Broderick

I ain't telling you. I want you to be as surprised as possible about who did it, and how the Perpetrator managed to accomplish it. lol. It's all been laid-out for us, but we're bad about *assuming* everything is the way it initially appears. And nothing really is.

For those of us who didn't know Sharon Gabet was coming back (and in 1980, that was every single viewer, lol), Raven's reappearance at an opportune moment for one of the suspects came as a complete, unexpected shock, which blew one of our "study hall theories" of "who done it" to hell.

Let's just say Raven will play a significant role in the denouement of Margo's mystery and will also be a central character in the mysteries that occur in the summer and autumn of 1980, and in each event the groundwork is all CAREFULLY laid without us really even being aware of it. 😆

I'm glad you're having fun with the show. It brings back so many memories. In 1980, there was obviously no such thing as a "spoiler". I was a teenager at the time. My siblings and I watched the show most evenings, and several of my classmates were watching as well. It wasn't at all unusual for us to sit around & speculate as to where Henry Slesar was going with the storylines. "It HAD to be Eliot Dorn. But how did he get out of there without the doorman seeing him?" "It must have been Nola Madison! But didn't a reliable witness see her somewhere else at the time?" No explanation appeared to make sense, but suddenly EVERYTHING makes perfect sense. It's really a masterclass in mystery storytelling, in my opinion. Without spoilers, it was VERY HARD to figure it out. And that theme remained true throughout 1980.

lol. I don't want to influence the conclusions you draw. All I want to say is this particular "mystery storyline" (Margo Huntington's exit) and the mystery later in 1980 that involves a child's toy were VERY perplexing to me when I was watching at the time, and I'd read a zillion murder mysteries. Nowadays, I already know who the perpetrators were and can catch all the clues (and the red herrings), but at the time, I was completely bewildered how the deaths had been accomplished and by whom.

Once you get to the discovery of the Corpse (or almost Corpse), if you feel the Primary Suspect wasn't responsible, please tell us how you believe those Other People managed to do the deed & escape unnoticed 😉 (A significant portion of the storyline depends on who came & went from the Deceased Person's condo, where everyone was at the time, and whom they were with. The only person who ultimately is stuck "holding the bag" is the Primary Suspect. Everyone else appears to be accounted for.)

They're speculating about a pretty blonde girl who was on an ABC soap in the 1980s, her male co-star who might say, "Bon jour, mademoiselle", and a boy on another ABC show who did some nekkid pictures. I don't believe any of the 3 ever acknowledged any of this. I *Hope* I told it right. I don't know the three people, and I've got no insider knowledge, as I'm from a place as rural as South Dakota.

After she filed her $10 million wrongful termination lawsuit against Columbia Pictures Television [now Sony] after her dismissal, she pretty much blackballed herself from appearing on Y&R (or any other soap) ever again. Very unfortunate decision on her part to file the suit. No production company wants to deal with someone like that. I know she's blamed everyone (except herself) for her lack of subsequent lack of acting gigs over the years, but the fault obviously lies with her decision to file that lawsuit. I didn't mind her (ridiculous) campiness all that much. If you jot down her lines from the 1986-1987 scripts, and try reciting the lines yourself, you'll find that most of them can't be delivered in any fashion OTHER than camp, which is the way she played it.

I watched "live" in 1980, with no idea what was coming next. Obviously I knew Primary Suspect hadn't done it, and as you said, the motive assigned to the Primary Suspect seemed weak. But if I remember right, the jury was inclined to believe the Primary Suspect had a sudden agitated burst of anger and did the deed. (Plus the Primary Suspect had prearranged a meeting with the Deceased.) In hindsight, if I'd been on the jury, I perhaps would've convicted the Primary Suspect, based on the information that the Deceased had been seen alive and well, had received no visitors that evening except the Primary Suspect, and the Primary Suspect's fingerprints were on the weapon. As we know in Slesar's world, nothing is ever as it seems! When I found out who the real Perpetrator was, I couldn't believe I hadn't figured it out.

I recently re-watched the "Eden" storyline (from Mark Arnold's tapes) for the first time since 1982. I was thinking maybe I'd misjudged the storyline and perhaps in hindsight it would be better. It's not. lol.

Yep, those "contracts", lol. I can't remember Doug Davidson's recent EXACT quote, but the gist of it was, "Doug, we're bumping you to recurring, but no one has to know about it." He said, "I believe people will figure it out when I'm way below my normal guaranteed number of appearances." But TPTB assured him it could remain a secret (unless he elected to publicize it, which he ultimately did several months after it happened.) Even before he spoke up in September of 2018, several of us were already speculating that Doug, Kristoff, Christian LeBlanc, and Kate Linder were all secretly recurring. It now seems likely Brytny Sarpy & Camryn Grimes are, as well. Camryn averaged 3 shows a month in 2023, which is below a normal contract guarantee, and in 2024 she's averaging only 2 shows a month. We've seen Miss Sarpy a grand total of twice since Labor Day; I can't imagine she signed a contract that guarantees her 2 shows in an 8-month period.

Paige Madison MIGHT have been the victim of a cobbled-together storyline that just didn't work 100% right. The previous year, Henry Slesar had attempted to tell a story about a dangerous religious-type cult called "Children of the Earth". Unfortunately, 900 real Americans ended up dying in a cult just as the Edge Of Night storyline was getting underway, and you could sense Henry Slesar pulled the plug (prematurely) on whatever conclusion he'd originally planned out of sensitivity toward the victims' families. In hindsight, I believe he "salvaged" some of the unaired material, altered it a bit, and slapped it on Paige Madison. Paige's storyline also seemed loosely based on Patricia Hearst, a millionaire college girl who was kidnapped from San Francisco in 1974 by the Symbionese Liberation Army. Hearst became an "accomplice" of the SLA, either by force, by brainwashing, or just because she decided she liked them. Opinions vary on what led to her joining them. A hodge-podge of material (from the real-life Patricia Hearst story and from the aborted Children of the Earth story) seemed to get slapped on Paige Madison, and it ultimately became sort of comical (and stupid) how many times Paige's life was placed in danger by Tobias & Company. I liked the actress (Margaret Colin) just fine, but I was glad when Paige moved on.

I wonder if Sharon Case has recently "signed" one of those Special "Contracts" some of the others appear to have.

It's extremely well-written in the late 1970s and very early 1980s. What always impressed me is there's very few "throwaway" scenes. If someone is discussing an event with another character, you better believe the other character will soon be a player in the storyline. And no one is EVER anywhere by accident. Henry Slesar places them all exactly where he needs them to be.

"Never Too Young" is really a trip. I watched the first episode & got a kick out of it. Gotta love that groovy 1960s dialogue!

The contracts likely won't be for a very long duration, since the network is intentionally sabotaging the show with a 60-minute format out of the starting gate, which of course has a historical success rate of literally 0%.

That's about right. Since 1980 or so, daytime television in American has served up the same thing -- the "trials & tribulations of well-to-do families in gated communities." And unfortunately with today's budgets, the concept seems silly. We already know what we'll get -- a daily budget of $2.35, and numerous references to the off-screen wealth of characters who supposedly have a private jet parked just outside, but their clothes will come from Dollar Tree. Glad this show is happening but can't get too enthusiastic about it based on what I've read so far.

To me that's the biggest problem that plagues the show -- the scripts. Yes, they're trying to tape each episode on a budget of $2.35. There's no rehearsal time for the actors. The directors are lazily slapping stagnant blocking and camera shots onto the screen, shrugging their shoulders and saying, "Okay, that looks like garbage, but I guess it'll do. On to the next scene!" The actors often recite their dialogue in the dullest and least imaginative manner. The sets are desolate and worn-out. But the biggest problem is the scripts lack wit, complexity, and humor. There are no twists of irony, no unexpected symbolism. Everything is surface-deep, and no one on staff seems to identify it as problematic. (Which is why I couldn't muster any sympathy for the fired outline writers; I'm sorry they lost their jobs, but they were working in the same dull, assembly line fashion as the head writer and the dialogue writers, adding nothing whatsoever to the product.) The failure (and laziness) of the writing staff became glaring post-Covid. Several scripts had been written, but not taped yet when the studio shut-down for Covid protocol. Any conscientious writer would've seized that opportunity to improve his work. ("Okay, they've got four of my scripts piled-up in the studio which haven't been taped yet. I'm going to retrieve them and rewrite them entirely during the quarantine period, add some humor and pathos, some sarcasm, some irony, and once I'm finished, they'll be the BEST scripts I've ever submitted!") Evidently, none of the writers was willing to go that extra inch to improve the quality, because once the show began taping again after the shut down, there had been no improvement at all in the scripts. The material was the same dry, mundane, tired, shallow junk that had been taped pre-Covid. Nobody bothered to use that extra time to improve their work. Same grade-C stuff as before. Nobody cares anymore.

PSM: "And then Joan Collins came in with her caricature, and it became less and less real." My sentiments exactly.

I believe when the show comes up for renewal again, we'll see even more of this. The household ratings are down from the last renewal, and the remaining audience is older. The licensing fee for the next renewal term will undoubtedly be even less than it is now. I expect they'll "secretly" drop a few more folks to recurring once the new budget takes effect.

lol. There's no way she's under contract. She had zero appearances in January, zero in December, 2 in November, zero in October, zero in September. That's 2 shows in 5 months. What actor would sign a contract like that? 😂

Sometimes I forget there even is an Elena Dawson. lol.

I dimly remember seeing Liz fall "up the stairs" circa 1973, when I was a kid. My recollection is that she went RACING up the stairs, two steps at a time, tripped, fell, said ouch, then died a few episodes later from the ruptured spleen. I think "fell ON the stairs" is a better descriptor. The online fans who "remembered" Carl Williams being presumed dead were likely confusing it with the storyline where Paul Williams pretended to be dead. As you pointed out, Carl's storyline was a complete retcon. He simply stopped appearing at the conclusion of the Cassandra Rawlins storyline with no explanation. Most of us assumed he was "down at the station" (or somewhere) until we were advised he was presumed dead, lol. That nonsense about Jill hiring the "look-alike" was complete fan fiction. After Nick Reed died, Jill's only storyline was desperately trying to snag Derek Thurston for a husband. She didn't have a quarter to her name to hire a "look-alike".

Couldn't agree more. Less than a decade earlier, Cricket had been a "teen model" enjoying Coke floats, while Victor was a middle-aged man who'd gone through multiple wives and vasectomies. It was silly. Pairing Victor and Cricket would've been about like pairing Kay Chancellor and Nicholas Newman. 😂

I feel the New York Times writer was just making a somewhat generic statement that Capote's book was like the general public's perception of soap storytelling -- "salacious and tawdry, devoid of symbolism".