JarrodMFiresofLove

Thanks. I remember she had this big career change under Sheffer. At first I felt he didn't really know what to do with her or how to write her. But I ended up enjoying the Emily-Hal pairing.

The remotes in Peapack were dreadful. It was like the cast just showed up with their clothes from home. Nobody was really dressing the way their characters had dressed prior to changing the production model. The hand-held stuff has already been mentioned, but the lighting was even worse. Because people were wearing clothes from home, they might choose something bright which clashed with the outdoor lighting. And there was no real cinematographer trying to balance these bright color schemes or overabundance of light in the shots. It was just a director and some young camera operators, probably just out of college, running around chasing the actors trying to record it all. And the sound quality was abysmal. Zimmer talks about the sound problems in her book. She says one of her most dramatic scenes with Bradley Cole was destroyed because of background noise. But instead of reshooting it Wheeler just added in a track of background music to drown out the background noise which also drowned out all of the dialogue. It really was a mess, very amateurish. Wheeler was in over her head by that point and the whole ship was going down.

I remember the Lakeview being featured when Marland was head writer. Didn't Susan Stewart stay there when she came back to Oakdale? Probably a million other characters too. As for the newspapers, Sheffer had a plot where Emily was running a paper before she married Hal. Was it the City Times? I don't remember the Argus being mentioned too much, if at all, in the 2000s. It was a bit unrealistic that Lisa had all those businesses at the same time. It probably started because Fulton had so many guaranteed episodes per week and the writers could meet those guarantees but putting her in scenes showing someone to their table, or helping someone pick out a dress. Lisa usually had scenes with all the other characters, up through the late 90s.

This happened because they had just hired Joan Collins to play Alexandra and promised Collins a delicious wardrobe. But they did give everyone else in the cast an updated look, even Lillian who was usually dressed in frumpy middle class duds when she wasn't at the hospital. But Collins was dropped in December and Rauch also left at the end of 2002. So I don't think this fashion designer stuck around very long. Under the next exec producer, John Conboy, things seemed to have been toned down. Conboy usually preferred to dress up the sets instead of the actors. Meaning Reva was back to looking like a soccer mom in 2003. San Christobel was said to be a small island nation somewhere in the Caribbean. One of the plots involved the Santos family having business on the island. And the Santoses were established as being Cuban not Mexican. So we can probably assume San Christobel was not far from Cuba.

I remember Lisa having a book store, didn't she? I was very young at the time, late 70s, but I seem to recall she sold books and magazines before she started selling clothes. I guess they wanted things to be more glamorous for her, so they changed the nature of her business. In the mid-80s Lisa seemed to move away from the fashion stuff (leaving Barbara to do that) when she began running the Argus newspaper with stepson Brian McColl. Then when Doug Marland took over as head writer, she was running a restaurant called the Mona Lisa. Did Lisa continue running the Mona Lisa after Marland died and other head writers took over in the 90s? In the episode someone posted about Nancy's death in 2010, they show Lisa running some business but it looked more like a coffee shop by that point, not a restaurant. As for Barbara's fashion line, I think that happened around 1988 when Hank was introduced. The Bold and the Beautiful had premiered a short time earlier and probably had an influence on Marland doing this. It was suddenly in vogue for each soap to have a woman heading up a clothing line or fashionable business empire. Though was it very realistic that a woman who became as successful as Barbara did would continue to be headquartered out of a sleepy berg like Oakdale? Why would designers from New York come to a somewhat rural community in Illinois? Wouldn't it be the opposite, where someone with Barbara's talent would go to New York? It was like Lucinda having this huge business that had contracts with international firms but yet she was still located in Oakdale U.S.A. and not a major industrial city.

Interesting. I suppose these same episodes were the ones that were available on AOL ten years ago.

So this means TBS only showed nine months worth of Texas (the show ran for almost two and a half years)...? Were people upset that Texas was not allowed to run to its final episode?

I agree. She was replaced by Phelps after six months so Phelps could install one of her favorite writers, Megan McTavish.

I was mentioning to a friend recently that Doug Marland created a character (a villain no less) with the same first name-- Doug Cummings. Have there been cases with other headwriters who created characters named after themselves? I don't think this happens/happened very often. I don't remember Claire Labine ever creating a character named Claire on any of her shows. Or Pam Long creating a character named Pam or Pamela. I mean they could come on to a show and inherit a character created by a previous writer, with the character having their same first name. But besides the Marland/Cummings example has there ever been another headwriter who created a new character named after himself or herself?

Probably they had ideas they planned to use on Texas if it had not been cancelled. So when P&G moved them both to GL, they just transferred some of that material and grafted it on to GL. This meant having to reduce screen time for some of the Bauers and other character Marland created that did not fit into this vision. Plus they wanted to bring over some of the cast from Texas. But by 87 it was more a matter of canceling out the damage Munisteri and Manetta had done, refocusing the stories Pam had started in her first tenure, plus the creation of a new family, the Coopers. In 1989 she reconceived Roger and Holly, giving Holly a new backstory (a Swiss husband named Lindsey we never met and a career Holly really didn't have under the Dobsons and Marland). Plus they revised Chrissie, to where she was now Blake. And Roger had become some spy, or whatever kind of intrigue it was to explain his absence for much of the decade after his presumed death nine years earlier. Roger was then put into Spaulding corporate stories, while Holly ran WSPR. Roger and Holly's parents were not mentioned during Long's reintroduction of these characters, though McTavish brought Holly's mother back later, and Estensten & Brown brought Holly's brother on for a story arc in the late 90s.

Thanks. It makes sense they would air together.

In another thread someone posted a late 1983 interview with GL headwriter Pam Long. In the article it says her former show Texas was being rerun on superstation WTBS. Did this coincide with broadcasts of The Catlins? Texas ended its run in late December 1982 on NBC, and The Catlins debuted in April 1983. I am wondering if Texas re-aired in its entirety on TBS and if it was used as a companion soap with The Catlins. Anyone know?

I should have guessed Taggart did the episodes with Annie in the institution. Very good stuff. And I'd forgotten about Claire's second stint in the early 2000s. There was more they could have done with her. She should have been there when Michelle and Danny were having their daughter. One story I remember was with the mobster Salerno. Was that done by Gold or by Weston? I know it was one of those rare times Danny and Reva interacted since Reva was helping him nail Salerno, I think as part of her news show.

You can see the way that montage is edited that Estelle and T.R. are basically Tomlin's replacement for Stephanie and Wendy. So one set is being written out to make way for the other set to take center stage. Of course Tomlin used Bela in the new storyline with Estelle, but probably because T.R. was so young and the censors wouldn't allow a triangle with her, the other person in the triangle becomes Sunny who ultimately gets pregnant by Bela. Meaning Estelle ends up alone, until T.R. returns home to see her for Christmas 1986. As for Wendy I don't think she was ever mentioned again after this, certainly not after the flood; and Stephanie was murdered in late January. The scene with Stephanie and Suzi is a bit haunting because neither one of them will make it through 1986-- both are killed off.

In the same way you can tell what another writer (like Lucky Gold) contributes by finding similarities across stories that he cowrote with others. Gold had worked under Labine, then took over; and later he came back and worked under Kreizman. Since he introduced the Boudreaus when he was in charge, you can really see what his contributions are under Kreizman when someone like Remy Boudreau is recast and added back into the show. The writers tend to have their "pet" characters/actors and the issue-driven stories they prefer telling get revisited when they are working behind the scenes again. Gold would work on ATWT after GL folded. So you look at those episodes and you start to find things that signify the Lucky Gold touch. You can do this for any writer. Claire Labine's material is easy to spot because her characters have more normal speech patterns. Sometimes you have to factor in the writer-producer relationship. I think Paul Rauch was very strong willed so he kept a tighter reign on the material headwriters created under him. Basically he gave them an idea and they built the plot. I think Goutman was like that too over on ATWT. Only some of Goutman's headwriters struggled to translate his vision. Going back to the early 90s material on GL, you can see where the Curlee influences come in. But Stephen Demorest had a longer run so he was probably a bit more influential than she was during those years. Then you have to factor in Jill Farren Phelps who tended to build shows around hunky male actors (which why Vincent Irizarry returned as Nick McHenry and Mark Derwin got loads of screen time as A.J. Mallett, not to mention all Rick Hearst's frontburner stories as Alan-Michael Spaulding). I just found Nancy Curlee to be a journeyman type writer. She was not this great iconic soap scribe like Pam Long, Doug Marland and Claire Labine.

Sorry, not going into that argument. I'm not a fan of Curlee's. I get that some people are. I didn't like Annie coming back as Terry DeMarco in the form of Signy Coleman. It was one of Esensten & Brown's misfires. Fortunately that story didn't last and Coleman was written out after a year. I did love the later guest appearance by Coleman as Annie, which I think was done by a different headwriter, where we learned the institution Alan put her in was designed to look like Josh and Reva's home. Very clever. They could have done more with that. I agree that Estensten & Brown were trying to reset the show. And I think that was in tandem with Rauch's overall design to reconfigure things and make GL more watchable. The Reva/Dolly clone story was a bit too sci-fi/horror for my tastes but I think they wrapped it up pretty fast, and at least they were willing to take risks. They were running out of new ground to explore with Reva and I think they wanted to keep Kim Zimmer challenged.

I guess I should have explained my favorite GL headwriter choices, so here goes: 1. Pam Long...created iconic characters, more than just Reva. She reconceived Josh and Vanessa, as well as Alan, Phillip and Rick; Her core families were fantastic-- the revised Spauldings (with the introduction of Alex and Lujack); the Lewises, the Shaynes, the Coopers, just all so wonderful. She phased out several of the Bauers which I didn't care for and Alex took over as the main older female after Bert's death, but the Bauers still continued under Ed and Maureen; and the Reardons still continued with Chelsea. 2. Millee Taggart...the Alan, Olivia, Phillip triangle was excellent; she also new how to write the sisterly relationship between Reva and Cassie quite well; the heart transplant story for Rick which involved Richard's mercy killing by Reva was brilliant. She also kept Harley as a central character without putting Harley on screen four or five days a week like previous writers had done. That was a strong year under her guidance and Paul Rauch's producing. 3. Doug Marland...he was good with young characters like Kelly, Nola, Morgan, Floyd, Katie, etc. He also gave Roger an exciting exit in the spring of 1980. I thought the Carrie Todd storyline was intriguing if not ill-fated. The Reardons were fun if not a little too overexposed. I loved the Jennifer Richards storyline. 4. Jeff Ryder...he did a good job carrying Pam Long's creations forward. I loved Mindy's marriage to Kurt, which got her away from being a ping pong ball between Rick and Phillip. He knew how to write strong female characters: Sally Gleason, Maeve Stoddard, Vanessa, Reva, Claire Ramsey, Calla Matthews, Alex, India...they all had interesting things to do. 5. Barbara Esensten & James Harmon Brown...Cassie was their best new creation; also Richard and Edmond, which mirrored the old Roger-Ed stuff. I was a big fan of the San Christobel storyline even though it took some of the focus away from Springfield. Cassie and Richard's wedding was a highlight. I loved the storyline where Vanessa told nasty Ben Warren she wasn't going to help him and then shot him. But of course she lapsed into a coma, and Carmen Santos' daughter finished him off. The Santoses were exciting and I loved how they were connected with the Bauers through Michelle. To me this was a renaissance period for the show. 6. Jerome & Bridget Dobson...I started watching the show under them and was hooked. I loved characters like Hilary Bauer, Jackie Marler, Ross Marler, Rita Stapleton, Evie Stapleton; Justin Marler; Ben McFarland; and of course Alan Spaulding. A lot of great characters under them. 7. Claire Labine...some of her storylines felt forced but her dialogue was always so natural. I liked how she wrote for Mary Stuart as Meta; plus she continued the whole Santos-Bauer thing which I really enjoyed. I think she made a mistake killing Beth's husband Jim Lemay. But her use of Edmond as a villain was great; plus she brought Alan back after Ron Raines had gone off contract and Alan had become a recurring character for awhile. 8. Megan McTavish...she was inventive. I liked the story with Blake's twins having different fathers, it was unique. I liked the Brent/Marian drama. She brought Nola back. She gave Henry an excellent sendoff when Bill Roerick died. She also wrote interesting material for Gilly and Gilly's family. And I have to admit I liked the whole Goshen story with the Amish characters, especially the introduction of Abigail 9. Lloyd Gold...his main contribution was the Boudreau family, with Mel marrying Rick. It worked for me. He also did the story with the earthquake in San Christobel which upped the drama. He carried some of Labine's creations forward, most notably Gus Aitoro, who was a great character. I liked how he connected Gus to the Spauldings because Gus was the product of a relationship Alan had with a nun. I bet Claire Labine came up with that idea, but Gold is the one who fleshed it out. 10. David Kreizman...his first year was really solid; he ended the horrible Sandy story Weston started and made J.B. the long lost son from Christobel that Reva had with Richard. He refocused core characters and the business plots with the Spauldings started to make sense again. He brought Dinah back in the form of Gina Tognoni.

I didn't care for her writing. She often co-headwrote with others and I found her writing partners' material more interesting. I felt Curlee was overrated. This is how I'd rank my favorite headwriters on GL: 1. Pam Long 2. Millee Taggart 3. Doug Marland 4. Jeff Ryder 5. Barbara Esensten & James Harmon Brown 6. Jerome & Bridget Dobson 7. Claire Labine 8. Megan McTavish 9. Lloyd Gold 10. David Kreizman Worst 1. Sherry Anderson & Joseph Manetta (what a dreadful period right before Long's return; the show fell apart overnight; they did not get the characters or understand the show; it was the worst nine months ever in the history of Guiding Light) 2. Mary Ryan Munisteri (another one who was temporarily in charge between Ryder and Long's second tenure...the Andora plot with India and the little girl Dory was just awful...she was fired after three months). 3. Jill Lorie Hurst (the last headwriter..killing Coop off was a stunt to boost ratings at the last minute but was a mistake...the final episode was a dud...it felt like a college production those last six months) 4. Douglas Anderson (I think he was right before McTavish...the show was incredibly dull with him, Lucy and Alan-Michael were the main couple, the show felt lifeless; he only lasted six months.) 5. Ellen Weston (She retconned things with the Maryanne Carruthers story, made a mess of the core family histories; turning Edmond into a good guy when he was better as a villain; turning Reva into a psychic, really bad stuff).

Thanks for this. She's my favorite GL writer of all time. Followed by Millee Taggart and Doug Marland. She really did understand character and the need for characters to find love. Her creations carried the show through the next 25 years. Without the foundation laid by Pam Long during her two headwriting stints, the show would have ended much sooner.

I always liked Anne Sward's portrayal of Lyla. Was her exit something Marland had planned? Or did she get written out in 93 after his death because of budget cuts? I know she came back temporarily in 2000 under Sheffer. But it always felt strange her not being on the show in the late 90s when Katie was re-introduced all grown up.

Brolden, Were there any pre-emptions around 9.11 (the day of the terrorist attacks)?

Yes, it really becomes an approximation. But with ongoing diligence you might get your numbering process to be quite accurate. Are you going to keep count of actor/character appearances too?

Hi Brolden. I know when you get to the summer of 1987 there will be a few pre-emptions for the Iran Contra Affair hearings. You might find documentation about that in old issues of Soap Opera Digest. There were at least a half dozen pre-emptions during that time, maybe more. When looking at the episode numbers of The Doctors, on another website, I realized that sometimes the numbers are not always consistent. Like when there was a pre-emption, the episode that didn't air would take a new number. So for example episode 1999 would become 1999/2000 since it ended up airing in the spot designated for 2000. And then 2000 would become 2001 and so on. This happened every time there was a pre-emption. I guess that's how they recorded the fact that something had two scheduled airings (though obviously only aired once). As a result of the duplicate numbering, the overall total is off. So on the wiki page for The Doctors, where it says there are 5155 total episodes, that number is actually incorrect...that number is in reference to scheduled broadcasts not actual episodes. This is because with the occasional duplicate numbering over the years there are probably a hundred less overall episodes and the real total is most likely between 5000 and 5100. This throws off what people consider the milestone episodes. The episode they celebrated as #5000 was really the 5000th scheduled broadcast, not the 5000th episode. I don't know if As the World Turns also employed a duplicate numbering process for pre-emptions. It was produced by a different company than The Doctors so it might have had a different policy. I am just mentioning this in the event you come across an old script and the number on that is slightly off from what you were led to believe it should be. The episode numbers may end up being approximations.

Yes, one blurb I read said these were paranormal conversations. I do believe we can re-invoke people after they're dead. But I don't think dead people make full confessions to us in our dreams. It would be an interesting soap opera plot wouldn't it! I see her book as a combination of psychotherapy and creative writing. She obviously is dealing with things that happened in their marriage or things she has been led to believe happened. Her website is actually very nice. She's done a good job documenting the phases of his career. I particularly love the photos where he's clowning around with Stephen Yates (Ben) and where they are at the beach house of Chris Bernau (Alan). I get the impression they were a close knit cast, all the ones hired under the Dobsons. The mid to late 70s was a great time for GL.

Interesting info...thanks. I don't remember Roy's wife at all.