Mitch64

Iva's return...when she had some fire and edge and wasn't perpetually depressed and depressing. They even dressed her differently. I wonder why Marland chose that path for Iva..she was much more fun as a Snyder outsider with an edge.

1994 was the year it all started to fall apart (both for the show and for Roger and Holly...) I really hated how they put them together as a couple, even living in Hollybend together...yes, they got past a lot of stuff, but not to the point of being in relationship. It just screwed over all the years that GL built showing that Roger did indeed rape Holly, and while he regrets it, that changed their whole dynamic for ever and it can never be forgotten. Plus, they were boring.... And yes, it was just as ridiculous they way they broke them up...all of a sudden she screws annoying Fletcher on her desk and its all about him. Roger and Holly were the ultimate soap couple that could never be apart, yet never be together. If it wasn't for that one decision Roger made, they MIGHT have stood a chance, and that regret would haunt Roger and make him who he was, and the same with Holly. Again, I love them thrown into each others orbits, sometimes conspiring together and sometimes against each other. The twins was the perfect time to do that, with Holly getting Roger to switch the paternity results to name Ross as the father to both, and that secret binding them. But then McTavish went nuts and put them back to square one, with Roger being EVIL and Holly hating him (and being very self righteous about it.)

I remember watching it in the student union in between classes (the last half) back in the day where the three TV lounges were tuned to different networks...this was before spoilers and the room went into an uproar with James' now soap iconic line. This football player LOVED ATWT and GL and he was screaming "James f*cking Stenbeck..Barbara girl look out!!!" The show was so good then..still a little campy and fun. I love Margo browbeating Lisa but it doesn't seem to be a Lisa thing to just give in so easy.

Brad was skulking around the property (running tests) and met Annie who was sulking about some breakup. Bob and Lisa knew him as his dad was friends of theirs ( a point quickly dropped) and Brad using his supposed charms got Lisa to push the Hughes to sell the land which then Brad announced that he found silver. Then the Hughes were mad that Don was going to work for Brad..setting up a storyline but that was dropped. It jus was weird and the character never worked. I have no idea why they did not have James do all of those shenigans and just have Brad work for him. They also started a storyline where David is flush with cash from the mine and buying things and Ellen is against it but that was dropped. I still don't get why Brad married Annie if he was always mopping about Dee. T

Agreed, when the Dobsons came on board there was Nancy, Chris, Bob, Don (engaged to Mary) Tom, child Frannie and discussion on Penny (so Marland thinking of bringing her back?) I think Marland started the back from the dead Joyce (interestingly called Coleman, not Hughes tho still married to Don.) So they had a whole core to work with. I think they were trying to turn Don back into the renegade Hughes as he was going to represent Hollister (who gyped the Hugheses out of their land.) It didn't work as they would have had to recast Don..which would have been fine and interesting..though I think they had Grant and Don both as middle aged lawyers involved in the same storyline so I can see the issue there. By the time the 25th rolled around in April, the Dobsons decimated the core, firing Don, obscuring Nancy and Chris who became walk ons and Wagner left, leaving only Bob and Tom, and recast Tom barely had any interaction with his family..that was all on the Dobsons. You can't blame the network and P & G entirely...Marland was still writing for the Bauers, and introducing the Reardon's with a traditional matriarch..(and we know 4 years later her would return the Hughes to their place) The Dobsons just didn't care about the Hughes enough to fight to keep them the core..and you're right, they didn't know what to do with the show. I think the Dobsons second tenure was more successful because of Bunim..(not that she gave a crap about the core.) And thank you to whomever got rid of "horny" Brad..note to the Dobsons, your romantic hero should not be as scuzzy as your villain in the triangle. John had motivation...Brad was a scuzzy serve stalker!

I HATED Folly, but I really didn't like Jay Hammer and they tried to shoehorn Fletcher with every diva and I felt it didn't work. He did have nice friends chem with Zimmer in the early years but that was about it. However, I didn't like Roger and Holly "together" he raped her and abused her. They should have always been in each others lives as they share a history, daughter, grandchildren a dangerous attraction, but not as a couple. But then, I never felt Jeva was healthy either. Hammer used to walk all over Garrets lines..and he just became almost as insufferable to me as Deas/Buzz. I do think they had fans but really, the chairs in Company probably had some wacko fan base.

Hated that dumb ass episode...just so Davey could stroke one to Ehlers abs!!

I could have gone with it, but they needed to play all the beats which they were not willing to do. McTavish played it as a comedy at first..(ha, ha..I just slept with my stepsister who is now married to my Dad's best friend, and who is a surrogate uncle to me..ha..ha..) and gave MOL the chance to work his worst tendencies in acting..mugging or being overbearing. They also needed Ed and Roger and Holly to be involved more and to bring up their own history. I would have played it that Rick felt real morose for what he did, and for Blake to be Blake and write it off as a mistake until she found out the pregnancy thing...then to rope Roger and Holly into switching the tests to make it look like Ross's kids. Roger would be disgusted that his grandkid was going to be a Bauer, Holly would warn Blake about the mistake of lying to men about their child...but then do it after Blake pulls the guilt card. So Rick would move on not knowing (with Abby or someone else.) and then somehow finds out, tells Ed about it, but they resolve to let Ross and Blake continue on as the parents until the [!@#$%^&*] really hits the fan and everyone knows. Ross would be angry at the two most important people in his life Blake AND Ed, Ross would fall into someone else's arms (I would bring back Hope Bauer for this) Blake would fall into someone's arms (soap people can't solve a problem unless they screw someone) I would make that Matt..(just cause I would love to piss off the Blossies AND the Mattresses) Roger would be determined that Rick would have nothing to do with his grandkid...Holly and Fletcher would have issues that she was conspiring with Roger still. The eventual solution would be for Rick to let Ross raise both kids as his own, but it would always hang out there..until they are SORASED . Yea, they had it that Annie switched the tests but it was a retro write. ..Annie would have no reason at the time to do that, she was as shocked as Blake and why would Annie want to hurt Rick anyway. Sloppy. No..the show was so screwy at that time the curly haired kid was Ross!

Nancy Hughes was always a more cold, dominate matriarch...so I don't think it was as much execs as it was the Dobsons as Bridget would always airly say they "Write what they feel, and what interests us and no one else." It would have bene interesting to see writers evolve Nancy more.to see her gradually see that she she can let go of her family a bit more and have another interest..I think she also should have been the one more aggressively angry with Joyce then Lisa..(she shot her kid) and show her trying to block Joyce's access to that kid and ride Joyce...all the right reasons (Joyce was neurotic and unreliable) to show her iron fist..and I am sure more fun for Wagner then being a walk on and serving coffee.

I think that I am the only person who likes Keifer of the previous actress. I thought SS played Blake over the top and campy, and didn't really find her that sexy..no offense, but she always seemed like a big strapping girl especially next to skinny little AM...(my favorite Alex lines..."And Alan Michael can you pick that MOOSE off the floor!") I think the problem was that "BLOSS" took over...Ross and Blake should never have been end game...and the writers took away all of Blake's agency..she didn't have a job, (I remember episodes of her just having out at that ugly diner...) and then she was saddled with that "Jelly of Amanda, so I get drunk and screw the guy I used to think was my older brother" and the bad twins storyline and from then on out, even with Ben, she was tied down. I think Keifer did well as a woman who tried to get over her f*cked up childhood but kept making mistakes. They could have developed that more with her trying to be a mom to her kids unlike her own mother, and like everyone, not doing as well as she thinks she should...but they just kind of made Blake a flighty eccentric nobody.

I never understood how the Dobson's kept the Bauers the center of things while obscuring the Hughes family. I do think that GL has always been more...wacky and free spirited than ATWT (part of why I loved it more) but you have to write for the style of your show. I think it may have been harder to write for a more domineering matriarch (who wasn't evil) like Nancy Hughes as opposed to the perky, cheerful Bert Bauer..it wasn't until Marland that Nancy became more of a stereotypical soap grandmother...( I think it would have been fun and interesting to write for a strong willed woman witnessing the world and her family changing but it soaps you're either a good matriarch or a bad manipulative one. ) I think the Dobsons were so successful in the supposed "con temporization" of GL that they became full of themselves and had free rein at ATWT. But the writing, even at its most successful was shallow...James was never the grey villain that Alan was, Betsy was a stupid young heroine living for her men,Dee was so wispy and..just there.. there was not a Rita or Holly to be found SB has its fans and that was great, and the Dobsons were free to do what they wanted as it was their soap. Funny though when they got canned and Pam Long tried to make it GL-California and it did not work. What goes around comes around Jerry and Bridget. True..but it also just showed how insipid the shows had become with its focuses on super couples...the O.J. trial had it all, family dynamics, sex, betrayal, a cast of eccentric supporting characters, mystery and unfortunately murder (and a final twist no one saw coming.) Then the soaps doubled down on their "formula" as they were afraid to change and it all went from there.

Terrible what they did to him during that time...Wagner said that he started to get ill because he was taken off of contract. They could have at least had him give the toast. This is around the time that Fulton was fighting with Bunim and right before she left. She went red to "draw attention to herself" and..well, it was not the best look for Lisa. But this is also the time she started really leaning into the "jittery, fluttery, ditzy" side to Lisa...I'm glad that was gone when she came back. The Tom and Margo clip makes the annoying triangle of Craig/Betsy/Steve pale in comparison. Margo and Tom are both self directed people with jobs, and cause problems with each other due to their strong personalities...Craig is obsessed with Betsy, Betsy is a fool who apparently does not work, go to school or have anything else going on in her life but the men in it, and Steve is an annoying blow hard. I can't believe Kim did not give all three of them "kiddo" speeches. I think the grandma clause was still in Fulton's contract? It's also interesting, knowing Colin's antiabortion activity, that Margo seems very adamant against abortion. I forgot that I used to think Deas was hot...and could not figure out why after watching him play that troll Buzz, but I can see it here. He is totally in LOVE with Margo/Colin and it does not come off as desperate (Craig) or controlling (Steve) or sappy sweet like Babs and Gunner. It just seems natural that this man totally loves this woman, even if they both can be pains in the ass. I don't know if its was Colin who brought it out of him (I never saw that with Buzz and anyone else) or the character of Tom (Deas amazingly plays Tom as temperamental and offbeat, but also as a sweet guy who just wants to have a wife and family, an interesting combination of Lisa and Bob and he somehow makes it work. ) The Dobsons did not know what to do with any Hughes outside of Tom, so they just married Bob off. During this time they also had Kim flirt with Stan, some boring FBI agent or something that she actually became his secretary. I loved that they wrote boring "Bilan" out with a telephone call and having her sell tickets at a theater in Florida...what a weird way to write a character out.

I think it was ageism, plus Long's issues with the Bauers...and the fact that Reva had a strangle hold on a blond heroine of that age...even though Hope and Reva were completely different. I liked that they gave Van some of her edge back..I remember a Peacock scene with Vanessa, grey hair, glasses and..non glam clothes...threatens Mel of all people "I realize that you don't know me that well, so you don't realize I am not someone who will not retaliate.." (or something like that...)She was still ice cold in a way Marj would never be. I just wish they had replaced Van for Alex later on..she had much more story to tell with three kids on canvas, holdings in Spaulding so she could take the Spaulding's on for control...( I would just have gotten rid of stupid Lewis Oil.) Marland made a really dumb choice to replace this Ed with PS..as much as I like PS and think he was a good actor, he was too cold to be a Bauer. And yes, Rita was sexy as hell, so we know why SHE never came back...Zimmer would have sh*t her pants.

I love that sexy Rita knows the "back entrance by the pool so you can by pass the lobby" as you know she has been there more than once! Despite her outfit, I love devious Van and don't know why instead of recasting Alex they didn't have Vanessa partially return to her old ways. They could definitely have done it during Rauch's time when they fired Marj...and Van returned....anything to get her away for sighing away with boring Matt! Oh how the show screwed up by not recasting Mike and Hope at anytime. "You KNOW how intimidated Alan is by Mike Bauer" then in later years they only had Alan go up against....Buzzard! I love the old 4th floor nurses station and all the action...love sneaky Nola great times on the show.

It fits the pattern and I don't know that they fought it all that hard...MADD still felt that the Clone was their biggest success. It also had to come from Rauch on a certain level..remember when they were face tapping KZ to play her younger sister..but there was no way that was going to happen? So the old "Dual Role" thing was in play being bounced back and forth to give birth to the clone.

I think soaps were much braver in the 60s and 70s...in the 80s they all became generic copying Dynasty and Dallas and but the time the MADD one and Rauch got their hands on the show, no one wanted to take chances. Add to that MADD/Rauch's "formula" story (bad girl, dumb guy, good girl traingle) and anything that did not fit that formula was out...(the Clone was just another triangle we all saw before..) I always wish they had brought back a son of Roger's at that time to act as his mouthpiece and fill in if Zaz could not work (in my fanwank mind it would be the son of Rita's who Ron believes is Alan's so he adopts him off camera to hate the Spaulding's and the Bauers and be his ultimate revenge on both, but it ends up being Ed's son...) thus helping with production and creating a "what next" bad guy who has a sympathetic back story ( and I always wanted a bad Bauer..) Grillo can thank his lucky stars on his own narcissistic personality and that he has a family member connection in the film industry (thus the Marvel casting) or he would just be another run of the mill ex soap star. The relationship of he and Moniz were destined to break up given their beginnings. She gave up her career to be a stay at home mom apparently....I think she did great on Yellowstone and hopefully she has more character work like that. Yea dumb move to have Dinah kill Hart (if Roger was alive would you believe he would let that go unpunished..) so when she came back it looked ridiculous she got off (and the only time I ever agreed with Cassie..) But Rauch wanted to burn their bridge and let Moniz and Grillo (neither one a cast favorite) know that they could not come back easily.

Grillo always sounded like an ass..I don't know why they didn't take that opportunity to recast Hart...(I love Weary's comment...) For being a mediocre talent and just another lug...he sure spun a career...he must have given great slobbers to someone, somewhere...)

Agreed, Shannon was fun when she first came on and her and Harriet had fun scenes together. Duncan was a sly cad and the mystery of the castle and all that was also fun at first. But of course, Marland had to make them both earnest and dreary, so Duncan's weird sister is found out to be his daughter (which is kind of a drag...Duncan should NOT be a dad...) and then we get Shannon talking about "honesty" in a relationship along with also obsessing about Lily along with the rest of the town and it became a drag. (didn't Shannon at one time threaten to stick Babs head in the toilet at Mona Lisa...if so I think another writers snuck that in it was sooo not Marland.) Lilith was fun and campy (loved her setting bear traps to kill people and shipping bodies of victims to people as a warning...) but seemed out of place in Marland's newly dour world..its like she got confused in her directions and missed Rauch's Llanview and ended up in Oakdale.) The castle was dumb but it stuck around to be the "Earl Mitchell Home for Wayward Youth" even though Earl wasn't really dead...Again, I never understood how a ghost just followed the bricks of the castle to the midwest.

If you read Marland's bible..that was exactly what he envisioned..though it was sexier on paper then with the actors...Lily was bitchier (that Lily would never have jumped at the chance to be at the Snyder farm) and there was some dynamic with a horse whip...(you can tell Marland was a gay boy from the midwest with his fascination with sex in barns and field with hunky farm boys..and well...it was fun...) but they had to tame it down because..Martha..God love her..did not exude that kind of sexuality ( he channeled that into Emily Stewart. But yea..only Marland could manage to find an even less sexual performer in the Lily recast and still write it like every steroid farm hunk in jeans was in love with her.

I got that..I think more then the "suspense" factor..(who didn't know post 1997 what was going to happen on GL...) I think it's the fact that having a major storyline around an actor who may not be able to work on certain days, is more of a problem. They of course could have filmed his scenes ahead of time without certain actors but the immediacy of say, MG's Holly dealing with having to support Roger when he was "weak" would have been lost. On the other hand, seeing MG' Holly doing just that with MZ..given their history and their ties..would have blown away a Double KZ marathon we were treated to. If they cared and they were smart they could have done it..even for a six week storyline to wrap things up..I actually think the writers and Rauch had the talent to do it if they just would be allowed to be creative. But as usual, Rauch and the industry got it wrong..it wasn't the suspence.. there are no new stories in drama..it is the characters interactions that get you there and that is where MADD and Co always failed. Of course, the last time something happened on GL which you couldn't predict...blew up in their faces (Mo's death) so I can see where they were leary.

I love Rauch's quote when the writers wanted to address the ALS.."We all know what the outcome of that storyline is..." or something to that..as if we didn't know what the outcome of the "Clone" would be (well maybe the morons the show was pandering to didn't) or any of the Java storylines...they break up, make up, yap about "always" and then do it all over again. Same with Manny, etc.

Another episode I remember watching in real time...only drama queen Reva would wander around in her wedding dress after her aborted wedding, (and finding out that her fiance was such a d*ck that his exwife would have to hide the fact that their baby lived) wandering around the country side (and looking GREAT, Kimmer was a knock out at that time) which, believe it or not, was actually Peapack!

Remember this like it was yesterday..in the CBS TV lounge in the Student Center....this football player who LOVED ATWT and GL....yelling "James f*cking Stenbeck!!!.Barbara get ya ass out of there!"

That is one of the things, among many that really stood out during Reva 2.0. She had always had guy friends...(when she was first introduced her best friend was a hair dresser in the salon she worked at...never mentioned but played a bit gay by the guy who played Brad on ATWT and he was actually good.Reva needed a gay bestie to fix her wagon once in a while..) Reva really, really liked men, not just for sex but she just liked them, and it really seemed realistic that Reva would make friends with guys faster than other women. Phillip, Johnny, Rick, both H.B. and Billy after their breakups, Fletcher...(she was the only one who made him tolerable...) And then she returned from the dead and it was all about Josh and then her shrill sister and she jumped from plot point to plot point and became a cartoon of her old self. Long really knew how to write for and appreciated friendships. Mindy and Frank were just a little side story but he was only ever interesting and sexy with her (I could never get over FD's frosted highlighted hair...same with Rusty's pouty mullet and tail he had...)

They did...I hate when it's used as a sweeps stunt. I even hated Margo's rape as well done as it was..it took a strong funny character, and she became a morose shell of herself after that. I know the point was strong woman are raped, but old people are abused in real life and I didn't want to see Nancy Hughes being batted around. The worst is when JFP threw away a promising character like Brent Lawrence, to try to make the audience like Lucy Cooper, by having him raper her. Cynical bullshit. However, I think the producer is as inept as his statement is, was trying to say that Roger and Holly were totally dysfunctional and it was both their fault...which is why I loved them over other dysfunctional "super couples" like Jeva that TPTB could never call them out as. I don't think he was trying to blame the rape on Holly but that she brought as much crazy as Roger did.