P.J.

12 hours ago, Joseph said:

@DramatistDreamer Hope it refershes your memories! saw this just Yesterday!

SO Happy I Found These! The 4K is obviously Enhanced BUT The original Quality was certainly HD!

 

I would Love Help Finding Colleen's Emmy Reels, Any idea of when it aired?

Found it----it's 2/12/01. 

21 minutes ago, Joseph said:

@DramatistDreamer Hope it refershes your memories! saw this just Yesterday!

SO Happy I Found These! The 4K is obviously Enhanced BUT The original Quality was certainly HD!

 

I would Love Help Finding Colleen's Emmy Reels, Any idea of when it aired?

I can't be sure, but Colleen's might have aired 11/10/2000.  Recaps of the episode say she and Hal had a fight over Craig. I'm pretty sure the scenes would've aired after the Halloween party that Craig threw that year. Barbara had asked for Craig's help getting an envelope addressed to Jack away from the courier (it held a picture of Julia and Winston Lowe) for Julia.  But the episode isn't quickly found on youtube.

I wish her nothing but the best, but we all know she deserves more than she'll get. 

Marie seems to have lasted a year or less, the book only lists her for 1985. Tad is listed as 1986. (I had forgotten there were two Tads.) I couldn't tell you for certain if Doug and Iva ever had a scene, but since Caroline's opened, I would guess they might've had a few lines. Marland wasn't a big "wink wink" , Easter Egg kind of guy from what I remember.

I'm not sure you can blame PR for that. Marland wanted suspicion to fall on everyone other than Doug.

37 minutes ago, DramatistDreamer said:

Oh, I see. John was probably suspicious of Lisa as well then. Man, that storyline started out in such a meandering way. Remember the promo featuring Barbara blowing the rape whistle? Or was that a different year? I think that may have been somehow thought of as being tied to the stalking story too? 

LOL...my memory's not that good..but wasn't Babs trying to hold on to Brian at that point? It might explain some dramatic rape whistle scenario. I did read in the ATWT book that Marie's baby was Tad Channing's, and that Iva was questioned, and she admitted she had also been having an affair with Tad. 

Also, Lisa suspected John was trying to cause trouble between Bob and Kim. Lisa was admitting to Babs she still loved Bob and that Ellen noted that the "gifts" always seemed to show up while Lisa was around. I couldn't find a specific reference to the card, but I know it tied into the lyrics of Someone to Watch Over Me, as it was a picture of a lamb and shepherd.

11 hours ago, DramatistDreamer said:

From what I can recall, Lisa seemed to be very suspicious of John Dixon in the case of Kim’s stalker. There was a Christmas card that was sent to Kim that aroused suspicion and unease and appparently, John sent a similar card? I am think, either they all purchased their greeting cards from the same places or it was those holiday greeting cards that came in a pack that were somewhat generic and likely looked a lot alike.

In terms of the Marie Kovacs murder, there seemed to be a few would be suspects but the main suspect was Kevin Gibson, Frannie’s soon to be ex-boyfriend, who was so exasperated by the antics of Marie that he angrily declared in a room full of people, that he could just choke her.

I wouldn't doubt Lisa suspected John, but I think the Christmas card Kim received was the same one Lisa was sending out that year.

4 hours ago, DeliaIrisFan said:

Watching that episode when Iva came home (thank you again for the link, @MarlandFan) right after binging everything else I could find on YouTube from the Doug Cummings saga made me wonder - was Iva a red herring in Marie's murder/Kim's stalker mystery at some point?  When Emma asked Iva where she had been all those years, I caught that she listed a city in Colorado (Denver?), where Doug took Frannie and Kim hostage, as well as New Haven, where Marie claimed she was leaving town to go back.

Of course, Lucinda was also getting mysterious phone calls at the time.  I'm not sure how obvious it was that Iva was responsible, and/or if it might have seemed possible that the same person was calling Kim and Lucinda.  And in one of Meg's early scenes arguing with Emma, she asked obnoxiously, "After all these years, how do you even know she's really Iva?"

Again, I'd be fascinated to see how all those mysteries (and everything else at the time) played out alongside each other, day to day.

I can't speak to whether Iva was a red herring in Marie's murder, but I distinctly recall we were led to believe it was Shannon calling Lucinda re: Lily.

3 hours ago, DramatistDreamer said:

 

There is some cognitive dissonance on Kim’s part, of course but that was probably a very human realistic, far from perfect side of Kim.

In a strange coincidence, I also happened upon a Susan/Kim fight (which must have been early in Marie Masters' return) where Susan brings up Kim's acquiring daughters through marriage (Betsy and then Frannie) and then winding up with Bob's illegitimate child back in her life. 

I guess I had kind of forgotten how protective Kim could be of her kids. 

On 11/7/2023 at 7:35 PM, MarlandFan said:

 

Thanks for posting! I doubt I ever saw that, given I was probably in school. I had read about Iva not getting a warm reception from Emma, but YIKES.

My guess would be Iva lost her spunk to be a direct contrast to Lucinda and thus Lily's "best mom/friend". 

Oh, I got lost down a youtube rabbit hole, and saw Kim give Seth true smoke for falling for Betsy. DAMN. Seth Snyder, the most empathetic,  zero attitude guy ever in Oakdale, got a "kiddo" speech from Kim, who slept with her sister's husband. I am flabbergasted.

58 minutes ago, DRW50 said:

Everything said earlier in the thread about how much ATWT and soaps suffered from trying to still cling to old patterns in the OJ era is so true. ATWT was based on complex friendships and family dynamics - they did have one of the first soap supercouples (Penny and Jeff) but that wasn't their calling card. ATWT trying to still cling on while running away from the family units and complicated histories and becoming whatever mutated '80s primetime soap the show was trying to be for so much of the mid/late '90s (aside from some of the stronger moments of 1995) was unfortunate. I remember disliking Mike and Rosanna so much, but assuming they were loved by viewers with how heavily pushed they were. Only years later when I read more soap magazines from that period did I learn they weren't ever very popular. All that for nothing.

ATWT was clearly trying to recreate Lily/Holden and ride Shawn Christian's popularity. Of course, the best thing to come from the Ro/Mike relationship was Carly. LOL. 

18 hours ago, Paul Raven said:

Donald Hughes was also onscreen in 1980 when the Dobsons arrived. So they had the two brothers template, one a doctor and one a lawyer, similar to the Bauers.

But I think Don and Bob were pretty similar by that stage.

But IIRC, Don was gone shortly thereafter. It doesn't feel like his character was ever well-defined. Certainly not the same kind of impact Mike Bauer had on GL. If there was ever any kind of rivalry between Bob and Don, it certainly got overshadowed by Bob and John's animosity.

What? Bert was certainly no slouch in the vinegary-interfering mother department. If Nancy was seen as a bit colder, maybe it was because she didn't have the obstacles (broken marriage, health problems) that Bert did. 

I think the structure of Guiding Light at the time allowed the Dobsons to keep the Bauers "front and center". (Although there were probably viewers who saw the Spauldings and Marlers as interlopers) Mike and Ed were diametric opposites, each who generated story. When the Dobsons took over ATWT, they didn't have that with the Hughes, who at that time consisted of Bob, Tom and teenage Frannie. 

On 10/14/2023 at 12:41 PM, OzFrog said:

Been revisiting the early 1984 episodes involving the culmination of Steve/Betsy/Craig. The 2 and a half minutes starting at 44:00 in this episode is to this day one of the most emotionally gripping clips I’ve ever watched in daytime soaps. Scott Bryce and Anne Sward were just amazing here…

 

And also the 3 minutes of this one starting at 21:55… this is what soaps are all about…

 

And scenes like those were why I could never buy the regression of Craig in the '00s.

I believe Cricket's cousin's name was Skip, but that's neither here nor there.

Frannie had led the teen set before Lily came to town. I would guess maybe Lily was brought on to give Dusty someone his age to interact with? I'm wracking my brain to try and remember...but other than Paul and Andy, who were younger, what kids were on canvas. 

Lily was supposed to be some kind of moral center of the show (or one in training). She was especially Lucinda's judge, which in retrospect is kind of silly. She some how managed to be every man's ideal, so much so it was refreshing when Duke treated her like the brat she was. 

The break from Martha was good for the show, much like the break GL got from Kim Zimmer in the early '90s. Although they tried recreating the Lily/Holden dynamic with both Rosanna/Hutch and Ro/Mike.

13 hours ago, DRW50 said:

I think that period of time had some of the strongest Lily/Holden stories in terms of writing (Angel's struggles, the Walsh takeover, Lily's miscarriage, The Truth About Aaron). Martha and Jon had more chemistry, but I never thought most of their stories together were that interesting, even with Marland there. 

(I'm one of the few who never understood why Lily would choose Holden over Dusty)

I agree, it was stronger writing, and I'd actually argue the writing shone more because it wasn't Byrne in the role. I think DM had a huge blind spot where MB was concerned, and stories usually tilted to "fix" things to make Lily's life easier. I mean, the Snyders had to "accept" Josh so Lily could get to know her father. 

Rattray at least tried to be more mature in the role. Byrne would inevitably end up stomping and yell-crying through emotional scenes.

On 9/27/2023 at 8:03 PM, soapfan770 said:

 

I was also tempted to list KMH’s Emily on ATWT as well but that’s a strange case as well. Even though KMH  Emily lead for years    she just wasn’t in the same league as say Carly and Lily. 

I'd say KMH. In later years she had fans of Hal/Emily and Em/Paul, but I don't remember many EmilyFirstFans, per se. Her Emily was just a little too acidic for my taste. I'd put Lesli Kay in the same group. Before her pairing with Jake, she didn't seem to impress viewers.

Well, tbh, Rattray didn't have romantic chem with anyone. I think he had to at least try to manufacture Lily/Holden chem, given the years of investment the show had in them. Granted, it was his fault ATWT was so heavily invested in Holden and Lily as a young lead couple, but still. It's not like Rosanna and Hutch were burning down the house.

The first real time I just gave up a soap was Y&R, when they spent an entire episode recapping Nina's trial on a Monday, when they verdict had come in on Friday. I know I would at least watch now and then, but I never loved it again the way I had. I even tried going back after ATWT was cancelled, to see Maura. But they killed off her character, violently, in a way that seemed almost gleeful to be rid of her, and I have never turned it on again.

I can't even pinpoint when I gave up on GL. The last five years maybe? I still turned it on, but it was like watching someone die a slow painful death. The show became obsessed with Gus and Jonathan, and those "Inside the LIght" episodes quickly grew horrible. Peapak might have been underwhelming, but the soul had left the body long before that.

B&B---I stuck around much longer than I should have. Maybe the weird Brooke/Ridge tropical wedding, where Ridge was then presumed dead shortly after the ceremony so that Brooke could knock boots with Nick 10 seconds later? At some point I realized B&B was more invested in keeping them apart by any means necessary than writing for them as a couple.

On 9/20/2023 at 9:49 PM, Soapsuds said:

Here is one of the episodes that week. Nothing really happening that week.

 

It's funny how much I've forgotten, but how the characters still feel like home. LOL, this is the Holden I remember, not the ever-patient dad-to-half the town dude he became.

5 hours ago, Soapsuds said:

@P.J.

 

Thanks! I hadn't heard about this!

SMH. Linc/Lily/Holden, torrid? Oookkkaayy. I wonder what boosted them to tie with GH? ohh, maybe the reveal of Brock's murderer? I'm trying to remember what was happening, in the early '90's. 

On 9/17/2023 at 11:09 AM, Soapsuds said:

I used to LOVE articles like that. And the yearly review they'd do. Back when SOD was a magazine.

14 hours ago, Soapsuds said:

Same

I vaguely remember my mother and I watching Steve/Betsy/Craig story and I was a big fan of Barbara and Gunnar.

Me too! Gunnar was so dashing! At least to my tween self! 

Most of y'all make me feel so old.

CBS soaps were always on when I was a kid. So I have vague memories of Love of Life, Search for Tomorrow, Young and the Restless (pre-Victor, I swear I remember Philip Chancellor Sr and Katherine and the crash that killed him), ATWT (Bob and John constantly battling for the Chief of Staff position and Kim/Dan/Susan though the only Dan I remember is John Reilly.) and Guiding Light (Rita and her sister Evie, Martin Hulswit's Ed and Mike).

But the stories that I really got me hooked were Morgan/Kelly/Nola on Guiding Light and Steve/Betsy/Craig on ATWT. I think it was the combination of adolescence/good actors in the right roles/writing.