P.J.

And I'm loathe to dig into late '94 (phooey to MrGigolo) and get the deets. They treat Vanessa's sex life (post Billy) like one long Desperate Housewives level joke.

There was a weird point where they tried to Spaulding-ize him, and it just doesn't work. I caught something where (after he's married to Mindy) he's trying to trap Vanessa into a bad business deal (and/or blackmail her over her sleeping with Matt) for some unknown reason, and it makes him look like a real pig.

I know her bitterness started with Roger, but I think it focused on Mindy because of who Mindy was---as Alex said at one point---Mindy had been like family to her through her friendship with Phillip and Beth (as well, perhaps, her brief marriage to Phillip) not to mention Alex's relationship with HB. As well as the fact that people close to Alex (Vanessa and Beth) knew about the affair and didn't tell her. But I agree re: Mindy&Nick they weren't all that, even though I know P&G promoted the hell out of them.

Given that this show is not even six weeks old, I don't think it's unreasonable to want some of these plot points to percolate before everything's resolved. I would've preferred to see more than one or two instances of Chelsea resenting Dani's "momager" moments, and her struggle to tell Dani before "BOOM" Dani (who is still hanging on to the ashes of a lousy marriage) is just all mature enough to be ok with Chelsea leaving her. For that matter, why isn't Chelsea's POV re: Bill and Hayley explored?

I'm not sure that's unpopular, given how it all shook out. Neither Hamilton or Crampton was a good recast. They could've simply stuck Eve with Nick and played out her nutso behavior until Alexandra came back. I don't think Mindy was really vital to the canvas at that point, although it would've eventually been awkward to send Billy off to jail without some kind of presence from Mindy. They could've even shifted Nick toward Holly, given that I felt some chem there, but maybe that's just me. Or played Ed/Holly more.

I mean, I know. And at the time the awards were much more geared to honoring established actors with years of experience behind them. I just think it's a shame, when it's such a powerful, iconic moment.

I swear I remember Bea walking through the doors to Ed's patio and announcing to Nola that she'd told Kelly during the Kelly/Nola confrontation, but I was completely wrong! It's nice to have the entire episode up. I can't recall having seen the Bea/Nola part up anywhere. I'm not sure even the Quola fans had that.

lol...me too. No one got under Van's skin like Nola. As a reliable source of info, no Fletcher didn't annoy me. Although I'd classify him as familiar rather than a "comforting" presence. It's when they pushed him into a romance that set my teeth on edge. Fletch got "yelly" and presumptuous when he got involved. He's downright clingy and self-righteous with Vanessa, although I do recognize that part of that is that deep in his soul he knows Vanessa's just not that into him. No matter what she says. It's also one of Jane Elliot's first appearances as Carrie. And there's a scene with Henry and Vanessa, where they discuss she's being blackmailed, which I didn't realize that he knew.

it's back. air date 7 27 81

Lisa is practically the entire episode. After Kelly chews her out, Nola tries playing victim with Bea and Tony, and Bea just isn't having any of it. It is literally a crime that Lisa wasn't even nominated for it.

The part about Marland coming back and writing the Kelly/Nola confrontation does sound a little familiar. OMG...I just rewatched it. It's literally 15 minutes long. Perfection barely begins to describe it.

Ugh...blatant is right. I don't remember Fletch with Ben much, actually. Which is odd, since they often made such a big deal about how hard raising a kid on his own was. I know while he was involved with Alex, she became attached to Ben. Ben is around a little more when Fletch dates Vanessa, but not a huge amount. I know Greg Burke said he remembered them hanging out with Holly, so I'm guessing it's around '94-'95? Morgan and Kelly had had sex in the summer of '80. Nola had helped her get the birth control pills (that Jennifer found) as a result. Kelly and Morgan married in August of '81, which is also a little creepy. There was a writer's strike in '81? I've forgotten...

Kristen Vigard. Around September 1980, Morgan ran away after having a fight with Jennifer (Jennifer had found her birth control pills). She wound up in Chicago and walked right in to a pimp named Duke. He was about to rape her, but Kelly saved her. Duke went to jail, but busted out in the spring of '81. He kidnapped and raped her the week of April 20th, according to the TV Guide recap.

I admit, I don't get it. I mean, I disliked Nadine, but even I felt a tinge of sadness she got whacked. I loathed Jenna, and cried buckets at her death. One of the few times I was unaffected by a rape storyline was Emily Stewart's on ATWT. But I had years to build up my dislike of the actress that played into that. I will say, Guiding Light didn't overuse the rape trope (although other soaps did, I recall distinctly DAYS getting called out on having all of their heroines raped). I'm probably forgetting something, but there was Rita, Holly, Morgan and Beth in the late '70's-early'80's, and then it was years before Vanessa's attempted rape in '92, then Lucy's in '94 (or '95).

There may have been an element of Guiding Light burn out going on. In the early '90's, Ellen Parker and Maeve Kinkead won supporting actress, Deas and Jerry ver Dorn won supporting actor (JvD back to back years), Deas and Zaslow won Lead Actor, Melissa Hayden won younger actress, and Monti Sharp, Kevin Mambo and Rick Hearst won younger actor (not to mention, Bryan Buffinton, bless his sweet face was a perpetual nominee). Zimmer had won lead actress in '90, and Maeve Kinkead, Marj Dusay and Maureen Garrett had been nominated. In looking, I think I know why---Satra would've been 28, meaning she'd have needed to submit in supporting, not younger lead. The younger lead nominee from GL that year was Kimberly J Brown. the Supporting Actress noms that year were Anna Holbrook, Rosalind Cash, Victoria Rowell, Tonya Williams and Michelle Stafford. Anna Holbrook won.

Fletch was that utility player that sticks around because other players move from team to team. And other than Maeve (and perhaps Alexandra) he dated the ladies of the town as a placeholder (like Ralph Bellamy) in the story. Good grief, before Chelsea leaves, they banter, which we all know was a precursor to romance. Oy vey. If any regime had had staying power, they probably would've tanked Fletch after Maeve died.

Yeah, sometimes I wonder if he liked Ellen Dolan more, or didn't like Ellen Parker, or just got bored in the role. But there's a definite shift, even for PS, who I wouldn't call the warmest presence in town.

well, then Crampton was there for two years. I believe her first episode is May 1st '93. I know she did have scenes with Jordan before he exited that year. I think what Hammer's referring to is Reva's shower when she was pregnant with Marah. So Sheri Anderson. I don't blame them---I'd have liked to shut Fletcher up multiple times too.

Well, yikes. Honestly, while I don't dislike Crampton, she just never fit in to the Lewis family. GL would've been better off sticking with Hamilton through the climax with Eve, then take the time to recast.

Nope, never did. But just from the pictures I've seen, she seemed seven feet tall. Mindy needed to be a petite blonde. Sorry, I'm biased. I think if Kim Simms had returned, Mindy would've taken an entirely different direction. Part of the problem with Barbara Crampton was she generated no chemistry with VI. Even though I didn't particularly like them, KS and VI had chem in spades.

Good grief, did anyone appropriate for the role audition? Sonia and Ann were too young. Barbara Crampton (who came in later) was all kinds of wrong. That role wasn't uncastable, fcol.

lol..I gues they'd put it in the right thread though. The younger cast all looks the same age to me.

No, Long was gone from GL by '91. *unless you meant Walker/Long on SB.

who does the actress playing Naomi remind me of? It's driving me a little crazy. Some of the actors seem to be easing into their roles finally. The dialogue is better in spots, but there's still a good amount of clunky garbage. Sigh...am I the only one annoyed that the timeline seems off? Anita mentioned (I think) that she and Bill met in 1973. 52 years ago. If Martin wants to run for president, that means he has to be 35 in 2028 (he doesn't look old enough to be now). That means he'd have to be born in 1993, and the oldest Nicole could've been is 20 by that timeline. Uh...what?

I think all shows do. But I also think that the acting core was stronger when Kim left, than it had been for a while in the late '80s.