Cat

Cordelia was my favourite Buffy/Angel character.

I feel like gif-ing this joint up! Apologies, Cheap, for stealing a page out of your book.

Thanks. So a bunch of last-minute sort if apologies ("I'm sowwy you were offended") await. God, this season. It barely deserves a two-part reunion as it is.

JP, I never said Lisa was the poor innocent victim in all this -- Lisa as victim is not why I like her. Did she do the tabloid stunt? probably. but none us know for sure. If she did, it doesn't make her a very nice friend. But I also recall at Palm Springs Lisa going to talk to Kyle and tell her she felt bad for her. Like she finally realized how much it was hurting her and that she was sorry it got to this. And Yes I feel sorry for her for the ambush. Same as I felt sorry for Kyle in PS. Maybe because it made me sick to the stomach to watch the relish in the VTs from the others today. And to see Lisa slowly realize exactly what was going to happen. I can't hate on her for walking away and not being able to face the take-down. Quite honestly, all this hand wringing, anguish, shaking and clutching the breast... For what? Because Lisa is talking to Kyle in the phone? Because Lisa knew Scheana before she met Brandi? Bcause Lisa may or may not have put tabloids in Brandi's suitcase? It is all so overwrought and extra. If it hadn't been that, it would have been something else. Those women were determined to find something, anything, to bring Lisa down in the eyes of the audience. Their intentions were not as pure as they pretended -- Lisa's weren't either but if they are going to pick on one, they should own up to the other. They were so keen on making her utterly evil and look like the wronged party! They were all playing victim, and not always convincingly. Well, they got some ammo that they cobbled together and got her. Now what? If Lisa were to admit she is this terrible person they say she is, what next? It's ironic, really, because after S2 when Kyle went after Lisa, she started boohooing about "I said I'm sorry! What more does Lisa want?!" She just couldn't comprehend that just saying sowwy (on a VT) wasn't enough to make it all go away and make her the heroine again. Brandi has been backtracking too in her statements, saying "I love Lisa really!" like that's going to make things all better. And when Lisa doesn't reciprocate, it becomes more ammo, i.e.: See how mean Lisa is? She won't forgive us! She wants to bring us down! I don't know what they expect her to do, quite frankly. She's damned if she does (Lisa is untrustworthy! She has an agenda!) and damned if she doesn't. As for Ken, like I said before, did you expect him to sit back and let Lisa take it by herself? His first instinct was to defend his wife. He wasn't out of line in calling out Kim for not bothering to turn up to Pandora's wedding (moving, my eye!). He prob shouldn't have called Yolanda stupid, but belittling all the women? Yeah, no. Mauricio would have done the same -- in fact he has, when drunken Kim shouted at Kyle in Hawaii. TBH I really can't defend anymore, i'm exhausted debating tabloids and Scheana and this whole show. The superficial details feel like a storm in a teacup. The fact of the matter is, the others are trying to blackball Lisa off the show. I'm sure it will boost the ratings but the whole sorry mess has tarnished the franchise for me, and I can't really cheer people like Yolanda, Brandi, Kim and Kyle smugly and self-righteously 'bring down' someone I actually once enjoyed. I don't think anybody is in the right, but certainly not those four, and if the show is going to be all "The wonderful exploits of Saint Yolanda, Tragic Kim, Plucky Heroine Kyle and Truth Cannon Brandi" from here on in, I can't buy into that. Personally speaking. As for the rest... It's absolutely not personal, jp, just my opinion, and I'm not going to break up with you about it! lol Ok, it's late for me and a shiteous and potentially job- destructing day awaits me tomorrow. I'm gonna try and get some sleep. xxx

With RHoBH, the audience is so polarized that everyone is going to believe what they want to believe. It's like people who choose to watch Fox News or MSNBC. They want to see their own opinions validated and transmitted back to them. How can you argue with your own gut feeling?! To a lesser extent, RHoBH this season has given validation to the Lisa supporters and validation to the Lisa haters. IMO, the episode radiated creeping dread from the moment it started... the dread that an ambush was being planned and put into motion. Most women maybe recognize that feeling from high school. The dread of a circle of friends turning against you, bitching about you when you are barely out of earshot, walking away from you like you are contagious because they are not ready to full-on confront you -- yet. The tension tightens into a knot of anxiety in your stomach where you can barely think of anything else. It builds and builds until the point when they decide, finally, to talk and it's like fighting off a kettle of vultures all of sudden as the accusations come thick and fast, and you are second-guessing yourself and barely able to think, and you feel sick to your stomach and just want to run away. That's what I saw and why I felt so badly for Lisa. Lisa felt ganged up on, and that's why she walked away. She walked away because she didn't want them to see her break. She walked away because she wanted to show them that she doesn't care what they say, that she doesn't need them. When, in fact, she cares very much. On the beach, Yolanda started to talk to Lisa about “Brandi feels/Brandi says this and that.” Well, then, this is Brandi's fight, not yours, Yolemons, and you should let B speak for herself. Lispy is a grown ass woman! She had no trouble confronting Lisa about Scheana in the bus on the way to dinner. Why couldn't she talk to her in plain daylight on the beach? No, Trashbox had to talk to everybody else first, namely Yol and Kim who lapped it all up like cream. Yolanda’s talking heads, which sounded reasonable at first, became increasingly smug and self-righteous, and I didn’t like that. She was relishing in it. At the beach, the argument centered on How dare Lisa become BFFs with Kyle? How dare she host a party for both Ken and Mauricio? I don't know what to say about this incredible non-issue except that it is the definition of tits on an ant. Lisa and Kyle are pretending to build bridges while remaining at arm's length. How is that a sign of Lisa’s insidiousness? Why isn’t Kyle getting called out for agreeing to host a party with a woman she badmouthed in all her VTs? Then there are the tabloids. Did or did Lisa not put the tabloids in Brandi's suitcase? This is a clear case of she said/she said. We have no way of knowing "for sure" who is lying. Again, we are going to believe what we want to believe. I personally go back and forth on whether Lisa did it. When Kyle asked her, point-blank, at the beach, Lisa answered her directly and told her she didn't -- "of course I didn't." There was no deflection. I believed her. In the bus, Brandi talked with her about Scheana, Lisa denied that she was personally close to Scheana, certainly not as close as she felt with Brandi. I believed her. I also believed her when she whispered to Brandi that she loved her and wouldn’t do that to her. But, at the dinner, her hemming and hawing made her look really bad. To be fair, Ken was talking so much that she could barely speak herself. She told him to shush a number of times. My opinion? She saw the tabloids at Brandi's, probably made a joke about bringing them to Palm Springs. But I also think Brandi embellished the part about Lisa forcibly putting them in Brandi's luggage two or three times. Like I said, I have no proof that it turned out this way. But Lisa was so hurt about being accused by the women that I felt it was more than just guilt at ‘getting caught.’ I felt sorry for Mauricio who must be so over all this [!@#$%^&*] raising questions over his ethics. As for Kyle… FINALLY. Finally, Kyle is playing the role she was BORN to play! That of the eternal, put-upon victim. I have to hand it to Kyle this year. She took a step back, let others come to her for advice and with potentially explosive gossip, was careful never to appear overly plotting and spiteful (except in her VTs) and now she can play the wronged heroine who still, after all this, is willing to forgive!! What a kind, giving woman Kyle is. This really has been her season. Kim... uh, I have nothing to say about that rude, desperate, cringeworthy attack dog que habla español como una gringa maleducada. Trashbox? Inconsistent. Already backpeddaling big-time on everything she said. Can’t believe she is currently giving interviews saying she “still loves Pumpy.” Don’t say you’re my friend; act like one. Wait, so this isn't the season finale after all? When is this [!@#$%^&*] going to end?! No Lisa in PR, huh. A preview of things to come? I wouldn't be surprised if LIsa bows out after this. So, here it is, ladies and gentlemen! Your fab new RHoBH! Kim's wacky, "spontaneous" hijinks... "Truth-telling" Brandi giggling into her after she throws you under the bus... Kyle playing tearful victim over and over.... Bring on next season.

To clarify: I was saying that Peter looked somewhat good in his white suit, but I am not Team Peter all of a sudden. His attitude towards people, especially his wife, is lousy. Not to mention the shady stuff he may or may not have been up to involving Apollo. But he had a right to express his feelings to Nene about her behaviour at the charity event. It's not about Fight Night. I wish Nene could see that Peter is not Team Kenya by any stretch. She doesn't want to hear any criticism whatsoever and it is ruining her position on the show. She is only giving Kenya more ammo with which to attack her.

I was kind of... disappointed by the drama on RHOA this week. Having said that, the Mexico trip looks like it is going to be bananas. Not because of the Porsha-Kordell stuff (snore -- next!), but at the way Apollo eyed Kenya's booty good and long while his wife is with him on this vacation. WTF? Apollo is in full self-destruct mode! Confession time: this episode was the first time I felt an inkling of attraction towards fledgling Uncle Ben impersonator, Peter Thomas. Don't hate me! Papa Smurf was looking fine in that pressed white suit and checked shirt. And the way he kissed Cynthia. And the way he was flirting with Nene to break her down! You know Nene has always had a giant crush on Peter, don't you? It's been obvious for years. That's probably why she was so mad that he, quite reasonably, called her out on her behavior last week. Gregg drinks out of a toilet mug? WTF? That says a lot. I go back and forth on Nene's wig. Sometimes it's like George Washington fell out of his saddle and the horse got the wig around its ears. I'm not sure Nene is a long-hair kind of girl. Short and sassy suits her better. The fact that Kenya is still "admitting" to "her part" in the fight where Apollo beat the living [!@#$%^&*] out of Brandon is absolutely crazy. Has Apollo apologized to anybody for his thug behavior yet?! OK, so clearly Kenya and Marlo were trying to get a reaction out of Nene this whole episode. Kenya is playing Nene so well at the moment, I'm worried she is going to play one hand too many and it is all going to go downhill from here. BTW, Kenya planning a couples trip to Mexico AND inviting Phaedra & Apollo is ridiculous. Marlo is so diva and I would love it if she were made a fulltime HW. However, she shouldn't be surprised that Nene went ballistic when she showed up on Team twirl and then started baiting Nene. Of course Nene ended falling into the trap and having her tantrum and taking her brie maes posse with her. Nene's need to be Queen Bee at all times has gotten pathological at this point. This Bailey Bowl nonsense, sigh. I love how once Nene left, the BB just whimpered, lay down and died a quick death. No point in maintaining the pretense of this event now that Nene has stomped off.

"Vancouver's a goldmine, and I love to go digging." BEST HOUSEWIVES TAGLINE EVER.

I loved Dina so much back in the day. But I am wondering if her time has passed. RHONJ is so different from what it once was. IMO the Gorga invasion infected it. i also think Dina blacklisting a bunch if her brothers and sisters because one of the brothers chose not to get married on her cheapass House Party show was not particularly classy. And if Caroline or JacqueCray are not going to be around, what's the point? But you are SO RIGHT about Danielle. That wonky-boobed vixen made RHONJ a juggernaut. So much smarter than the brain power of Caroline, Jacqueline and Teresa combined ( though that is no big feat), she played them all like violins. I wish she was back to toy with that awful On Display creature. IMO Melissa should have been kicked off the show last season. And I don't know if I want to tune in to NJ anymore. They really lost me over the past few years. And now that Melissa and Teresa are going to be pretending to by biffles.... Yech. Don't really want to see Spray-on Hair either.

I've said for a long time that B&B should have a Persian fashionista in its cast. RHOBH would be an even better place for a wealthy Persian socialite! Am I right in hearing that it is Nene vs Marlo in tonight's RHOA?

I guess what I'm saying is that Brandi might be angling for some extra credit from Lisa and perhaps even compensation for what she sees as her contribution to VPR. Just a guess, though the fact that Brandi hasn't drunk-tweeted anything about it doesn't help my case. I honestly think the ladies see Lisa's time spent on VPR an issue. Whether its the fact that she got the spinoff and Kyle didn't, or the fact that she didn't male some BH events because she was too busy, or the fact that she got Brandi to interact with Scheana, and had that dinner party at Villa Blanca. The feeling is that VPR interfered in some way. It took away some of Lisa's focus and attention. Brandi certainly feels used in some way for the sake of the spinoff.

Amen! And you can absolutely speak for me! Was going to get sniffy about being cast as Yolanda given my fab avatar (!!) but I get it. Sometimes I can be longwinded and lecture-y about der vonders of European living, my luvs.

Who is Car? lol The friendship trinity! So perfect. I miss it too (both the BH and the SON one). However, unlike BH, we agree to disagree and can still be cool with each other. It's not the first time we have had differences of opinion, and I still adore you jp you know that! My thoughts on Brandi's daily changing motivations are that part of it is bts money/production motivations (to do with VPR). And part of it is longing for affirmation from Lisa. But the VPR stuff is the great unsaid this season, the elephant in the room. Unfortunately, I doubt Andy went there at Reunion. I am rapidly losing faith in Andy and his team to rein in these women or actually deal with issues that stem directly from bts decisions made by Bravo and production. This is why so many HWs are citing production as an excuse on Twitter and other places. Some want to force the issue into the open, others mention it because they know they can get away with it because Andy will never address it on WWHL or reunion. Contrast that with Mob Wives when the wives put the producers on the spot last reunion, and Jennifer Graziano had to run on set unexpectedly to admit that she did indeed play Carla against Renee behind the scenes.

I can't stop ROTFLMAO at this jpeg!

Yes, when it comes down to it, Adrienne was blindsided in a really bad way (and didn't Kyle set it all up for Brandi to tell the secret on camera? That particular chess move has never, ever been discussed since). However, sometimes that is the risk when you sign up to this -- people go digging into your past. People drop zingers when the cameras are around. It's like Taylor and Russell thinking they could appear on the show and keep the abuse under wraps. When Adrienne started threatening and suing Bravo and accusing people of slander and then going to InTouch and admitting that it was all true... well, she ended up digging her own grave, no? IA that Brandi could move on from Yolanda if she finds another rich female benefactor... except that Yolanda's probably the best she's going to get now. I think she will want to stay on Yol's good side, although at the moment that is also showing signs of wear after Yol's WWHL appearance.

Who knows? Maybe on Monday's episode there will be irrefutable proof that Lisa went to the tabloids with lies about Kyle's marriage. That she colluded with Brandi to harass Kyle about it on camera. That's what Kyle, Brandi, etc., want, isn't it? To show Lisa up as a hypocrite who denied Adrienne's accusation that Lisa fed information to Radar Online but may have been doing it all along? That's what they've been hinting at for ages -- we (the audience) do not know the 'real' Lisa, we have been taken in by a fraud, but now we will see! And we will understand. If that is the implication, though, I'm surprised Bravo hasn't released more details or teasers to talk up the finale. Queen Lisa is brought down! Instead, all we are getting on the blogs is lots of daily She Said/She Said stuff. Given that the ladies are still going at it on Twitter a week after reunion was filmed says to me that nothing was actually put to rest once and for all.

LOL, NBA. Your post was pretty righteous. But I feel bad for coming down on JP like that. Even though I know he can more than amply defend his corner. LOL, this is what Lisa provokes in me. Lisa made me do it! Now I know how Brandi feels. Obviously we all have better things to do IRL than to defend some HWs featured on a cable show, but, heck, I post fairly regularly on a soap board so it's prob too late for that logic, lol.

LOL, that's not what we are saying. I can see how Lisa's playing of the game would piss them off. I can see it. But you have to acknowledge the naked jealousy of a lot of the other HWs as being a spark lighting the fuse of going after Lisa. That jealousy has fuelled Kyle the eternal victim since season 2 and has now spread. RHOBH has been very polarizing this season and it is reflected on this board. It really is Team Lisa vs Team Others (Team BraYoKyle? Team BrOKe?). I personally don't think I have ever felt so invested in a particular HW as much as I have with Lisa, so ready to defend her, so sensitive to criticism of her, lol. I have my faves on other franchises but I sort of take them as they come. With Lisa, it is pretty unconditional. And I still think Ken is only defending his wife against the petty manipulations of the other HWs trying to discredit her (and trying to get her to discredit herself). What is he supposed to do? Sit back and applaud them? We will see what happens on Monday's episode...

You have a crush on David Gebbia? LOL Not going to hate because I used to have a crush on Italian American homeboys, too. I still think Chris Laurita of RHONJ is insanely hot. Can't blame Ken for defending his wife and I have no clue if he is the one who starts it, though Ken Todd has never struck me as a shitstirrer or volatile starter of fights, ever. If anything, Kim is the one who comes off as a hectoring old bore determined to climb aboard the I Hate Lisa wagon with all the others. DF, you know I agree with every last word of your post. Right down to the jealousy over VPR. VPR is at the root of a lot of this. As for Yolanda and Muhammed, Mo's steady defence of Lisa must be behind some of her resentment, too. As you say, I don't think their relationship is as perfect as it appears on TV, though for a divorced couple it is very, very good.

I envy you that you got to watch all that for the first time! Scary Island was so awesome. It was like... hallucinogenic! Pregnant-face Bethenny: "Bye, loon!" That line still makes me LMAO. As do the faces of Ramona, Alex and Bethenny when they are having pedicures and hear Jill's voice from afar. Jill: "Coo-eeee! Hey goylzzzzzzzzzz! Miss me?" Ramona: Bethenny: Alex: Though I have to disagree about Kelly "bringing the fun." In s4, neither she nor Bravo want to address her obvious mental break in s3, so it's lots of "OMG! I'm so fun! Light! Normal! Wooooooooo! Nothing to see here." I was relieved when they finally bounced her from the show. Not only is she probably bipolar (which is nobody's fault, but they have meds for that), but she is a mean, superficial, brainless twit. The way she goes in on Alex at s4 reunion is just awful. And when she lectured Sonja on what a nice person she is because (get this) Cosmo voted her one of the Top 50 Nicest Celebrities! Sonja's response was amazeballs.

Yes, ideally, everybody shows for reunion, including the husbands including Apollo. Brandon needs to come too, and Christufuh. In fact, Part 1 should be devoted to the fight in of itself. Andy better be ready to replay clips again and again of Kenya "charging" Natalie and of Brandon being held back?/held down? by Peter. Oh, and they need to bring security so that things dn't degenerate into a hot mess again. If Apollo and Brandon decide to get into it, well Andy Cohen alone won't be able to stop them. We can get onto the Apollo sexting in Part 2, and the charity event mess, Nene walking, and this is when Marlo needs to make her grand entrance again. Part 3 for the leftovers. ETA: don't know how well this worked for the Shahs of Sunset, but do you think Reunion needs to be done at dinner? I don't, but I remember in Savannah the way everybody calmed down and got along when they put dinner together.

This RHoA legal mess is getting shadier and shadier. Apollo is going to bring everybody down that he can. At this point, I wouldn't be surprised if Phaedra forgoes Reunion, citing preparation for this trial as an excuse. She might even say she can't be in the same room as Cynthia and Peter for legal reasons. It's such a shame because RHoA has had one of its best seasons yet, but the momentum has built so fast that it has almost careened out of control. Obviously the pajama party was where everything went apeshit, but Apollo's legal issues (not to mention Nene's supposed "me or her" ultimatums) are such that I worry that RHoA is burning itself out and on the point of implosion. Reassure me, everybody!

So now Nene and Kenya are attached to a dodgy charity which defrauded the IRS and is possibly a front for something else? OMG, ratchet. Some of these RHWs are drawn to dishonest or unreliable schemes like moths to a flame!

Yeah, and then she goes "I apologize for being tricked by a horrible hater!!" That is basically the gist of her next few sentences. To be fair, the blog is fairly well defended in that she trots out some facts, but I think Nene has surrounded herself with Yes people and doesn't want to hear constructive criticism or tjat she is wrong. This means that she is going to make some wrongheaded decisions, if she hasn't already. Look at the way she shades her long time friend Lexis. Contrast that with Kandi who has people in her life (Todd, Carmon, Mama Joyce) who often push back at her and tell her stuff she doesn't like to hear. But she listens to what they have to say and even with Mama Joyce doesn't shut them down. She is able to weigh up all the opinions and options, and not just dismiss everybody who tells her "No" out of hand as a 'hater.'

I don't think Yo was outright trashing Lisa last season tbh. I think she made a remark that was blunt, but not a whole bitchfest like Tweedledum and Tweedledee made out. T&T jumped on something fairly innocuous (Lisa doesn't like to be criticized) and ran with it at Reunion.