YRfan23

23 minutes ago, Paul Raven said:

Only the Top 5 scoring more than a 3 a week average. Everyone else below 9th is on 2 a week or less.

I'm not gonna lie too, it's so hard not to put some sort of angry or disgusted emoji whenever Morrow is at the top...haha

15 minutes ago, BoldRestless said:

Sure, the marriage for revenge would have worked, without all that sappiness. I saved this old usenet post that describes it well:

https://groups.google.com/g/rec.arts.tv.soaps/c/R9K2kCKOKBc/m/HfdVBW0wlxMJ

You see, I have some recollection of Bergman's Cliff Warner during the
height of the Cliff & Nina romance days.

I hate to tell you this folks, but I think Bergman is playing Cliff again.

My fiance put it best when she said that this Jack is likable and sensitive
and loving in ways that are not at all like the Jack she remembers Terry as
being

examples:  Jack says "I wish, oh how I wish, you could love me as much
                      as I love you"

Terry Lester might have said [Southern Drawl on]

                     "Yeah, sweetheart, ya gotta know how much you mean to me.
                      We're hot together, you know hon!  Let's give this thing
                      a chance"

                             [Southern Drawl off]

another example.  Jack says "Do you know how jealous I am?  That you have
                             that wonderful little boy"

Terry Lester might have said [Southern Drawl on]

                      "Look, sugar, I want a kid.  I'm feelin' those paternal
                       urges, you know.  Listen, Doll, I wanna have a kid
                       just like you and the Black Knight"

                              [Southern Drawl off]

I think I've made the point:  the old Jack was appealing because of his slick
superficiality.  While he was known to show anger, the most appealing part
of the old Jack was the humour that always glistened behind those eyes.  Jack
was mocking the world and its conventions.

The new Jack is VERY rapidly being transformed into a noble man, with deep deep
feelings for family (remember how the old Jack threatened Ashley that he
would reveal that her natural father was Brent Davis if Ash didn't turn over
the vice-chairmanship to him!).  He is Cliff Warner.  Remember that Jack
and Nikki were ostensibly brought together because Jackie wanted revenge
on Victor.  The writers seem to have forgotten all about that--now they're
making like his love runs deep.

I don't mind the new Jack, but it's taken me a long while to realize that this
is a completely different man (not just actor, but character).

 

The more the evidence surfaces, It's safe to say Bill Bell stopped writing for Jack Abbott and just wrote for Peter Bergman, about 6 months to a year after Bergman joined. 

November 2023 Episode Rankings
A total of 20 Episodes aired this Month
thanks as always @jcar03! 

1.) Joshua Morrow (Nick Newman) : 14
2.) Eric Braeden (Victor Newman) : 13
*.) Sean Dominic (Nate Hastings) : 13
*.) Amelia Heinle (Victoria Newman) : 13
5.) Melody Thomas Scott (Nikki Newman) : 12
6.) Hayley Erin (Claire Grace) : 10
*.) Mark Grossman (Adam Newman) : 10
8.) Michael Mealor (Kyle Abbott) : 8
9.) Peter Bergman (Jack Abbott) : 6
*.) Sharon Case (Sharon Rosales) : 6
*.) Tricia Cast (Nina Webster) : 6
*.) Eileen Davidson (Ashley Abbott) : 6
*.) Michael Graziadei (Daniel Romalotti) : 6
*.) Bryton James (Devon Hamilton) : 6
*.) Christel Khalil (Lily Winters) : 6
*.) Allison Lanier (Summer Newman) : 6
*.) Melissa Ordway (Abby Newman Abbott - Chancellor) : 6
*.) Trevor St. John (Tucker McCall) : 6
*.) Zuleyka Silver (Audra Charles) : 6
*.) Susan Walters (Diane Jenkins) : 6
21.) Conner Floyd (Phillip "Chance" Chancellor IV) : 5
*.) Courtney Hope (Sally Spectra) : 5
*.) Jason Thompson (Billy Abbott) : 5
*.) Elizabeth Hendrickson (Chloe Fisher) : 5
*.) Colleen Zenk (Jordan) : 5
*.) Lauralee Bell (Christine Williams) : 4
*.) Michael Damian (Danny Romalotti) : 4
*.) J. Eddie Peck (Cole Howard) : 4
*.) Veronica Redd (Mamie Johnson) : 4
30.) Melissa Claire Egan (Chelsea Lawson) : 3
*.) Camryn Grimes (Mariah Copeland) : 3
*.) Michelle Stafford (Phyllis Summers) : 3
*.) Jess Walton (Jill Abbott) : 3
34.) Brytni Sarpy (Elena Dawson) : 2
*.) Vail Bloom (Heather Stevens) : 2
*.) Tracey Bregman (Lauren Fenmore Baldwin) : 2
*.) Cait Fairbanks (Tessa Porter) : 2
*.) Lily Brooks O' Bryant (Lucy Romalotti) : 2
39.) Christian LeBlanc (Michael Baldwin) : 1
*.) Kate Linder (Esther Valentine) : 1
*.)Judith Chapman (Gloria Fisher) : 1
*.) Mattilyn Rochester Kravitz (Dr. George) : 1
*.) Beth Maitland (Traci Abbott) : 1
*.) Greg Rikaart (Kevin Fisher) : 1




 

10 minutes ago, yrfan1983 said:

 I can barely make it through all these scenes without fast-forwarding. They are so cringe. Elizabeth Sung and Phillip Moon were talented actors and it sucks that they were stuck with such stilted dialogue. 

I wonder if the problem was, unlike Victoria Rowell who sort of guided Bill Bell with how to properly write for AA characters on the show, maybe both ES and PM didn’t step forward and offer their perspective to Bell with how to properly write for the Vietnamese culture….although I guess one could argue they weren’t both Vietnamese IRL, but still. 

3 minutes ago, kalbir said:

The Vietnam story was a rewrite since it went against established history. In 1983 when Dina arrived, it was said she left the family in 1971. The rewrite had Jack serving in Vietnam in 1971 so that made him an adult when Dina left.

It’s definitely a rewrite but to kind of fix that error, I would just have it that Jack quickly left for Vietnam in the months after Dina walking out on the family. Most people go into the army when they are 18 and just out of high school. 

44 minutes ago, yrfan1983 said:

I am currently watching 11/8/94 where Jack reveals to Keemo that he is Keemo's father, and Jack says "I honestly think you'll grow to like me" and I had to snicker as I never grew to like Peter Bergman's portrayal of Jack after 34 years 

Haha you are too funny!!
 

as terrible as I use to think it was of Bergman to pretend Keemo and Luan never existed, I definitely understand not to a degree why he felt that way. The dialogue and scenes are More cringey then they are heartwarming IMO.
 

On 10/5 or 10/6/94, the biggest cringe for me is Jack and Luan’s reunion and the way Jack says: “Hello Mai-yung” with the hint of a Vietnamese twang in his voice!  

November 2023 Rankings
A total of 20 Episodes aired this Month
Thanks as always @jcar03!

1.) Thorsten Kaye (Ridge Forrester) : 17
2.) Katherine Kelly Lang (Brooke Logan Forrester) : 16
3.) Joshua Hoffman (R.J Forrester) : 15
*.) Jacqueline Maclnnes Wood (Steffy Forrester Finnegan) : 15
5.) Lisa Yamada (Luna Nozawa) : 12
6.) John McCook (Eric Forrester) : 11
7.) Jennifer Gareis (Donna Logan) : 10
8.) Tanner Novlan (Dr. John "Finn" Finnegan) : 9
*.) Heather Tom (Katie Logan) : 9 
10.) Matthew Atkinson (Thomas Forrester) : 7
*.) Annika Noelle (Hope Logan) : 7
12.) Romy Park (Poppy Nozawa) : 5
13.) Kimberlin Brown (Sheila Carter) : 4
*.) Scott Clifton (Liam Spencer) : 4
*.) Sean Kanan (Deacon Sharpe) : 4
16.) Krista Allen (Dr. Taylor Hayes) : 3
*.) Delon de Metz (Zende Forrester Dominguez) : 3
*.) Don Diamont (Bill Spencer) : 3
*.) Naomi Matsuda (Li Finnegan) : 3
20.) Lawrence St. Victor (Carter Walton) : 2
*.) Alexander & Chase Banks (Hayes) : 2
*.) Justin Davis (Dr. Colin Colby) : 2
*.) Sophia Paras (Kelly) : 2
24.) Henry J. Dinapoli (Bodie) : 1
*.) Hayeong Jang (Lilah) : 1
*.) Quinn Knox (Mr. Lords) : 1

Contract Actor(s) not appearing this Month:
1.) Diamond White (Paris Buckingham) 

25 minutes ago, fivethej said:

Do you know the air date when Brad vs Tim fight in Lauren's office happened? It was from 1989.

I don’t know that one either  

3 hours ago, kalbir said:

Y&R June 7, 1991 Nathan and Olivia get married.

Y&R is just so ahead of the pack.

Also Sheila and Scott married June 13, 1991  

51 minutes ago, fivethej said:

It was 1990. Someone had posted the scene on YouTube, but the channel was taken down.

Leanna also had dreams of hurting Victor and had melt downs.

Oh, haha I thought that was in 1988. Everything else you mentioned happen then 

2 hours ago, fivethej said:

Do you know the air date when Leanna Love & Victor had a one-night stand?

That not sure, haha 

9 minutes ago, fivethej said:

What's the air date for the very first time Hope & Nikki meet?

I think it’s 10/5/93 which we don’t have yet. 

15 minutes ago, Broderick said:

Kay Alden said at the time that Miss Latham was brought in because she had "primetime sensibilities" and would add more of a "primetime flavor" to the show (at SONY's suggestion).  As to why the Bell-era writers were ultimately dismissed -- who knows?  Maybe they were seen as hindering Miss Latham's "primetime sensibilities".  

Well that's ridiculous because I think Y&R was the most "Primetime" of any of the soaps at the time Bill Bell wrote it. 

5 minutes ago, Liberty City said:

Let's be real: if this had been more paced-out, people would b*tch and moan it was "dragging on" and taking "too long" to wrap up.

Probably, I mean they think the audience of today, doesn't have the attention spam or patience that they do over 30 years ago. 

Just now, Soapsuds said:

He's been a frat boy his entire run. He hasn't shown any growth as a character and that goes for Victoria too.

He did try in the 90s/early 2000s (he was and never will be believable as a businessman)  but it’s been ever since “Phick” became a thing he’s just gotten worst and worst. 

On 11/26/2023 at 4:12 PM, detroitpiston said:

Y&R’s insistence on Nick/Sharon/Victoria/Phyllis etc never properly maturing into new types of story has hindered at least 2 generations of legacy characters.

Preach the truth!! I don’t care that Morrow still looks good for being almost 50 years old, he basically stole all of Noah’s stories these past 15 years. I’m just tired of him the most for that reason…

3 minutes ago, Broderick said:

I expect Bill either flew out to Los Angeles (or they sent the tapes to Lake Shore Drive) when they were auditioning a character who was slated to last for years (such as Jaime Lyn Bauer, who was cast after 9 months or so as Lorie Brooks).  But Victor Newman and Kay Chancellor were initially slated for pretty short-term roles, and I doubt Bell was jumping up & down wanting to see all the applicants.  (Ditto for the boy who played Scott Adams.) 

Just my guess.   

Some of those early names from the production crew are forever stuck in my head (such as John Conboy, of course), the main director (Bill Dunlap), the set decorator (Brock Broughton), that weird trio of writers ("Eric L. Roberts", lol), the hair stylist (India Sparhawk), but when it comes to Patricia Wenig -- I never get that one right.    

Haha that’s the first I heard of Brock Broughton, I wonder if that’s how they got “Brock Reynolds” 

1 hour ago, Soapsuds said:

Today's episode wasn't half bad despite Jordan story going at warp speed.

The pacing on this show is horrible even if the episodes have been decent. In the old days this would have been a May or November sweeps type of story (for the following November)

7 minutes ago, Broderick said:

Yes, thank you!!  It hit me after I posted.  Jeanne Cooper described her as "the girl who looked as though she worked in a pastry shop in Carmel, California."  

Haha no problem  I rewatched Jeanne’s interview and her saying that gave me a laugh! Lol

27 minutes ago, Broderick said:

In my opinion, Kay Alden held her own once she was in charge, even breathed some fresh life into the show.  This would've been 1998-2000 (approximately).  But then she stalled completely; she hit a series of storyline duds.  She introduced a character named "Sean Bridges" into Jill Foster's orbit, cloaked him in mystery, recast him spontaneously, had him spout out a bunch of mumbo-jumbo about sleeping on futons, and then dropped him without exploring any of it fully.  She squandered the final months of Shemar Moore's contract with a ridiculous story involving a "retro prom" for an unlikable character named Alex Perez.  She wasted months spinning her wheels on Mackenzie Browning's dull mother, Amanda Browning.  And then there was her downright bizarre obsession with sperm and sputum (Victor's sperm, Cassie's sputum). I kept waiting for her to introduce smegma into the mix. Just what we all we wanted to hear about during lunch!  

The ratings dropped substantially -- from the high 7's to the low 5's. 

Jack Smith was brought in to "help" her.  Whether he'd simply lost his mind (or whether he was acting under a mandate from SONY), he introduced the most childlike, juvenile stories in Y&R's history:  Look! -- upper-middle class Brittany is suddenly a STRIPPER!!!  Bad Boy JT is crooning syrupy love ballads to Colleen and porking Mrs. Hodges!!!  Kay Chancellor forgot she had another child and -- surprise!! -- it's JILL!!  It was just one disaster after another.  And the ratings reflected it.  It was as though a twelve-year-old boy was the head writer.   

By the time Lyn Marie Latham pranced onto the scene with her reliquaries, there was nowhere to go but up!  Miss Latham, however, figured out a way to go down even farther.  And so have all her successors.        

Supposedly Ed Scott was responsible for most of the casting choices during that time but I think Alden got most of the blame. I know Scott was responsible somehow for Alex Donnellys departure.

What did you think of the Newman vs Jabot takeover stuff during that time? I always think while it was a great umbrella story with jabot finally returning to the Abbott’s after ten years and going toe to toe with Newman, I can’t help be bothered by Victoria and Nicks attitudes towards Jack wanting to takeover their fathers company considering they both loved him like a father when he was married to Nikki and I thought had some understanding of why Jack sought vengeance against for Victor did with Jabot. I guess them being more groomed to be apart of their fathers legacy sparked that attitude but I just hate how they just brushed aside how supportive of a stepfather and even stepmother Jack and Ashley were to them when they were younger. Even Neil becoming Victors gopher and wanting to help him smear jabot again doesn’t sit right with me because John Abbott brought him on, and I feel that’s throwing that gratitude back in his face for aiding with the enemy. 

Just now, Broderick said:

In her verbal interview with Archive of American Television, Jeanne Cooper indicates that Bill Bell was nowhere in sight when she auditioned for the role of Kay Chancellor.  She said John Conboy called her, she eventually came in, and she read for John Conboy and that female producer whose name I can't ever remember.  

Possibly, John Conboy overnighted Bill Bell a tape of the audition to his apartment in Chicago, but it wasn't mentioned if he did.

My feeling is Bill Bell was involved (heavily) in the initial casting of the Brooks and Foster families, but after that, casting was handled by John Conboy and that girl. 

I believe John Conboy, as the executive producer, had the ultimate authority to hire & fire people.  Ditto for Wes Kenney.  Once those two executive producers were gone, Bill Bell made sure he ALWAYS had an executive producer credit, making him the ultimate decision-maker on matters like that.  

Was it Patricia Wenig?  

8 minutes ago, kalbir said:

EB wrote in his book that he did not have a very good relationship w/ John Conboy. In many articles/interviews EB has credited both Bill Bell and H. Wesley Kenney for his decision to stay on Y&R.

Thanks! I always wondered. I bet Conboy was not aiming for Braeden to continue staying on. Obviously it makes sense Bell and Kenney get the credit as Victor became really who he was u under  them around 1982. 

1 minute ago, soapfan770 said:

At @Paul Raven thanks for sharing, I remember seeing this somewhere before, maybe back 500 pages in this thread lol.

The Scott Adams character is only mentioned the 1978 synopsis. Snapper set up Nikki with the young intern only on  Casey's permission. Nikki couldn't believe he wasn't just interested in her body and felt she was no good to him; Scott convinced her she could be the woman for him if she could change, if she really wanted to. Nikki tried her best with Scott until she slept with her college professor for a grade. Nikki almost dropped out and was going leave town but Brock convinced her to stay in town and in college. Scott is never mentioned in the 1979 synopsis at all; I’m going to guess Stauffer never shared scenes with MTS in the role of Nikki.

Interesting situation, sounds like typical Conboy diva behavior. But it sounds like Scott’s story pretty much ended and was only a minor character with nowhere else to go. 
 

Interestingly Stauffer later appeared again on Y&R in 1987 in another minor role must have been no hard feelings. 

If sticking to the script was such a “must” for conboy I wonder how he and Braeden got along those two years together.  

13 hours ago, BoldRestless said:

They obviously replaced the music during Nina and Ryan's dance, but the tune in the original doesn't sound like a famous song.

Yeah in the original episode, Ryan and Nina dance to a Celine Dion song, which gets changed during that scene.

2 hours ago, fivethej said:

Anyone know the air date?

 

April 14, 1994  

2 hours ago, Bright Eyes said:

Anyone know J. Eddie Peck's first airdate as Cole? I'm seeing April 2, but different places say 1992 and 1993.

April 2, 1993