character and their words reveal their motivations, wishes, personality, etc. I was hopeful when Guza was let go. I remember the fan response and wishes for Sri Rao during Night Shift 2, and at the time that was airing he expressed interest in the main show. So there were talented writers not already washed up interested. And there was a tonal shift, but it stayed firmly in JFP’s creative wheelhouse, which is part of why she got fired too. It was also her MO back then. She tried to get rid of the HW position on OLTL, preferred weaker HW writing teams towards the end of her GL run, AW was a mess, and she brought McTavish with her to GH. Awful decisons and they showed onscreen. Guza/Pratt got associate producer titles specifically for more money and some autonomy to enforce their ideas, and she acquiesced unless something gave her the edge, like budget issues. She even tried Passanante on Y&R. Comically a bad idea! GW had stayed and gone fi-core during the writers strike, and it felt to me like his GH was just limping to a close instead of trying a shot of adrenaline. Ron Carlivati drives me crazy with his bad habits, but he and Frank tried to save the show. Jill did not, and it’s almost comical considering she is supposed to be such a great EP. We can say Frons was stopping her all we want, but he was on borrowed time after the cancellations and general distaste for his ideas, which were almost DOA, and ratings matter. Had she injected energy and used the vets like FV/RC did, who knows how different things could have been?

I don’t think he does either. He loves Brenda, and Sonny, just not together. He was smart enough to play the longing, but once he had Carly/Sonny nobody else was ever good enough there. I felt during her first return they were a little heavy handed even with the Carly/Sonny stuff. I think it’s part of why he intended Brenda to end up with Jason in 2002, and why she and Jax were always played more as a couple.

Agreed. And in true JFP fashion she hired a lackey to replace him. Which was a sign to me ABC was close to done with GH, and I was surprised it lasted long enough to outlive Frons. When they didn’t even try to look outside Guza’s team for a change in tone I was pretty certain they were just letting it and Jill limp to a finish.

They didn’t even let Suzanne go full psycho on her. It was a lot of skulling around, then she ended up killing Theo herself IIRC! Not even Brenda/Jason/Sonny! We should have gotten something more epic like the killer reveal in Scream 2 for Suzanne. I don’t want to spoil something, but then again, the movie is almost 30 years old lol. I think Guza was so distracted trying to sell Dante/Brenda that the whole thing kind of fizzled out once he got pushback about it. All that talent as far as performers and it was much ado about nothing. But that was also JFP/Guza- ashamed to have some fun because they were serious and making a drama.

Coming back to this, I can’t believe they wasted Adrienne Barbeau and Daniel Benzali on such a lackluster overall story. And then to saddle Brenda with a kid that was fathered by a dead rando instead of Jax. And as @carolineg pointed out, the time in Rome was such a waste, as was Brad Rowe. Charles Pratt is a nightmare to me as a HW, he certainly should never be in total control. But one thing he got that Guza did not was there has to be some excitement, especially on a show like GH. The pace and style of Vanessa’s first return has Chuck Pratt’s fingerprints all over it. There is plenty of Guza there too, but it had an urgency that was missing with the later return.

I love how many women have been posting about him in their lives. He seems to have been a great man who wasn’t gross with the women around him, and that’s kind of rare in Hollywood and everywhere else. And on top of that he seems to have been a real champion for them. That came through with his version of Austin, especially with Billie. Peck’s Austin was believably an idiot with Sami, and I have also heard he could be an annoying coworker. They were both hot though to teenage me. That DAYS cast was attractive and charismatic in that era!

For the twists. She’s pregnant! Who’s the daddy! Trina will find out her mom is having an affair! It’s her ex’s baby! Stalling on the DNA test! Was it tampered with? Oh no, Jordan is pregnant too?!? Maybe not! And on and on. It looks like a story but it really isn’t. She will have a medical crisis about this pregnancy at some point too. I don’t know if this current team has the stomach for a dead baby this late in her pregnancy though, so I assume she will end up with a healthy baby.

You know I did not have ye olde soap trope of the disfigured face coming back to life on GH, let alone with Jordan. It’s almost quaint to bring that one back! And @Darn that was quite the summary of what went wrong with Isaiah! He had so much promise, and now he’s just there holding Portia’s handbag. I like all of them too, even Jordan. But high drama is not a good fit for her as a performer. That GH has had this many Black actors on contract and in stories is welcome. Especially for GH, which has struggled with this in the past. Their stories are often a mess, but they do keep them in play. Even before they were afraid of BTG.

I will give Vanessa some credit that ABC just didn’t get for either of her returns. She wanted to be in story and not just there. But she didn’t want to be THE LEAD in the way Maurice did/does. She would have been perfectly content with 3 days a week, and even 2 days a week for part of the year to catch a break. They just overworked her both times based on what she was willing to do longterm. And her second return they didn’t even use her every day like the first time, but with the pace it was still more than she wanted. Total agreement!

There was no way she would have ever agreed to Dante/Brenda. Again, I don’t know what he was thinking except putting his two favorites together. And the ultimate power she wielded was the will she won’t she stay? And the answer was a year and done. I mean, in tptb’s defense, I think Maurice and Tony Geary only stayed because they thought the show was a goner and they only had a couple of years left even by that Brenda returns run. I know the fan thinking was 2012 or the show ending at 50 the following year. That was before FV and RC got the show back up of course.

Talking about Lucky/Jonathan Jackson in the main thread brought up the dark and miserable material Guza and JFP wrote for him and I got me to thinking about that time on the show. What the hell was going on? I know Frons was a problem, Jill likes depressing, and Guza loves it. But for all my problems with JFP and Guza, these people have talent and worked in soaps a long time. Why no course correction? Arrogance? The idea that the whole genre was circling the drain? Thinking they were elevating the genre? Their show was miserable towards the end. Even the Brenda return was just not fun like it was in 2002. What person thought the way Lucky spoke to Liz after the affair and burning down Laura’s house was a good idea? Then his Irish adventure which was also misery. Luke killing Danny and Tony hated the alcoholic angle so it was all a bunch of nothing? It’s like they thought Franco and getting Vanessa back was all they needed, not to look at the show and make some course corrections. Jill certainly had more fun, out of character as it could be, on OLTL and Guiding Light. I just don’t get what the mindset was there.

Oh I agree, the scheduling issues are almost all because of Valentini’s own making. I just think he was willing to do it and then more people wanted a version of it and it became more of a burden, especially since as you say, it’s not for a personal favorite actor or character he wants to feature with Lucky. And JPS is still recurring. It’s one thing for recurring, but contract players maybe not. Burton does it too IIRC, but he is more flexible from what I have heard. I am still open to a Lucky recast because I believe the character is important, I think the show should invest in Liz and her family. But it can’t be just another soap hunk type. We need an attractive man who is also more openly sensitive, not just abs and angst. Yeah it’s time to work on that too. Especially with BTG getting a two year pickup and MVJ’s open fondness of Jon. You know my wish. Mysterious and dashing man arrives with a WSB connection and Laura gets swept up in the story, slowly falling for the guy. Kevin is also falling for a fellow doctor in Paris. Neither one really breaks their vows, but end up admitting that it’s time for the marriage to end. You know, an adult storyline lol. I think I would like to see what Dan Gauthier could do with this, and with Genie.

My thoughts on JJ. I don’t think he was given or asked for story control. Asking to be in story with characters he had a connection with isn’t the same as dictating a story. We know he wanted to work with Genie and Becky, and neither one are a real priority for the current writers and Frank. So any promises there were DOA. He also wanted Lucky to be more in touch with his Luke side than the Lucky he inherited on his last run from GV. What they did with that sucked, but I don’t disagree that the GV version was sent through a more generic soap hunk path that doesn’t work for JJ or Lucky. When Luke and Laura came back Genie had several meetings along the same lines with Wendy Riche. She talked about how important Lesley was for Laura. Even in those first meetings Genie talked about the period of time Laura was with the Cassadines was potentially fertile for story. Labine had other ideas, establishing the Spencer family unit. When Guza came on, she spoke to both of them and again said that period of time would be perfect for her to have had a child, and we got Nikolas. Is that dictating story or suggesting ideas for her somewhat neglected character? JJ’s return was when Guza and JFP were practically nihilistic in the misery on the show. He was given dark material the whole time and hated it. The show wasn’t what he thought it would be, so he left. If I were him, and again saw clear signs I wasn’t going to be acting with Becky that much, or Genie, and was going to be paired with Kristina, I would probably want to go too. I ultimately think JJ and Kristen Storms living situations caused more scheduling problems than they were worth, and that ultimately is why both of them are off contract. JJ because he wasn’t a priority even though they made those promises, and KS because she’s not reliable to schedule. I think that had way more to do with what went down than any story demands. And yes, a lot of this was forced on Frank. Varni became involved again, and IIRC posted that GH was going to be recognizable to longterm fans again. This was either right before or after the primetime 60th special, which was the announcement about Steve coming back, and they had already been making changes when Roger got fired. Then Mulcahey was hired. I absolutely think pushing for Lucky and Lulu’s returns was not a Frank thing at all. Getting rid of Sam was all him though lol.

That was a truly special memorial, like the ones we used to get in the 90’s. The BJ Angel with the original actress was a wonderful touch. I though Monica’s memorial was awful compared to that one, except for maybe a couple of scenes with Jason and Tracy. I don’t want to take anything away from Norma because she was a grounded actor that did solid work for her entire run. But it wasn’t just the actor. Back then the hooker with the heart of gold was a common storytelling trope, as was the wrong side of the tracks stories. Soaps did them often. Off the top of my head there were several on AMC, DAYS, OLTL, etc. They just didn’t write about the true ramifications of the life like they would now, especially with Bobbie, Luke, and Ruby. It would sometimes bubble up, but they played it like it was hard, it was awful, but Ruby had saved them. That’s hard to take at face value now, and the greater audience is also unwilling to allow for nuance. It’s black and white now and that’s not how it was played for decades.

IIRC several people contributed to the selections.

Somewhere during Riche it almost seemed like the docks got gentrified. It became more the pier set, and the launch to the island when people came and went from Wyndemere. They deliberately made those sets look nicer. If anything, the sets they have been using for the docks/warehouse district under Valentini now look more shady, like where Rocco just shot Callum. It’s the only set that isn’t brightly lit! I don’t really think of Kelly’s as being in any way rough and tumble anymore once Liz worked there. Jagger was introduced robbing the place, and Lucky being chased out of Kelly’s by Frank Smith’s thugs when he arrived wasn’t a big deal. Now it’s just really bland and Carly pouring coffee is ridiculous.

I never understood until the internet why it was called Kelly’s or who Rose, Paddy, or Joe Kelly were. And as a little kid I did see parts of Laura’s return from the dead, and I remembered stuff with Lesley, but nothing about the OG Kelly family! I think that’s why it was so memorable and had such an impact. IIRC it was even named in either Soap Opera Weekly or one of the other soap mags in one of those best soap moments of all time lists they used to do every few years. I loved those issues and really wish I had save those soap mags now. That was where I first heard about Heather and the LSD, it was on one of those lists in like the top 20!